I have had sleep issues for many years. I have seen sleep specialists regarding this issue. They basically tell you to reduce stress. But my daily life is not particularly stressful.
But my job as a software developer involves brain-intensive work, and when I come home after work, I work on hobby software development projects, which means my brain is working intensely whenever I am awake. That may be the stress leading to my sleep issues. But I can't give up my hobby.
All doctors want to do is put me on prescription pills for the rest of my life, and all of these prescription sleeping pills are addictive. So I have been avoiding prescription meds.
Then I discovered that magnesium supplements largely solves my problem. I hope this helps someone: If you have sleep issues try Magnesium L-Threonate. Magnesium fixed two issues for me: sleep and muscle stiffness.
If Magnesium doesn't work for you, you may also consider trying a Melatonin[1] supplement about an hour or so before bed.
I have also seen a big impact of turning off the electronics and reading a book[2] in bed for the last hour or so of the day before trying to go to sleep.
Lastly, if you are a loud snorer or carrying more than a bit too much weight, you might want to investigate any sleep apnoea[3] issues.
I can second the opinion on Magnesium. Though, instead of magnesium L threonate, I used Magnesium malate. I have tried citrate and orotate forms and while they were both good, compared to malate the effect was mild. The malate form of magnesium had a better calming effect on the mind and muscles.
Will try L threonate next time and see how it works.
I had a similar beneficial response from magnesium supplements. I've always had a constellation of health issues, probably genetic, and constant anxiety and was one of the most detrimental to just getting on in life, and later I had much trouble sleeping, either not being able to get to sleep or not sleeping for very long.
I researched nutrition and genetics for many years and tried a number of supplements based on testing hypotheses I would come up with. I generally used the Linus Pauling Foundation guidance on RDA as they are annotaed with a history of how RDAs came about, whether the official RDA is optimal or not, various caveats etc.
Magnesium had a profound effect after I researched bioavailability and tried some of the organic forms. The two main ones that worked were magnesium glycinate and citrate.
I've also went through a phase of having a strong beneficial effect from high dose vitamin B12 (methyl form), which initially caused what I felt was deeper sleep but also intense nightmares; this effect wore off after a while and that might be due to correction of a deficiency.
Alright, you convinced me. Sounds very similar to my ongoing situation.
I've been taking clonidine and vitamin d for stress and anxiety and I'm really annoyed with the way doctors prescribe (wrote about this a couple hours ago in this thread -https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10824879)
Was it a drastic change, or something more subtle for you?
It's just frustrations about things that keep me up, even if they are sort of latent, suppressed frustrations which I've deferred thinking about.
I think most of us have a lot of frustrations about various things, so to me that's the first thing I would look at regarding sleep issues. The guy getting exactly what he wants sleeps well.
More specifically, I'll have trouble falling asleep and then start thinking about what's not good in my life, and I'll often sit up then and there, crack open my laptop, and take some action to at least be closer to making the thing better (writing an email to get the ball rolling, or just reflecting about ways to interpret whatever the issue). I then usually feel more satisfied and can sleep, though I may lose an hour or two doing this.
My point is take a hard look at what isn't going as well in your life as you'd hope.
Instead of working on software when you get home, how about zoning out to some TV or movies? I find that after an hour of TV, it is very easy to fall asleep.
I'd give this a try, because meds always have side effects.
Do you ingest the daily recommended amount of magnesium? I'm not a medical doctor, so ask one ... but high magnesium levels apparently can lead to arrhythmias (they can also treat them in the right context and dosage). So just a word of caution.
Barely suppressing my horror at the word 'connectome' to make a relevant comment:
As a new (6 months) parent, I can confirm anecdotally that lack of sleep profoundly messes with the brain. Even getting your normal duration of sleep, but punctuated with lots of short waking periods, makes it almost impossible to function in highly demanding intellectual tasks for any length of time.
And if you have any underlying mental issues (hint: you do), you better believe those are coming to the surface when you've been chronically sleep deprived for 3 months.
Long story short: for the love of all that is good, sleep well. If there's something stopping you, find a way to get help or get away for a while so you can get some real sleep. The ability to think properly comes back remarkably quickly after a good sleep.
For better or worse, 'connectome' is a legit term used in the field. It's relatively newish (quickly skimming the literature, first mention was in a 2005 article). It follows the naming convention setup by 'genome', and includes many variants:
- genome (set of dna material in a cell)
- exome (set of exonic dna material)
- transcriptome (set of all messenger RNA)
- proteome (set of proteins in a cell)
- interactome (set of all interactions in a cell -- protein, small molecular, etc)
- metabolome (set of all small molecular compounds / interactions in a sample)
- connectome (set of all connections in the brain -- e.g. a wiring diagram)
I have never slept well my entire life. 4-6 hours a night is my average. It doesn't seem to impact me... I have always felt great, and I have always coded on complicated things without issue.
