Daniel recognizes his mistake and is simply trying to put this issue behind him. I regret that this post might make it more difficult for Daniel to do that.
Why the hell does everyone seem to tiptoe around this guy? Asking for bribes isn't some sort of youthful indiscretion, its indicative of a fundamental personality trait that won't change as he gets older.
The more I learn about Jason and Loren, the clearer their malicious intent becomes.
Its unfortunate that he didn't do his homework on this one before contacting Calcanis.
From my interactions with Sam, he seems like a good guy trying to do right by others by making something useful for them. He shouldn't be in any way apologetic to these leeches.
I don't think it's a fundamental personality trait. Bribery is common in certain countries. Do you think it's because the people in such countries have different fundamental personality traits? Seems more likely this sort of thing is largely determined by the situation. The kid may have just gotten carried away by the power he suddenly found himself holding.
Yeah, I think Sam is being far too generous in thinking Daniel has recognized his mistake. Going back to the Mixergy interview Daniel did, he claimed the suggestion of a Mac Book air was intended as a joke but it seems very clear that from Sam's point of view that it was not. Also, he uses the alleged "Birthday Present" cover story when talking about the iMac he received.
When most 17-year-olds make mistakes - even big ones - the whole internet doesn't know about it. Kids make judgment mistakes because they aren't emotionally mature yet. One mistake made at 17 is not necessarily indicative of a lifelong personality trait.
"On February 5th, Jason Calacanis posted some thoughts on the Techcrunch "extortion" story. I found his article insightful and well written. Wanting to reach out to someone about the issues I've been struggling with, I emailed him and confessed my involvement."
This is the first time I have actually performed a real facepalm.
+1. Reaching out to someone? Not a horrible idea. Reaching out to Calacanis? What in the hell was he (not) thinking? He's the nosy watercooler gossip lady of the blogosphere.
I have to say, he handled it very well considering the circumstances. I don't think Divvyshot was at fault here either, his responses to Daniel were perfectly understandable.
It almost sounds like what happens in sexual harassment cases. The victim will often not give a straightforward refusal, because they're trying to avoid the consequences confrontation may lead to. It's not particularly admirable, but it is totally understandable.
I think he's worth trusting as much as it's worth it to trust anybody else in business; that is, not that much. Jason Calacanis is not your friend, unless he's actually your friend. If you have a juicy story you want kept secret, why would you tell one of the most loud people in your industry?
1. I did forward the note to Loren, but I didn't think Loren would use it this way.
2. Loren shouldn't have and that was not cool.
3. Daniel has problems and needs to get help. I feel bad for him because doing something so extreme at a young age so publicly is, well, not good.
4. Good on the company who turned Daniel in and who confessed--that's brave. It was also really stupid and desperate to even consider, let alone promise, giving a laptop in return for a blog post. Honestly, if you're company doesn't get attention don't get desperate... just keep trying!
5. Bad on me for sending this to Loren. I honestly didn't even read the whole thing... I was like "oh here is an email from the dude who got extorted cool... " I actually didn't think it was that big of deal.
6. If you can do a story about Open Angel Forum on Thursday and get it to the top slot on HN I will gladly give you an Apple Tablet.
Anyway, I've got more important things to attend to at 1AM than Daniel extortion plot fall out.
Not only did JC not out Sam Odio but some of us smart people figured out who of Sam's friends bought Daniel the iMac..
Sam Odio was dumb enough to open his mouth even..I mean when you blab that bad over internet about what you thought you got away with why do you expect it to be secret for long?
Yeah, you made some mistakes, but don't be too hard on yourself. That kind of situation is unexpected and when you're in the moment, it's hard to know how to respond. Good on you for doing the right thing in the end, and for coming clean about everything publicly now. In the end, a person's character is less about never making mistakes than how you handle the mistakes you do make.
Interviewee: I mean, so there were conversations that I had with this company and both in jokingly in manner and that they may have perceived as the real thing.
Andrew: I see so you and I are sitting and talking and I might want you to write about Mixergy for Tech crunch and I say listen Dan. Why don’t you write for Mixergy? Why don’t you write about Mixergy on Tech crunch? No there’s nothing, there’s no loops here. I say what if I give you this Mac book pro that I’m writing? That kind of joke.
Interviewee: Exactly!
Andrew: We’re not giving you the Mac book pro but we’re kidding around.
