Ask HN: I will help your startup in exchange for food and a place to stay

[codeornocode]

Hello,

This my third and final time posting this post, first time it was labeled as spam and the second time someone suggested that i edit it and so i did.

I have 4 years remaining in my U.S visa, each visit i can stay 6 months, i don't want to break any U.S rules that's why i want to code for your startup for no money, just food and a place to live in transportation would be nice too but i am not going to take money from you and i am not going to ask your for health insurance or be your employee, i don't want to break any rules, i have +8 years of experience in JS, PHP, Ruby mainly as a full stack web developer i also do game development using Unity3D + C#, i'm a Musician since over 15 years at my free time and i can design sounds and soundtracks i work with many DAWs, i'm bilingual i speak fluent Arabic and English beside having many more skills.

I am doing this because i live in a war torn country, some issues happened and i've lost all my savings, I'm 31 years old and i don't want to spend the rest of my life in this place, i've been to California in 2014 and i loved it so much, i can't get an H1B visa because i don't have a university degree although i have a high school diploma and a college diploma in business management and e-commerce.

If you'd like to interview me please send me an e-mail to [e-mail], thank you.

Thank you for reading my post.

ps: Please if you can't help me at least try not to be negative in the comments i already have enough negativity going on in my life and i could really really use some motivation, but after all you are free to write whatever you want of course and i appreciate it.

One more thing, thank you "dang" for telling me about the spam filter and helping me.

[gmazzotti]

Why U.S.? I understand that you don´t want to live in your country, but there are many others countries. Many of them has a much flexible immigration system where you can live legally if you find a job and where there are many jobs opportunities if you know how to code. I mean, instead of working almost illegally for free in the U.S., you can be legally and earning good money in another country. I´m from Uruguay and this will work here (also, you will have health insurance, as it is mandatory in any job of any type. Also, it is common that tech companies hire forgeries that don´t know Spanish, as most people know English, is not a problem). I know that this is also the case in many other countries.

[nokya]

Your comment makes a lot of sense and yes, the visa hassles are obviously the most logical reasons why any "foreigner technology worker" should try working elsewhere than in the US. But you know what? I don't think they can "hear" you.

Let's face it, for many countries, the US is still seen as dreamland, in particular to those many who don't connect the dots between the root cause of the problems in their homeland and the 30% tax that will be taken away from their income once they start working in the US.

This dreamland illusion is so strong that even the locals believe it. I have to deal with this on a monthly basis at the border custom patrol: the officers constantly stop me at the border and investigate me with tons of questions aiming at evaluating whether or not I am trying to "sneak into the country to steal work from honest US citizens" (sic). Every time, I am treated like a lost soul who's dreaming of working in the US (and who's very probably a criminal considering my skin color). Last time I crossed the border I was even warned that my passport doesn't show proof that I left the US, it only shows every time I entered it so technically, they don't know if I am staying there more than 90 days. How do you respond to this without being insulting? The thing is: I hate the idea of working in the US so much that I can't even talk honestly about what I feel fearing I would be arrested.

So, yes, "why US?", you asked the right question. But these guys are living in the exact same illusion than the US citizens are: "Our country is the best place in the world, the only place you're free of your opinions and where you can become a billionaire." The illusion is so strong they would even work for free...for free...for free...for free...

You can't do much against this.

[eigenvector]

Seriously, this is the most helpful comment on here. OP, I understand the psychological pull of America, and perhaps it is the first Western country you have visited, but it is not worth it to work illegally (as you are proposing, even if no money changes hands) in America.

You may improve your life temporarily but it will all come crashing down one day when the immigration authorities catch up to you. You will be deported and banned from re-entering the US. There are many developed countries where someone with your skills can obtain a temporary work visa easily. You can live and work freely and legally, get on your feet financially and maybe attend university there to help you get into the US legally in the future.

Maybe it will help if you tell us where your citizenship is and we can help you with suggestions of other developed countries that will allow you to come for a 1-2 year temporary work visa.

[sumedh]

OP should look at Australia, I think he will probably pass the 60 point requirements for Australian skilled PR visa.

[jagermo]

In addition to the comment:

You need a "blue card" to work to work in the EU, its comparable to the US Green Card, but (i think) easier to get. From the Wikipedia-Article (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Card_(European_Union)) :

Acquisition of Blue Card has several requirements. The applicant must have a work contract or binding job offer with a salary of at least 1.5 times the average gross annual salary paid in the Member State. A Blue Card acquirer must present a valid travel document (and in specific cases a valid residence permit or a national long-term visa) and documents proving the relevant higher professional qualification.

Here is more information regarding Germany (but it is from 2008): http://www.wohin-auswandern.de/blue-card-en

To be honest, the salary probably won't be a problem, with your expertise you should be able to land a pretty decent job.

[rattray]

Question to HN: What are the easiest countries for people from <anywhere> to move to as a software developer? Eg; easiest visa rules, there are companies hiring, people aren't egregiously racist?

[mchaver]

Singapore is another good option. I believe it has a pretty straight forward work visa system. Also a growing number of startups. Here are some job boards:

http://www.startupjobs.asia/

http://e27.co/jobs

https://angel.co/singapore/jobs

[iamcurious]

Uruguay was one of the countries I was thinking of in my other comment. So I second this.

Also, gmazzotti, I believe you wanted to say "foreigners" instead of "forgeries".