I had paid less attention to sleep until I got hit by Appendicitis and I had to be operated, that was a waking call for me to take health seriously, so I stopped all the late night waking and started sleeping at least 6-7 hrs daily. What I have observed is that if you keep everything under check then it won't impact your health much, too much of anything is bad, so I started to daily exercise, meditate
You have no idea how awesome it feels to meditate at 5.30am under a giant tree listening to the sound of birds chirping. Sadly I shifted to a Metro now, so can't sit under a tree, but I do meditate, it helps to clear my mind, meditation + daily exercise = good health
I understand how any trip to the hospital might lead to a reflection on your health. However, I fail to see how appendicitis is related to a lack of sleep.
When I find myself "in a rut" mentally, sometimes a day-night-day of no sleep followed by a night of slightly more sleep than usual does just the trick to make me more coherent and productive.
[+] [-] petilon|10 years ago|reply
But my job as a software developer involves brain-intensive work, and when I come home after work, I work on hobby software development projects, which means my brain is working intensely whenever I am awake. That may be the stress leading to my sleep issues. But I can't give up my hobby.
All doctors want to do is put me on prescription pills for the rest of my life, and all of these prescription sleeping pills are addictive. So I have been avoiding prescription meds.
Then I discovered that magnesium supplements largely solves my problem. I hope this helps someone: If you have sleep issues try Magnesium L-Threonate. Magnesium fixed two issues for me: sleep and muscle stiffness.
[+] [-] anotherevan|10 years ago|reply
I have also seen a big impact of turning off the electronics and reading a book[2] in bed for the last hour or so of the day before trying to go to sleep.
Lastly, if you are a loud snorer or carrying more than a bit too much weight, you might want to investigate any sleep apnoea[3] issues.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin
[2] Actually, I'm usually reading ebooks, but on an e-ink display, not a light-emitting display of any sort, which is the point.
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_apnea
[+] [-] twentysix|10 years ago|reply
https://examine.com/supplements/magnesium/
[+] [-] redcalx|10 years ago|reply
I researched nutrition and genetics for many years and tried a number of supplements based on testing hypotheses I would come up with. I generally used the Linus Pauling Foundation guidance on RDA as they are annotaed with a history of how RDAs came about, whether the official RDA is optimal or not, various caveats etc.
Magnesium had a profound effect after I researched bioavailability and tried some of the organic forms. The two main ones that worked were magnesium glycinate and citrate.
I've also went through a phase of having a strong beneficial effect from high dose vitamin B12 (methyl form), which initially caused what I felt was deeper sleep but also intense nightmares; this effect wore off after a while and that might be due to correction of a deficiency.
[+] [-] amelius|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] austinjp|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bpchaps|10 years ago|reply
I've been taking clonidine and vitamin d for stress and anxiety and I'm really annoyed with the way doctors prescribe (wrote about this a couple hours ago in this thread -https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10824879)
Was it a drastic change, or something more subtle for you?
[+] [-] LordHumungous|10 years ago|reply
Just make sure you turn the monitor off on your laptop, or greatly dim it (https://justgetflux.com). Bright light will keep you awake.
[+] [-] orthoganol|10 years ago|reply
I think most of us have a lot of frustrations about various things, so to me that's the first thing I would look at regarding sleep issues. The guy getting exactly what he wants sleeps well.
More specifically, I'll have trouble falling asleep and then start thinking about what's not good in my life, and I'll often sit up then and there, crack open my laptop, and take some action to at least be closer to making the thing better (writing an email to get the ball rolling, or just reflecting about ways to interpret whatever the issue). I then usually feel more satisfied and can sleep, though I may lose an hour or two doing this.
My point is take a hard look at what isn't going as well in your life as you'd hope.
[+] [-] e40|10 years ago|reply
I'd give this a try, because meds always have side effects.
[+] [-] hackercomplex|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Scarbutt|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] alphydan|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ra1n85|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] robotkilla|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] johnchristopher|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Blahah|10 years ago|reply
As a new (6 months) parent, I can confirm anecdotally that lack of sleep profoundly messes with the brain. Even getting your normal duration of sleep, but punctuated with lots of short waking periods, makes it almost impossible to function in highly demanding intellectual tasks for any length of time.
And if you have any underlying mental issues (hint: you do), you better believe those are coming to the surface when you've been chronically sleep deprived for 3 months.
Long story short: for the love of all that is good, sleep well. If there's something stopping you, find a way to get help or get away for a while so you can get some real sleep. The ability to think properly comes back remarkably quickly after a good sleep.
[+] [-] polyfractal|10 years ago|reply
- genome (set of dna material in a cell)
- exome (set of exonic dna material)
- transcriptome (set of all messenger RNA)
- proteome (set of proteins in a cell)
- interactome (set of all interactions in a cell -- protein, small molecular, etc)
- metabolome (set of all small molecular compounds / interactions in a sample)
- connectome (set of all connections in the brain -- e.g. a wiring diagram)
etc etc
[+] [-] evilmushroom|10 years ago|reply
There has to be a ratio difference for people.
[+] [-] thewhitetulip|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Alchemista|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] TazeTSchnitzel|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pdkl95|10 years ago|reply
// I just spent the last few days in the ICU due to the heart problems that come from lack of O2. Not fun. Seriously, get your sleep.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apnea%E2%80%93hypopnea_index
[+] [-] austinjp|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jessaustin|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] joshavant|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gavazzy|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ancaster|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] slmyers|10 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hotcool|10 years ago|reply
[deleted]