The fact that the article conflated dating advice into job searching, and mentioned hopping on a longboard would normally be more than enough for me to abort and ignore, but there is a very important nugget in there; that how you carry and project yourself is such a big part of having an enjoyable career.
Self confidence is useful for making money as a contractor, but I know I felt a lot better about myself after I productized my work and thus largely made apparent self-confidence irrelevant.
$50 an hour is pretty good for 22. At that age I was making $30 an hour and ecstatic to be getting that much. Even that seemed astronomical compared to the $12 I was making two years before. Now, of course, all of those seem like piddly sums compared to the $75-100 an hour I bring in now as a full-time consultant at the age of 26.
While age and experience has a lot to do with why my rate has climbed so high and so fast, mostly it is due to confidence. You have to ignore your inner critic that says you are not worth $12/30/50/75 an hour, and honestly consider what your time is worth. Would you trade an extra hour of sleep or an extra hour with your girlfriend for the price of a meal at Chili's? A tank of gas? A shitty coffee table at Ikea?
There's a spectrum there, and you have to place yourself as high in the spectrum as possible. Don't stop going higher- even if people laugh at you. Two days before I landed my first gig at $75 an hour I had a recruiter laugh at me and that rate. Ignore them. Trust yourself. Trust your abilities. Charge a good price for your time. Because after all, time is all we have. Make them pay for it.
Recruiters are the worst. You'd think it's their job to get you the highest paying job out there, but it's quite the opposite. Their goal is to sell you as fast as possible, regardless of the rate.
That's why you should never listen to recruiters telling you that you want too much. It's bullshit.
I disagree. I was 22 when I quit my last job as a wage-slave, and that year I billed out 1100 hours at $125/hour. That might have been the best year of my life. A 6-figure salary for working essentially half-time.
"I experimented with raising my prices super high..."
The best thing I did was to try that years ago. One of my bosses told me he did that and not only found work, but respect, because his employers perceived his value and opinions as being worth more. If you have the skills, you can find yourself on a whole new level of employment.
A year or so ago I was looking for a polite way to turn a load of work down from certain clients - so I set my rate 8 times what I was currently charging on the premise it would put them off without me outright saying no.
Complete failure there because they happily wanted to pay it (and you cant turn it down then :()
When you quote a high rate you can always come down if you discover you really want the work for some reason. Once you throw out a number, that's the ceiling.
I would say that $50/hour is a fine wage for your first gig, no matter where you are. However, that's not a reasonable long-term salary. Even if you bill out 2000 hours a year, you walk away with 100K. Then, you still need to pay taxes, insurance, and save for retirement. It's like making less than 50K at a job with benefits, except you work twice as much.
A $50/hour wage is not bad to start, but a long-term contractor needs to command above $100/hour, more like $200 in NYC.
I think my first contracting gig paid something like $8/hour. I did a website for someone for a flat fee, and it took me longer than I hoped :)
It sounds like he also found the job on Craigslist. I've found that most of the jobs on Craigslist are wishful thinking... must have 10+ years of CSS/JS/HTML5/J2EE/C/C+/C++ - salary is $15/hr.
Perhaps this approach works in an area saturated both with capital for would-be employers to spend, and with the contractors themselves, so that competition allows such negotiation. Indeed, NYC is undoubtedly such an area.
In other parts of the country, especially during these times, an area can truly have enough of a cumulative lack of available capital, that being hired at all is considered an accomplishment.
I can do freelance work that in other cities that fetches $100/hr handily, but my Midwest city shelters few people who can pay that, regardless of my poise or professionalism.
#1 is a stretch. Bartenders make $50-$100/hour 2-3 nights per week, for 4-6 hours of their shifts. The best bartenders in SF are grossing $65k-$75k .. Not really the equivalent. They're still working poor by local standards.
I don't have a lot of experience programming, at least not professionally. I tend to hack a lot of quick scripts together, and have recently started working on some larger projects.
Anyway, I figured it would be worth giving this a shot. I went on Craigslist, browsed through the gigs, and picked one that looked promising. I made a quick estimate of my time, doubled it, and sent off an email to him. 6 sentences, and I used the word "simple" in 2 of them, and I made sure to use a "indifferent" attitude. The lister got back to me within 15 minutes saying that my price was "too much", that he had been quoted prices for less than a third of that. And then he proceeded to give me his number, and told me to call him and discuss what needed to be done for the project.
Not that it means anything, but the 20 minutes I spent looking at craigslist during my lunch break due to this post seem to have been well worth it (although, admittedly, I barely skimmed the actual post, and just read the comments here in detail).
Great comments on value and scarcity in social interactions. Being conscious of this has made me more successful too.
The notion of value offering is very different from value taking. Value offering coincides with abundance mentality; value taking coincides with scarcity mentality. When you are value offering, you really want to help the other person. You want to present them with the truth and honestly evaluate how you could meet their needs, rather than manipulating and micromanaging to get your end of the deal. You create a win-win situation.
Also, sounds like someone has had some experience with pickup.