[keerthiko]

I can relate to the OP, and there's something about once you've lived and worked in the software industry in California, that leaves a void that can't by filled by working in any other country. There's a value for and energy for the work that is never quite reached in any other tech ecosystem. It's really hard to put into words. I grew up in the Middle East, and am an Indian citizen. After my 7 years of studying+working in software in the US, and then having to leave due to similar visa issues, I was never as satisfied with working on software from a variety of other countries (Singapore, Korea, Oman, India, etc).

[NicoJuicy]

If you want to work without problems, Isn't Europe the steadier solution? I'm from Belgium fyi and Belgium is currently re-enabling "shelters" where fugutives of war can reside/stay.

[hackaflocka]

On paper Uruguay has an amazing proposition for potential immigrants (and loved your ex-President with his humble lifestyle). However, only about 3,000 immigration visas are being granted each month from what I've heard, which is way lower than the demand for them.

[platita]

There really needs to be more transparency to how US compares to other destinations. https://medium.com/digital-nomad-stories/the-fading-american...

[titomc]

I am an Indian national on H1B with a top company in US. By all means please do not come to US with H1B. The U.S. has broken immigration system. My visa is locked down to my employer and I cannot ask for a raise or get promoted. I accepted the lowest payment as per DOL from my employer just to stay and work in US with my 6 year H1B validity. By all means apply for a Canada work visa. They have now something called Express Entry system. You can also apply for permanent residency. US immigration system is broken and they are not going to fix it anytime soon. Immigrate to Canada. H1B is indentured servitude.

I have started my Express Entry application and very soon I will say goodbye to US , I don't mind the cold in Canada. I will have freedom to change jobs, won't be an indentured servant. I will also get permanent residency fast. US green card for Indian citizen is around 10 years backlogged.

I suggest it's best for you to apply for the Canadian Express Entry for skilled workers.

[burnte]

I'm sorry you're having such a bad experience here, I really am. As an American, you're right, our immigration system is horribly broken; ten years for a green card is average for most immigrants, if not fast for many. US firms, especially tech firms, use H1B to do exactly what you said, acquire people who are effectively indentured servants. Don't like it? Go back to your home country. Don't want to accept the bottom-basement pay? Someone else will, there are plenty of non-Americans to exploit!

And at the same time they lobby the Congress for an increase in H1B visas claiming there aren't enough US workers, they send out ads asking for ten years experience in HTML5 and CPU design, offering $30k for an "entry level" position, and say they can't find anyone here to fill it. Of course not, your requirements are insane and the wage is equally insane.

Yes, there are plenty of companies using H1B ethically, but for every ethical H1B, there are 5 unethical ones. It's a disservice to both American workers AND foreign workers.

PS: I'm not anti-immigration. I'm very much pro-immigration. What's that? You're intelligent, hard working, and want to come to my country to work your butt off and get rich? COME ON OVER! All I want is an immigration system that's fair to everyone, both those coming in to get a fair shake and have protections, and those of us already here, preventing immigrants from being used as cheap replacement labor.

[throwawayL1]

Sorry for the hijack, but am in a different boat of confusion. I have 6 years experience in tech and I've been offered an L1 to transfer to Bay Area with a salary of 145k USD along with a comprehensive medical insurance.

I am not really sure if I should be taking this up considering the ridiculous cost of living in the Bay. Also, I don't know how much I'll be saving at the end of 2 years considering the fact that my wife will be travelling along with me (she doesn't have a STEM degree).

Although there are these cost of living calculators they just take into account a lifestyle that is 'just enough' to get by.

[thepredestrian]

Hi there

I do have some questions regarding working/living in the Canada. Is there an email I can reach out to you for some questions and advice? Would appreciate it. Cheers

[nish1500]

Indian here. I wanted to try for H1B, but after studying the waiting period, conditions under H1B employment, it makes so much sense to go to Canada instead.

[rounak]

I thought H1Bs weren't locked to employers. Can't you transfer the visa?

[arihant]

If you have 8 years of experience, wait till you get 9 years. If you do, then even if you have a year of college, you can qualify for H1B. Typically, 3 years of experience equals 1 year of college. As is popular myth, a college degree or education is not a requirement that is set in stone for H1B.

Also, money or not, if you're working in US in capacity that usually someone would get compensated for, even for a company outside the US, you need to have work permit in the country.

If I were you I would look for jobs within Middle East like Qatar, UAE. Jobs related to tech are there, US universities are there, and the requirements with immigration are basically "if employer wants you get in." Rack up a few years of experience, then getting H1B would be viable.

[codeornocode]

Thank you for your help and information.

[rattray]

Yeah, I second this. I've never been to the Middle East and I haven't heard the best things about living/working there as a foreigner, but it's absolutely doable - I knew a couple guys in Nepal who would go to Saudi Arabia and Dubai for work (cattle ranches or something), visa and all. Other folks from India and other places who would go for tech work, engineering, etc - all over the Middle East (even Oman) and it's not so bad. There are stable, thriving economies there.

[coryl]

How do you prove that you have 9 years experience?

[davnicwil]

You seem a highly skilled and driven individual whose talents would be savoured, and rewarded with good money, by many companies in many different countries around the world.

Do not work for free.

Once more, please, do not work for free.

1. You don't have to work for free, far from it. You have in-demand skills and experience in a global job market. You can make really good money in many, many desirable locations around the world.

2. I would be extremely wary of anyone who would take you up on the basis you're proposing. Anyone who would give you such 'charity'[1] may have very questionable morals - 'oh sure, I'll take this desperate[2] man's skills, make potentially a LOT of money off of him without giving him his due reward, and that's completely fine with me, because that's what he said he wanted'. Imagine the sort of person who would utter such a sentence - do you want to tie your livelihood for the next however many years to such a person? I'm sure you know, there is a whole class of criminal activity in developed countries which exploits illegal immigrants based around this very premise. DO NOT put yourself on that path.