How do you suggest that you'd write an article about someone if they give you a laptop in a 'joking' manner. If I asked my secretary to suck my cock 'in a joking manner' it's still sexual fucking harassment, this is juvenile bullshit he's 17 and clearly displaying it.
Regardless of his intention, it was gross professional misconduct and he fully deserved being dismissed.
I must be missing something (I haven't followed this story), but how is this an issue at all for anyone except TC and their journalistic integrity? Am I supposed to feel morally outraged that a tiny startup even just entertained the idea of giving someone a gift in exchange for blog coverage? Is there actually something here or just self-important silicon valley pundit drama? (god I'm glad I unsubscribed from TC long ago)
I feel for Divvyshot, the actual event seems way beyond their control and this has brought a whole new angle. It just makes me wonder how many other eager startups may have/will/could be put in this kind of situation for 'positive coverage', when they have a lot at stake in their business.
I think you guys are way to easy on Daniel using the cover of youth and naivety, at 17 you are more than capable of knowing this kind of behavior is unacceptable. The only reason he would do extort someone like this is because he is fully aware of the power of his position. If what Sam is saying is true.. then there should be no excuse.
Daniel wants to be treated like an adult when he is writing a story or claiming to be the stage manager at TechCrunch50 (uhhh.... no, he wasn't). Then he wants to be forgiven for a folly of youth when he extorts startups.
He's an adult, he f-ed up and he really never apologized correctly. "A line was crossed" is not an apology... he really should have said "I tried to extort thousands of dollars from companies in exchange for blogs posts and I betrayed the trust of the people who helped me most in my professional life: the TechCrunch team."
Me personally? I signed up for Divvyshot a few weeks ago and forgot about it. I'm about to go check it out again now. I like Sam's attitude and honesty.
Ugh. The growing lack of civility online makes me sad. I want to undo the traffic I just sent to that blog, so I've reproduced the contents here in the hopes that other people can avoid clicking on the link:
Crunchgate - What Makes Sammy Run?
By Loren Feldman, on March 2nd, 2010
Well it seems we have yet more about Crunchgate to discuss. I thought we were all done with this. It really is the gift that keeps giving. It seems our newest character in this pathetic tale is some guy named Sam Odio. Seems Sam owns Divvyshot. Sam’s also an idiot, see he’s the guy who Dainel Brusivlosky wanted the McAir from for reviews on Techcrunch. He says he never got it for him though. Good for you Sam. HIS FRIEND DID GET DANIEL AN IMAC though for coverage. Right Sam? Anyway, Sam wrote a big woe is me blog post about how I outed his crimes with Jason Calacanis. Only problem is it never happened. A lot of people knew that Sam was dirty and weak. Many people know of his story with Daniel Bru. I had 3 different people tell me in fact. Amateurs like these guys tend to have big mouths. Especially dopey ones with shitty iphone apps.
Knowing how weak and stupid someone must be to be in this situation to begin with I knew I could scare this guy into confessing his evil ways. I tweeted. “You have 24hrs.” That’s it. That’s all I said. Well, when you are guilty and stupid that’s all it takes to make you cave, because that’s exactly what Sam did. Sam, you are a weak dishonest dope. You were played by Daniel Bru, and now you were just played by your own guilt.
All I needed to do was give the mere suggestion that Sam might get caught and he confessed, and that’s what happened here. Social engineering FTW!! Sam you need to stop crying. You are weak, dishonest and stupid. I can’t imagine these traits help you with building quality iphone apps.
The real story Sammy boy is not you, but which one of your friends BOUGHT DANIEL BRUSIVLOVSKY AN IMAC FOR COVERAGE ON TECHCRUNCH?
C’mon Sammy the truth will set you free. WHO BOUGHT DANIEL BRUSIVLOVSKY AN IMAC FOR COVERAGE ON TECHCRUNCH?
The tone in that post by Feldman makes my skin crawl. I hadn't heard of him before but I don't think I could ever read anything he's written now. Is he always like that? ICK.
A few other adjectives come to mind, but... yeah. Not sure having glanced at this story really adds anything to my life. It just looks like a big "Internet Drama" piece:-/ I'm sure it's important to those involved, but it really doesn't affect my life.
Now I know not to trust Jason Calcanis. He always seemed like a good guy, if a bit of a megalomaniac.
Anybody who forwards private emails is way beyond the pale of somebody who offers a MacBook Air for good coverage. The latter is an ethical lapse, the former is evidence of a deep character flaw.