Older brother- I have a few questions-about- Scarcity.
"why would you care about any individual woman if you have access to a lot of them?" Why not? This question makes me think of a completely faithless relationship filled with cheating and manipulation just because caring is not an issue.
I understand your social proof point, and I know quite well how you deal with everything: "I just acted naturally, without tweaking", but I find this statement misplaced, "It’s more honest, and non-manipulative, which is something I think we could all strive for." for why would one strive for non-manipulation and honestly when one can get any girl without them -when there are just so many fish in the sea.
Other than that, I enjoyed the post =]
Oh, and by the way, next time you argue one of my philosophies, I'm going to quote you. I tend to describe myself as philosophically immature for good reason.
For my last side gig I charged $100/hr. I didn't need the gig, nor did I really want it, since I had just changed real jobs. They didn't like the price, but went for it anyway.
I like some of your thoughts but it I do not believe it is this complex. Maybe the new title should be "How personal confidence affects perceived value, both in business and in meeting chicks."
Where do you meet these kind of people? The last job I interviewed for wanted me to work as a contractor and wanted to pay me $15/hr. When I said that was too low to cover my costs and taxes, and was much less than I usually make, he insisted that he pays people with years more experience just around $20, and that he though $15 seemed fair! I'm glad he was successful, but try to remember that results are not typical.
There are plenty of those. But there are also plenty of smart people who are willing to pay more because they understand the value.
It's been my experience that the less someone is willing to pay you for your work, the less they value it. Then every detail becomes subject to scrutiny on the invoice.
If you're good at what you do, and you can prove it, you'll eventually find jobs that pay you what you're worth. It just takes more effort to find them.
And of course, standing firm on your rates helps. You won't get all the gigs, but you probably don't want the headaches that would come with them.
Keep in mind that the negotiation on rate is a glimpse into how future negotiations will go. Contracting is all about negotiations. (Deadlines, feature requests, etc.)
The employer is looking to keep costs down. You're looking to eat. But neither of you should come away feeling cheated. Don't charge more than you're worth, and don't accept less.
> The last job I interviewed for wanted me to work as a contractor and wanted to pay me $15/hr. When I said that was too low to cover my costs and taxes, and was much less than I usually make, he insisted that he pays people with years more experience just around $20, and that he though $15 seemed fair!
If that's true, you need to start a consultancy with those "people with years more experience " as your subcontractors. You charge $40-50/hr for their time and pass through $25-40/hr to them. You both win.
The problem is that you let him insist what he pays people and continued to listen. It's easier to meet good clients if you don't waste your time with bad ones. Someone who wants to pay the same going rate as Walmart or Target is not worth your time. Even if you negotiate him up, he will try to screw you later. Just move on.
When you say "It's too low to cover my costs," you're not telling him why he should care. "My regular rate is $25; my best clients pay me $20," is probably a better response.
By increasing your hourly rate you naturally start with higher expectations from your client. In the same respect the expectations I put on myself are higher, and I see this as a way to strengthen my output by intensifying my effort.
You got a contract, and a low-paying one at that. This was worth a blog posting?
All of these "How I did so and so" blog postings explaining basic life operations are getting annoying. Look forward to my next blog posting "How I Bought Some Organic Groceries While Only Walking A Block And A Half"
[+] [-] efsavage|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lsc|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] subwindow|16 years ago|reply
While age and experience has a lot to do with why my rate has climbed so high and so fast, mostly it is due to confidence. You have to ignore your inner critic that says you are not worth $12/30/50/75 an hour, and honestly consider what your time is worth. Would you trade an extra hour of sleep or an extra hour with your girlfriend for the price of a meal at Chili's? A tank of gas? A shitty coffee table at Ikea?
There's a spectrum there, and you have to place yourself as high in the spectrum as possible. Don't stop going higher- even if people laugh at you. Two days before I landed my first gig at $75 an hour I had a recruiter laugh at me and that rate. Ignore them. Trust yourself. Trust your abilities. Charge a good price for your time. Because after all, time is all we have. Make them pay for it.
[+] [-] olegk|16 years ago|reply
That's why you should never listen to recruiters telling you that you want too much. It's bullshit.
[+] [-] quickpost|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dnsworks|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dabent|16 years ago|reply
The best thing I did was to try that years ago. One of my bosses told me he did that and not only found work, but respect, because his employers perceived his value and opinions as being worth more. If you have the skills, you can find yourself on a whole new level of employment.
[+] [-] ErrantX|16 years ago|reply
Complete failure there because they happily wanted to pay it (and you cant turn it down then :()
[+] [-] simonw|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ams6110|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tocomment|16 years ago|reply
You do have to be patient with it. It takes 20-30 ratings for it to start knowing your preferences.
[+] [-] philipn|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] andrewljohnson|16 years ago|reply
I would say that $50/hour is a fine wage for your first gig, no matter where you are. However, that's not a reasonable long-term salary. Even if you bill out 2000 hours a year, you walk away with 100K. Then, you still need to pay taxes, insurance, and save for retirement. It's like making less than 50K at a job with benefits, except you work twice as much.