3. Never put yourself at the mercy of any one person or organisation for your survival. Your current situation is awful, but what kind of life would that be to move to? How will you feel waking up in a morning in a bed someone is letting you sleep in, eating some food they gave you for breakfast, then going to work all day only to guarantee an evening meal and bed when you return home. Repeating every day for a long time. That is not a life.

[1] That's what they might justify it as, at least. The reality is the opposite.

[2] I really don't mean to offend here, I know that's not what you are, at your core. But that's how they will see you, and that's the position you will put yourself in and indeed what you will become by following such a path.

[rattray]

I don't think `davnicwil` is wrong here, but I do think it's overly negative. A lot of immigrants through the course of history have fled truly terrible situations and ended up in pretty bad situations where they were disadvantaged, but at least able to get their feet on the ground and build something up.

I agree that I would guess you can do better, especially looking at other countries (there are so many out there! and wonderful people everywhere). But worse comes to worse, don't be afraid that the sky will fall down on you if you can't find better than this arrangement. Just keep working hard and leaping for better (and do keep your eyes peeled as there absolutely could be people who would take advantage of you).

[crypted]

Thanks, what an inspiring reply.

[Zombieball]

Not trying to be negative, but my understanding has always been that U.S. immigrations doesn't care whether or not money exchanges hands. If you are doing work that a U.S. citizen would normally get paid for you are still technically "taking a job" from a local.

While I am sure there are conditions that will allow you to come and stay in the country, I would be careful what your arrangement is with any potential startup and how it is worded.

Perhaps another individual on HN has more insight into U.S. visa rules and can provide better guidance?

Good luck nonetheless!

[pdabbadabba]

I also very much hope you find some way of working things out, but there is another thing you should be aware of:

> just food and a place to live in transportation would be nice too but i am not going to take money from you and i am not going to ask your for health insurance or be your employee, i don't want to break any rules

There is a good chance that, as well as raising immigration law issues, this arrangement could also cause your non-employer to violate federal and state minimum wage laws.

I second the advice of others who suggest consulting an immigration attorney. This is a challenging and important problem, and it really demands the advice of a professional. If you don't think you can afford one you should: 1) schedule an initial consultation with a good immigration attorney anyway. You should get at least this first conversation for free. (And beware: there are many truly awful immigration attorneys. Do a little research.) 2) Look to see if there are any law schools in your area that have immigration law clinics. They may well take your case for free and, although you will be assisted by law students, they will be supervised closely by faculty and will probably provide you with very good advice.

Good luck.

[stingraycharles]

Just as a bit of anecdata, I know New Zealand considers WWOOF'ing [1], in which you get accomodation and food in exchange for work, as actual work with compensation, so you need a work visa.

[1] http://wwoofinternational.org

[OSButler]

Can't speak for the US, but this is the case in Canada.

I sponsored s.o. for their permanent resident visa and we were told to wait until the status has been approved before any kind of work can be done. The immigration hotline mentioned that volunteer work would be possible during that time, but it would still require an application from the employer. It took the employer a few days to get all the paperwork sorted out and 2 weeks later the application was denied, leaving everyone a bit disappointed & furious about all the wasted time and promised opportunities on both sides.

Generally speaking: even if you do work as a volunteer, the kind of work you're going to do is most likely s.th. that should either be paid for or could be done by a local resident/citizen. If the US system is anything like the Canadian one, then you'll still get in trouble if they figure out that you've been working, even if it's for free/volunteer work.

[khnd]

yup. I've been denied entry into the states to volunteer at a tech conference because it would've been "taking a job" from a local.

[cma]

Many hostels overseas offer this arrangement and it is totally legal through some kind of room-and-board exception, but I'm not sure about the US.

[onlyrealcuzzo]

Also, indentured servitude is frowned upon.

[steven2012]

Unfortunately this is most certainly in violation of immigration laws. And chances are at some point, you will be banned from entering the US for a minimum of 10 years. I actually know 2 people that this happened to, one of them a personal friend of mine. Immigration/Customs officials do not need proof to ban you, all they need to do is suspect it. If you enter the US with no plan, no money, etc, they will suspect, rightfully so, that you are working in violation of your visa and you will get banned on the spot, especially if you visit so often.

My suggestion is to not do this. Enter as a tourist and enjoy your time in the US. If you want to work in the US, do it legally. Do work on an open source project and try to network and get a job that that way. Maybe try to join a huge company like Google or Facebook from abroad and transfer. That's your best way, especially if you get an L1 visa.

[bobosha]

I suspect you are on a BUsiness (B-1?) visa and what you propose to do, even if no cash exchanges hands is considered compensation and therefore employment. As others have pointed out, you could end up in serious trouble with US immigration authorities- the 10 year ban is just the beginning, it could end up with a lifetime ban!

It is just not worth the risk and definitely not someone of your caliber needs to. There are other countries where you could fare better. Perhaps Canada?

[rokhayakebe]

You may be wrong: http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/a-b-1-visa-business-v....

[codeornocode]

I didn't expect this to be #1 post this is kind of you people, I would love to thank everyone who posted and is posting midway replying to comments with "Thank you" i found out i'd be spamming the comments in here, so this is a huge THANK YOU to everyone who wrote and will write.

