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An Unusual Subway Stop in New York

17 points| jseliger | 10 years ago |nytimes.com | reply

14 comments

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[+] yummyfajitas|10 years ago|reply
This article is a bit clueless. The state has more than adequately provided the MTA with money. The place where the state failed is providing sufficient oversight to make sure the MTA isn't wasting it.

Paris spent 1.3B euro on the 14 line, which has 9 stations. The MTA spent 2.4B on a single stop on the 7 line. MTA construction costs drastically exceed worldwide norms - the MTA spends $1B/kilometer.

http://www.systra.com/IMG/pdf/metro_meteor_en.pdf

https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2013/06/03/comp...

Apparently the only project outside NYC to cost more than $1B/KM is London's Crossrail. Even the Jubilee line extension is only $0.45B/km, and that's pretty pricey.

https://pedestrianobservations.wordpress.com/2011/05/16/us-r...

tl;dr; Funding is adequate, costs are simply out of control.

[+] PhantomGremlin|10 years ago|reply
Funding is adequate, costs are simply out of control

Yeah, that's the bottom line. Govt funded infrastructure projects are totally out of control, it's not just NYC.

My favorite example is local, in Oregon. In 1982 a very fine bridge was opened across the Columbia River. It cost $170 million.[1] Fast forward to recently. Before the plug was finally pulled, estimated costs for a second bridge a few miles away were $2.8 billion.[2] And that was for a scaled down version. Other estimates were as high as $10 billion.

Yes we've had some inflation in the last 30 years. But the cost increases far outpace inflation. And nobody in government cares. All they do is say "we need it", without doing any critical thinking. What they really mean is "we want it".

It's like the teenagers in my house. They want everything, they don't care how much it costs. They haven't earned the money they want to spend, so to them any possible costs are meaningless.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_L._Jackson_Memorial_Brid... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_River_Crossing

[+] pcurve|10 years ago|reply
The port authority bus station renovation proposal had sticker price of $9 billion.

Compared that to $500 million Japan spent renovating their Tokyo Station a few years ago which involved:

- Adding 3rd floor level, raising roof.

- reconstructing intricate decorations and motifs before it was bombed in the war.

- station hotel renovation

- installation of earthquake proof underground seismic buffers and dampers. (hundreds of them)

- 5 year long

All that for $500 million. In the middle of Tokyo.

Construction cost in the U.S. is a complete joke.

[+] morgante|10 years ago|reply
Why are costs so much higher in NY though?
[+] IIAOPSW|10 years ago|reply
10 years to build a rail station! For comparison, 10 years ago the metro system in Shanghai was barely useful and now it is one of the worlds largest.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Metro#/media/File:SHM...

We don't build like that in America anymore. Partly because it is more expensive (safety standards and such). Partly because population growth hasn't demanded it. But those things not withstanding, 10 years and a billion dollars for a one station extension is unambitious to say the least. And don't even get me started on the cluster-fudge that is BART / muni / AC / whatever.

[+] Gravityloss|10 years ago|reply
That is a very impressing thing about China.
[+] kirklove|10 years ago|reply
Got to ride this yesterday, and I've seen a lot of NYC Subway stops. This one is amazing. Comes at a price though for sure.