A $50/hour wage is not bad to start, but a long-term contractor needs to command above $100/hour, more like $200 in NYC.
I think my first contracting gig paid something like $8/hour. I did a website for someone for a flat fee, and it took me longer than I hoped :)
[+] [-] illumin8|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] encoderer|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ronnier|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] matrix|16 years ago|reply
I find Pavlina to be interesting, but sadly he went w-a-y off into cuckoo land a while back.
[+] [-] adamhowell|16 years ago|reply
Polyphasic sleep? Fine. Conscious growth? Um, ok. Polygamy? Woah, what?!
[+] [-] westbywest|16 years ago|reply
In other parts of the country, especially during these times, an area can truly have enough of a cumulative lack of available capital, that being hired at all is considered an accomplishment.
I can do freelance work that in other cities that fetches $100/hr handily, but my Midwest city shelters few people who can pay that, regardless of my poise or professionalism.
[+] [-] workingstiff|16 years ago|reply
1. Bartenders make more than what you are offering me.
2. According to last year's 10K SEC filing, you made $X Billion, and you can't afford me?
3. You must be accustomed to dealing with desperate people, not talented people.
[+] [-] JacobAldridge|16 years ago|reply
1. Sure, but bartenders have people skills
2. According to last month's data, our pool of potential employees has 10.5% unemployment, and you can afford to live on food stamps?
3. There are many talented and desperate ways to reject your application, but you've probably heard them all.
[+] [-] dnsworks|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] skolor|16 years ago|reply
Anyway, I figured it would be worth giving this a shot. I went on Craigslist, browsed through the gigs, and picked one that looked promising. I made a quick estimate of my time, doubled it, and sent off an email to him. 6 sentences, and I used the word "simple" in 2 of them, and I made sure to use a "indifferent" attitude. The lister got back to me within 15 minutes saying that my price was "too much", that he had been quoted prices for less than a third of that. And then he proceeded to give me his number, and told me to call him and discuss what needed to be done for the project.
Not that it means anything, but the 20 minutes I spent looking at craigslist during my lunch break due to this post seem to have been well worth it (although, admittedly, I barely skimmed the actual post, and just read the comments here in detail).
[+] [-] teye|16 years ago|reply
The notion of value offering is very different from value taking. Value offering coincides with abundance mentality; value taking coincides with scarcity mentality. When you are value offering, you really want to help the other person. You want to present them with the truth and honestly evaluate how you could meet their needs, rather than manipulating and micromanaging to get your end of the deal. You create a win-win situation.
Also, sounds like someone has had some experience with pickup.
[+] [-] dbz|16 years ago|reply
"why would you care about any individual woman if you have access to a lot of them?" Why not? This question makes me think of a completely faithless relationship filled with cheating and manipulation just because caring is not an issue.
I understand your social proof point, and I know quite well how you deal with everything: "I just acted naturally, without tweaking", but I find this statement misplaced, "It’s more honest, and non-manipulative, which is something I think we could all strive for." for why would one strive for non-manipulation and honestly when one can get any girl without them -when there are just so many fish in the sea.
Other than that, I enjoyed the post =]
Oh, and by the way, next time you argue one of my philosophies, I'm going to quote you. I tend to describe myself as philosophically immature for good reason.
[+] [-] grimoire|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] aw3c2|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sheraz|16 years ago|reply
I like some of your thoughts but it I do not believe it is this complex. Maybe the new title should be "How personal confidence affects perceived value, both in business and in meeting chicks."
That is why you got $50 an hour. Confidence.
[+] [-] run4yourlives|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zephyrfalcon|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tialys|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bphogan|16 years ago|reply
It's been my experience that the less someone is willing to pay you for your work, the less they value it. Then every detail becomes subject to scrutiny on the invoice.
If you're good at what you do, and you can prove it, you'll eventually find jobs that pay you what you're worth. It just takes more effort to find them.
And of course, standing firm on your rates helps. You won't get all the gigs, but you probably don't want the headaches that would come with them.
Keep in mind that the negotiation on rate is a glimpse into how future negotiations will go. Contracting is all about negotiations. (Deadlines, feature requests, etc.)
The employer is looking to keep costs down. You're looking to eat. But neither of you should come away feeling cheated. Don't charge more than you're worth, and don't accept less.
[+] [-] smcq|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] anamax|16 years ago|reply
If that's true, you need to start a consultancy with those "people with years more experience " as your subcontractors. You charge $40-50/hr for their time and pass through $25-40/hr to them. You both win.
[+] [-] jdminhbg|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] enra|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] byrneseyeview|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Sukotto|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] run4yourlives|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|16 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] ceeing|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] F_J_H|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thinkbohemian|16 years ago|reply
"You can’t cheat others without cheating yourself."
[+] [-] dnsworks|16 years ago|reply
All of these "How I did so and so" blog postings explaining basic life operations are getting annoying. Look forward to my next blog posting "How I Bought Some Organic Groceries While Only Walking A Block And A Half"