[faithfone]

Congrats on the repost. You may want to include more detailed contact information in your profile.

All the best to you!

[arianvanp]

Personally, I'd go to the European Union. There are a few very good reasons:

- Once you get citizenship in one country, you can freely work on any of the other countries, or move there and live there. Creating a much bigger area of opportunity for jobs. You could have citizenship in France, and work at a cool startup in Amsterdam

- Though it causes a lot of political instability currently (immigrants constantly drowning in the ocean, trying to get across), getting a visa here isn't that hard, especially when you're from a conflict zone and can show you have a good chance to get a job.

- Europe is pretty awesome.

[TeMPOraL]

I agree with your points, but one small nitpick: the US is almost as big as the whole EU - 300M vs. 500M citizens. So it's not much larger area of opportunity, just a little bit larger.

[verelo]

Disclaimer: I scanned the comments and couldn't see anyone talking about this, but please forgive me if I've missed this as it does seem like an obvious point.

Coding for a startup and not receiving pay, is likely still not legal. In my experience with US immigration (I'm Australian, living in Canada...traveling to the US from time to time) they don't really care about the money, they really just are about if you're taking away work that could have otherwise been done by a US citizen. Which leads me to the point of:

The fact you're doing the work for free is very likely to be irrelevant, its just the fact that you're doing work that is an issue, irrespective of the reimbursement you're receiving.

[TheCapn]

I think you've got it right here and I hope this gets seen.

US Border Patrol denied my entry to the US once because a coworker and I were coming over to oversee the installation of a number of electrical devices our company built/designed/tested and shipped to the client. We didn't have the adequate paperwork to state that this was a contractual "job" and we were simply there to assist local tradespeople in the installation should they have any questions since, you know, we designed the thing.

When we were turned around at the border it was explained: without the paperwork to detail what we were doing, that this was agreed upon ahead of time and likely a bunch of other legal matters they had no method of knowing whether we were hired to save wages that would otherwise go to an American citizen. We weren't being paid for this work, it couldn't be done by anyone else (short of them taking the design work and learning it from the ground up over several months) and we were still denied entry.

OP, work, even if free, is still work. Contact legal aid for what you are and are not allowed to do.

[mattthebaker]

Not to mention the fact that, legally speaking, if there is no compensation then there is no transfer of ownership on any of the work done. There could be a strong claim to code copyright later on, though without him being citizen I'm not sure what rights he would actually have. Would cost a bit for a lawyer to draft up some contract stipulating the housing as a form of compensation, but again not being a citizen could be a problem.

[outworlder]

> I have 4 years remaining in my U.S visa, each visit i can stay 6 months, i don't want to break any U.S rules that's why i want to code for your startup for no money, just food and a place to live in

Wouldn't that be compensation, technically? Also, I'd expect a company to be required to pay someone at least a minimum wage, but I could be mistaken.

> I am doing this because i live in a war torn country, some issues happened and i've lost all my savings

Dude, forget the US for now. Your first priority is to get a safe place to live in and a stable job so you can build your financial life back. Try other countries, such as the Netherlands, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland. These have way better immigration policies, specially for people in tech.

Then, when you are ready, try California again. Having no money will be an obstacle otherwise. How are you going to get translated, notarized documentation otherwise? Not to mention any kind of fees, plus transportation.

> i can't get an H1B visa because i don't have a university degree

Then don't, try another route. Such as via a big US multinational company. Or get the degree, if you follow the suggestion to go to an "easier" country first. You are young, you have time.

[blrgeek]

Have you considered India?

While a work visa is not likely to be easy, the current tech scene has huge demand for programmers of all kinds. Especially if you're expert in Unity/Full-stack.

If it'll help, let me know here, and I'll connect you to someone in this very area (game programming, Unity SDK programming).

Other options would be Canada, Mexico, Vietnam, or anywhere else you can work remotely.

For visa details see http://www.immihelp.com/nri/indiavisa/employment-visa-india....

[sandGorgon]

definitely post to https://www.facebook.com/groups/delhistartups/ or https://www.facebook.com/groups/blrstartups.connect/

If you want any more information about India - dont hesitate to mail me. It's a great startup ecosystem and great food. Yes, we have our shit - but fairly democratic and good opportunities can be had in general.

Tech work in India can be used as a stepping stone to the middle east, Singapore or the US.

[pthreads]

Not trying to be negative but the reality here is you can't legally just work for food and shelter in the US. Whoever makes you work that way is very likely breaking federal and/state laws even if you are not. At the very least you will have to get paid prevailing minimum wage. And the employer can only hire you if you are authorized to work.

A very narrow exception exists for unpaid interns. But that requires one to also be authorized to work in one form or the other for e.g. as a student who needs work experience in his/her field of study.

[s3nnyy]

If you want to optimize for money, I would recommend Zurich. It is the only place in Europe where net salaries compare to NYC or the Bay-Area.

If you are interested in moving here, shoot me a mail. Alternatively, check out my blogpost on medium: "Eight reasons why I moved to Switzerland" (https://medium.com/@iwaninzurich/eight-reasons-why-i-moved-t...)

[jacobush]

I agree but I want to bat for Sweden too. Wages are lower, but you don't have to pay for health insurance at all, all medical care is free and high quality. Also, Switzerland is not a member of the E.U. But Switzerland is great, I hear from relatives living there.

[wallzz]

I wonder if it is easy for non UE citezens who live in EU

[currentoor]

If you're from a war torn country have you considered applying for asylum? I know cases were asylum was granted to guys from my old country, India, which is by no means a war torn country.

I'm going through the immigration process right now and everyday Canada looks like a good option. I know it's not the US but it's still an awesome western country and has a reasonable immigration system.

Good luck!

[msutherl]

Highly recommend Canada ... Vancouver, Toronto, and Montreal all have decent (albeit small) tech scenes and are great places to live.

[ahuja_s]

I run a startup in Singapore. There is a huge shortage of skilled developers in Singapore. Please do email me at [e-mail] if you want to consider Singapore (I saw another comment suggesting Singapore). i know friends/startups looking for developers here and in Hong Kong (another option). Good luck mate!

[winash]

I work in Germany, had the option to work in the US but decided against it, I find the visa regime too strict, and unless you land a great job in a great company in a good city(you don't want to live in the middle of nowhere) it's not worth the trouble.

There are plenty of Jobs which you can get without knowing German, and many employers provide free classes where you can learn some basic German. IMO knowing a new language is also a very marketable skill depending on where you are from. Depending on the company you may get 25-30 paid day offs in a year.

You can get paid well if you are qualified/experienced. Living costs are low as well, I live in Berlin in a spacious 3 room apartment in a great area (http://i.imgur.com/qLqzqN7.jpg). The infrastructure is amazing. My daily commute is 20 mins door to door (subway or cycle) and I don't need a car at all. My daughter goes to daycare for free, and the healthcare system though it has its quirks, works quite well.

Getting a blue card is easy and with your qualifications you should be able to get it quickly, with the blue card you can travel outside the EU and come back within 12 months, no questions asked.I just took a 3-week vacation back home and plan to take another one this year.

If you wanna explore some options I would be more than happy to help, drop me an email at [e-mail]

[RomanPushkin]

What you can do is to move to country like Ecuador (Cuenca, let's say) or Thailand, or Indonesia (Bali), or Phillipines. It's relatively easy to live there on a long term.

You can find a job on oDesk (upwork now). I did it before, I earned $3K/month and worked 5 hours a day only. It's a good money for these countries (well and for US too).

Just work remotely, live there, save money. One day you'll find a job and will legally move to U.S. (seems like you'll be qualified after 9 years of professional experience).

[technomancy]

If you want to work in Indonesia or Thailand you need a local company to sponsor your visa and work permit, which makes remote work tricky. In years past you used to be able to just leave the country every 60 days or whatever and hop right back over the border, but you can't get away with that these days.

Doesn't make any sense, but that's how it is.

[bmir-alum-007]

To help make "ends meet," it's possible to get some food, healthcare and monetary assistance from federal, state, county and city programs, often managed by each county's social services agency.

Firstly, there's the Refugee Cash Assistance (RCA) program: https://www.sccgov.org/sites/ssa/debs/calworks/Pages/refugee...

Here are some other California refugee programs: http://www.dss.cahwnet.gov/refugeeprogram/

List of other refugee programs: http://www.visaus.com/benefits.html

Next, food aid (food stamps) is called CalFresh (req 5 yrs of residency for noncitizens)

After that, there's MediCal (state-run health insurance available at the county social services agency) (unsure of requirements)

Lastly, General Assistance (emergency cash, a pittance) (only 15 days of residency is required). You can sign up for it at a local social services agency office.

Here's the main website for Santa Clara county: https://www.sccgov.org/sites/ssa

(Beware of name clash: federal Social Security is also called SSA. I hear any sort of Social Security benefits usually takes a very long time and lots of paperwork to get.)

GA policies: https://www.sccgov.org/ssa/general/gachap06.pdf

Other California counties' websites are listed here: http://www.counties.org/

[yadavrakesh]

Please consider India as one possibility - I have good connections and can help you if interested.

Yadav.rakesh (at) gmail

No need to work for free - definitely not when you know how to program and build systems. We don't seem to have enough of those.

Good luck.

[mayank]

Please consider having at least an initial consultation with an immigration lawyer before trying to do this. The initial consult is usually a 20-30 minute phone call and is offered for free by many attorneys. Your intentions are good, but it would be sad if you were blacklisted by immigration for any reason.

[jpgvm]

If the US visa doesn't work out try going to a country with less archaic immigration law. i.e anywhere else.

Specifically Australia, Canada, Germany all have working holiday visas which are flexible and would let you do this sort of thing. Generally anything to do with the US and visas is a bad day.

[matthewrudy]

I would suggest Singapore too. Great emerging startup scene, very quick to get working visas.

[marquis]

Working holiday visas are not permitted once you reach 31. You must apply and enter the country before you are 31, I believe (it may be 30).

[killerpopiller]

I actually could use your help and would provide a nice shelter, food, salary in an awesome town here in Germany.

if you are interested, let me know.

[bmir-alum-007]

Germany also has single-payer socialized healthcare IIRC. The US has Medicare/Medicaid/Obamacare which isn't so great, and often doesn't include dental or vision care. For a long-term living situation, that's probably more important.

Also, the US immigration and refugee systems are arbitrary, byzantine, gotcha minefields that can suck would-be visitors into indeterminate imprisonment or expelled for minor paperwork errors or unintentionally breaking one of a billion unclear rules.

[codeornocode]

That sounds awesome, please contact me when you see this my e-mail is -as mentioned in the post- [e-mail].

[GigabyteCoin]

I knew a guy who was hasseled entering the US with some tools because he planned to do renovations on his own house that he owned outright.

The border guards said that unless he was a citizen or had a work visa then he was not allowed to work on fixing up his own house, and would have to hire a local to do it.

tl;dr working for "just food and a place to live" is still technically working, and unless you have permission to do so it would be risky for all parties involved.

[homakov]

> then he was not allowed to work on fixing up his own house

Then tourists are not allowed to cook and must go to restaurants, and coding for open source is also illegal? I think guards were wrong.

[phantom_oracle]

Have you tried applying for refugee status?

I don't know if you'd be allowed to work, but instead of taking grants from the US as a refugee, you could maybe convince them that you are a skilled-refugee who is leaving your war-torn country and you would like to work instead of being given a handout.

Something tells me that the red-tape in the US won't allow this, but it is worth a shot, especially if you speak to an immigration lawyer about it.

[seikatsu]

There is quite a lot of US visa related guesswork going on in this thread - please do seek expert advice. In my experience the application and compliance problems look much less scary when you talk to someone who does this every day. Lawyers are expensive, but try: http://teleborder.com (YC startup)

And on the global search for alternatives, should US not work out, here's some overview data of 110 most startup-friendly cities in the world: http://my.teleport.org/ -- and a mobile app for searching among them: http://teleport.org/mobile (visa data layers coming soon, too, but dozens of other cost & quality of life criteria already there)

[jedanbik]

I wouldn't want to hire you because I wouldn't want to get in trouble. I also wouldn't want you to get in trouble. There are alternatives being discussed here that would allow a win/win instead of a lose/lose: pick a different country, get another year of experience, and play by the rules.

[rainereli]

Hey USA is not the only place in the word where you can develope your self, with that CV to can try India , China , Shangia places where you can find a LOT of opportunities.

[seablackwithink]

Hello, upon reading this post I felt great sorrow for your situation. I have seen many scams,(I do not believe you to be involved in any kind of scam), and known many people with visa issues.. I believe you are a truthful, honest person who deserves the best...as well as having the best intentions towards others. While I am in Texas and have can not offer support at this time...I do know a few people in California and Oregon who may be able to help you...I am sending your post/email to them momentarily. Are there any other states have an interest in regarding living/working etc.? Please let me know and I will see what I can do to connect you with assistance.

Also, please keep us up to date regarding your situation.

Respectfully,

D. Virgillo

[codeornocode]

Thank you for your kind comment and help, i appreciate it, most of the comments here and the e-mails i got made me consider somewhere else, when i posted this post i only saw California in my head even though i don't mind going elsewhere at all.

[iamcurious]

Talk to a lawyer that actually knows the stuff. Also, if the situation looks that bleak regarding the U.S, please consider another country that gives you a better legal standing. Broaden your search. There is more to the world than North America and Europe.

[OoTheNigerian]

Here are my suggestions.

1. Take a deep breath and be calm. It will be ok. You have a visa which is the option to move. you are in a good place already.

2. Think of the most stable (infrastructure and cost wise) country you can access visa free, go there and try getting a remote position in the US. With that, you can fun living a fairly stable life in the mean time.

3. DO NOT risk your B1/B2 by trying to trick the system. Aim for a maximum of 4 months/year in the US on it.

4. With your B1/B2 you can travel to Mexico and Turkey for a while too.

Finally, DO NOT risk your B1/B2 and always have a decent reason when entering. the paper you have in your passport is merely for the CHANCE to gain entry at the immigration border and not a visa in itself.

It will be ok bud!

[siddarthan_sp]

Sorry to say, but I don't think what you're asking for is legal. You cannot be employed just for food/place to stay. If you need to work in the US, it's not possible with your visa (which I'm assuming is B1/B2).

[worldadventurer]

How about working for a startup tackling poverty alleviation globally, based in beautiful Cebu, Philippines? Visas here are much easier to get and the startup scene is growing rapidly. We're looking for talented full stack developers to work with Go language, Python/Django, Java, Docker, and Microservices. Our customers are doing life changing work globally, including in the Middle East. https://www.engagespark.com/about/#join . And two of us co-founders based here are from the US originally.

[jonsterling]

I don't think this is even legal; I'm sorry for your situation, but you must see that if this sort of thing were allowed, it would pave the way for slavery.

[rtpg]

I'm not in the US, but some people here are.

What about working on some open source projects? I don't think that would fall into the danger zone of immigration law(since you wouldn't be working "for" anyone).

Alternatively, maybe a company here can offer you an internship? The visa requirements could be less.

Does anyone here know an immigration lawyer that could help this person get out of a bad situation?

[maehwasu]

Email sent. Let's get the ball rolling and see what you've got.

[alongtheflow]

Try O-1 Visa. O-1 visa is getting more popular as an alternative to H-1B. O-1 visa does not require a university degree, and I think you have a good shot depending on how well you put yourself out there.

http://www.quora.com/O1-Visa

[hal9000xp]

> i can't get an H1B visa because i don't have a university degree

I have exactly the same problem. I'm from Russia and I don't have university degree so I can't get H1B visa right now (but I will when I have 12 years of exp).

US is really hard country to get in.

I relocated to Stockholm, Sweden since Sweden doesn't require university degree for work permit. Software developers are in shortage occupation list.

Sweden is easiest wealthy western country to get in.

If you will bored in Sweden, you can later apply to UK (as far as I understand Tier 2 General doesn't require degree either).

You can get your job in Hong Kong and Singapore without university degree but it will be a bit harder.

So I recommend Sweden. It's better to be normal employee in Stockholm than working for food in California.

Also, don't stay for a few months in US on tourist visa. Next time they ban you to issue new visa!

[jacobush]

Native Swede here, I agree. Sweden is quite easy to get into if you are on the shortage occupation list, which you are.

Once in Sweden you will either fall in love with the on the surface reserved people, or if you don't, work 5 years, apply for citizenship, then be a Swedish citizen (best passport in the world for traveling along with U.K. passport) and automatically a E.U. citizen, which means you can work anywhere in the E.U. without any limits at all. As a E.U. citizen and especially Swedish citizen it can be easier to get into the U.S. and Canada, I hear anecdotally. There are also sizable communities of almost all war affected ethnicities in Sweden you can socialize with. Stockholm is the most international city, you can live there a life time on English alone and not feel left out too much. Everywhere also you can still live on English alone, but the social life with locals will suffer if you don't learn Swedish, IMHO. All Swedes know English, but you will miss out on little chats etc. Also minorities often communicate more in Swedish than their native tongue, especially children of immigrants, so paradoxically to connect with your own kin, you also need to learn Swedish. Integration issues varies from place to place, there are some problems with racism especially towards people of color, but far from as much as in Germany. Also the racism is kind of specific and weird, if you are black but from the U.S. you are still almost celebrated by the Swedish locals.

TL/DR: Sweden is awesome. Easy to come in, if you love it, you will love it a lot. If you don't, become citizen then move on to the rest of the E.U.

[listic]

> don't stay for a few months in US on tourist visa. Next time they ban you

Are you suggesting that the U.S. immigration authorities are banning people for using visas to their capacity, for their intended purpose?

[xentronium]

Do they require relevant work experience in Sweden? Also, do they have the visa attached to the employer like h1b?

[rabbyte]

Best of luck to you, I'm sorry for where the system has gotten in the way. If I could, I would offer.

[codeornocode]

Thank you

[fasteo]

>>>> I am doing this because i live in a war torn country

I think your best option is to ask for Asylum [1]

[1] http://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/refugees-asylum/asylum

[humbertomn]

Honestly, I think you will be more successful if you spend your time and energy looking for employers that could sponsor your visa to Australia, Canada, New Zealand, etc...

I'm from a very remote part of Brazil and I used www.seek.com.au to get a programming job in Australia in 2008.. The company ran some remote tests with me and paid for all the relocation costs. You should try this.

Also you can try to get a permanent visa even before you try to move there. You can use the Immigration Points Calculator (https://www.wannamigrate.com/tools/) to know if you have the basic requirements for these same countries.

[davidbanham]

You may be a good candidate for an Australian visa. Not sure where it goes, but this form allows you to register your interest in becoming a skilled migrant.

https://skillselect.gov.au/SKILLSELECT/ExpressionOfInterest/...

Also, there _may_ be nothing stopping you from living in the US but working remotely for a company in another country. That may be a good path to getting an Australian/European/other company to sponsor you for skilled migration.

Best of luck!

[tinco]

Why not just apply for college in The Netherlands? (I recommend NHL or if your sciencey Twente). Or Germany? You can live comfortably on a part time job and can use the degree to get into the U.S. if you want.

[meric]

If U.S. doesn't work out, give Australia a try, a lot more lenient.

[bayesianhorse]

Unless you are granted asylum and therefor have to live in a prison camp...

[eddywebs]

If you need a professional degree for potentially being able to get an H1B sponsorship, I would suggest signing up for harvard extension >> https://www.extension.harvard.edu/

Anybody can start class and you qualify to join signup for a professional degree after getting A in 3 or more classes. Good luck !

[eddywebs]

If you need a professional degree for potentially being able to get an H1B sponsorship, I would suggest signing up for harvard extension >> https://www.extension.harvard.edu/

Anybody can start class and you qualify to join signup for a professional degree after getting A in 3 or more classes. Good luck !

[seanccox]

You should consider traveling to the US on your visa and then applying for refugee status: http://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/refugees-asylum/refugees

You can contact the Helsinki Citizens Assembly or the International Organization for Migration for advice.

[arunitc]

With 8 years of experience, you should be able to get a H1B. Every 3 years of experience adds 1 year to your education. You need 16 years of education to get a H1B. I too do not have a degree and managed to get a H1B. The challenge is to get through the lottery.

However, as many others have suggested, I too would recommend you to try another country, where visa rules are relaxed.

[zkhalique]

I am not 100% sure about the rules, but I think work for free is still considered work. If you have a tourist visa, you are not allowed to work for a client in the USA, even for free.

If you have all this time, why not develop an app and sell it on the internet? You can always say you're working for your own company back home.

[rebekah-aimee]

Look up this organization called "World Relief." They might take you on and help you with visa troubles. This is definitely in their department and they're super nice people; I volunteered with one of their families for a while.

Good luck; we're rooting for you.

[aivatra]

Hey why don't you come to Costa Rica? you can ask for political asylum here and work for tech companies. I'm an engineer and have always worked for american companies here. Also you can try New Zealand which is very similar in tech jobs like Costa Rica.

[zakvyn]

China(Shanghai, Beijing) will be a good place to go to find IT job that require English communication (good pay), and don't have to worry about visa issue. Just go to linkedin, and find local recruiter there.

[avellable]

You can apply to jobs in companies which are targeting diversity and experience like Rakuten Inc. It's in Japan one of the safest countries. If you got the appropriate experience they will hire you.

[thiago_fm]

I advise you try to find a job in Germany. I'm a brazilian myself and got a job here.

For a skilled Ruby dev with a diploma(for a third world country, this is a requirement) you can get around here pretty easily.

[tim333]

Also Germany has pretty much free universities if you can qualify as a resident which I guess you would if you work a few years.

[Spoom]

I'm pretty sure USCIS doesn't care if you're paid or not; the idea is that you're still potentially taking a job from an American citizen. You might want to be careful.

[bayesianhorse]

Consider coming to Germany. Berlin has a nice startup scene and both English and Arabic speaking communities.

I don't know how easy it is to get a Visa in your particular situation!

[slaction]

Hi OP. Thanks for posting. Now let us tell why you're technically wrong about everything and we know more than you, and we've never had a girlfriend.

[bradleyankrom]

It bums me out that this is so complicated for you. It also bums me out that I can't think of anything I could do to help you. I hope things work out.

[greyfox]

if your a good programmer why not land a job and let the company you work for take care of the visa we employ many chinese workers at our company and they all stay here visa paid for by the company, there is some real world infactuality in your premise, any company who "would" want you to work for them for free, as a skilled worker, should also want to pay you and pay for your via.

[rokhayakebe]

Hey, what kind of visa do you currently have?

[codeornocode]

I have a B1/B2 visa

[jane_is_here]

Have you considered Canada ? It has nice people and is not as hostile to migrants as some other countries.

[thobakr]

There is no future in the US, just go to other country (like Canada or something in west Europe).

[kevindeasis]

Oh man if you only lived in Alberta. You would def be welcome to stay at my place.

[eonw]

go get em tiger, screw all the haters! good for you for trying to better yourself and doing it while following 'the rules'.

[ThomPete]

You should consider getting an O-1 visa.

[mmaunder]

It sounds like the poster is on a B1 or B2 visa which allows 6 months max stay. It's essentially a tourist visa that is issued for up to 10 years with max stay of 6 months and no right to work.

It's highly likely that he will enter a few times with short stays outside the USA and then get denied entry, sent to secondary processing at an airport, questioned and be offered: A) the right to contest his case in court which will mean jail time until his case comes up or B) The option to withdraw his petition to enter the USA and catch the next plane back to his home country. Most people choose B for obvious reasons which leads to you being marched through the airport by security and put on a plane back home.

What I'd very strongly recommend is to not go around offering to work for free. If you do in fact live in a war torn country and have 'lost all your savings', do what many offshore folks do and get a US company to hire you for pay and just work wherever you are and get paid in your home country. Why the "work for free" offer and why the long story? It makes companies nervous. We like to pay people for their good work whether in the USA or outside the country, but legally and above board. You should get paid too.

Just posting a few data points regarding H1B stuff and immigration in general:

Time varies for visa processing and 10 years is not average for most immigrants (as has been mentioned). It took me 6 months from zero to green-card and 3 years from conditional residency (green card) to full citizenship. Not H1B. So it varies according to type of Visa, where you file and your country. Wait times can be found here:

https://egov.uscis.gov/cris/processTimesDisplayInit.do

Microsoft brings in H1B's at a rate of 2000 to 4000 people per year into the Redmond area.

http://visadoor.com/companies/microsoft-corporation

Google about the same numbers, mostly into Mountain View:

http://visadoor.com/companies/google-inc

I'm not sure I agree about H1B being indentured servitude. I'd also add that, if your intention is to become a citizen via H1B, make sure you understand how the process works before you even apply for H1B:

http://www.quora.com/How-do-I-get-US-citizenship-with-H1B-vi...

[jdimov9]

I broke the US rules. I worked on my student visa, got thrown around four different prisons throughout Pennsylvania and New York in the span of 30-something days and was finally deported (with airfare that I had to pay for). I was in my final year of my B.S. in mathematics program at university. I never finished my degree.

All of the above is absolutely, without a shadow of a doubt, THE most fortunate thing that has happened to me and I owe all of my current success to this.

What I'm trying to say is - PLEASE get back your dignity. You're not a monkey, don't make any person, government or society make you think you are one.

[pavlov]

... I owe all of my current success to this.

Can you elaborate? Sounds like an interesting story.

[harel]

I'd love to hear that story as well, as I feel the same (minus jail/deportation). I had a green card and gave it up to move to London. One of the best moves I've made.

[nokya]

+1 for the story :)

[bernardom]

You kind of have to tell the story now. It sounds too interesting.

[logicrime]

Best of luck to you, friend! Hearing of all the things you have learned and have experience in leads me to believe that many startups would miss out if they overlooked you. You sound awesome.

[codeornocode]

Thank you for your kind words :D

[idibidiart]

Hi,

I like you and your tenacity.

Why don't you ask it differently so all those annoying comments trying to "help" you would stop.

What I'm thinking is this:

"hey guys,

Does anyone have a fun side project I could hack on? Would you also be so generous as to have a couch for me at your place and host me for couple of weeks or whatever time?"

I can't imagine why such a proposal would have any illegal implications as long as you're presence in this country is legal. You can also qualify the "side project" as non-commercial and "hobby"

Does that make any sense whatsoever in your situation?

Anyway, best of luck. I really hope things get better.

Take care.

[codeornocode]

Thank you a lot.

[jack9]

The tricky bit is that he needs official employment to get back in to the US, as I understand it.

[paulhauggis]

Many people here talk about how 'terrible' the US is as a country. Yet, we see people like the OP trying everything in his power to get into the country.

It should really put things into perspective.

[paulhauggis]

Many people here talk about how 'terrible' the US is as a country. Yet, we see people like the OP trying everything in his power to get into the country.

It should really put things into perspective.