Jason Calcanis owes the community a large, unequivocal apology through his newsletter - without ads and hyperbole.
I wonder if there's a smallish set of keywords that one could filter to get a less valley-drama-filled HN, with a higher percentage of that excellent tech content. Maybe filter out anything involving "calacanis" and "techcrunch" and see how it goes (though this particular post would be hard to catch, since the title only alludes to it).
I find it ironic that by going around and routinely downvoting anything jasonmcalacanis posts in these comments it makes them much easier to spot; I simply scrolled down and read everything in light grey.
personally, I'm sick of this kindergarden. While I agree that journalistic integrity is very important, I fail to see the gravity in this issue to warrant it being blow out of proportions the way it is.
Who cares about some crappy MacBook Air (that whould not have been fun to work with anyways) and a startup like so many others doing what so many others do?
There are so many much bigger issues than stuff like this. Get a grip.
Sorry. I had to vent. Now mod me down into oblivion. I guess European and US cultures don't quite mix - over here, stuff like this just is no big deal.
[+] [-] richcollins|16 years ago|reply
Why the hell does everyone seem to tiptoe around this guy? Asking for bribes isn't some sort of youthful indiscretion, its indicative of a fundamental personality trait that won't change as he gets older.
The more I learn about Jason and Loren, the clearer their malicious intent becomes.
Its unfortunate that he didn't do his homework on this one before contacting Calcanis.
From my interactions with Sam, he seems like a good guy trying to do right by others by making something useful for them. He shouldn't be in any way apologetic to these leeches.
[+] [-] pg|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gcheong|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] scott_s|16 years ago|reply
Also, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_attribution_error
[+] [-] khelloworld|16 years ago|reply
Thats the way the world works.
[+] [-] jeff18|16 years ago|reply
This is the first time I have actually performed a real facepalm.
[+] [-] ax0n|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cmelbye|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] staunch|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|16 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] mediaman|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] travisjeffery|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] richcollins|16 years ago|reply
or this: http://www.seobook.com/black-hat-seo-case-study
...
[+] [-] onewland|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jasonmcalacanis|16 years ago|reply
2. Loren shouldn't have and that was not cool.
3. Daniel has problems and needs to get help. I feel bad for him because doing something so extreme at a young age so publicly is, well, not good.
4. Good on the company who turned Daniel in and who confessed--that's brave. It was also really stupid and desperate to even consider, let alone promise, giving a laptop in return for a blog post. Honestly, if you're company doesn't get attention don't get desperate... just keep trying!
5. Bad on me for sending this to Loren. I honestly didn't even read the whole thing... I was like "oh here is an email from the dude who got extorted cool... " I actually didn't think it was that big of deal.
6. If you can do a story about Open Angel Forum on Thursday and get it to the top slot on HN I will gladly give you an Apple Tablet.
Anyway, I've got more important things to attend to at 1AM than Daniel extortion plot fall out.
peace and love,
jcal
[+] [-] unknown|16 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] shareme|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shareme|16 years ago|reply
Sam Odio was dumb enough to open his mouth even..I mean when you blab that bad over internet about what you thought you got away with why do you expect it to be secret for long?
[+] [-] shareme|16 years ago|reply
As a person building a startup and startup products there is no room for behavior in which both sides of the bribe get a free pass.
S Odio is just as guilty as Daniel..
We do not need this type of fraud in our tech industry as it leads to bigger fraud crimes.
Okay back to code..rant mode off
[+] [-] ryanwaggoner|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mcav|16 years ago|reply
> "If I were ipodrip and divvyshot, Id be be starting to think about damage control. Arrington cant hide you forever."
> "Divvyshot. you have 24 hrs."
Veiled threats via Twitter? Come on. Unnecessarily dramatic and threatening, childish even.
[+] [-] ianbishop|16 years ago|reply
A little heavier of a threat than just twitter but this Loren guy came out as the biggest scumbag out of all of them for me.
[+] [-] dwwoelfel|16 years ago|reply
From the interview transcript:
Interviewee: I mean, so there were conversations that I had with this company and both in jokingly in manner and that they may have perceived as the real thing.
Andrew: I see so you and I are sitting and talking and I might want you to write about Mixergy for Tech crunch and I say listen Dan. Why don’t you write for Mixergy? Why don’t you write about Mixergy on Tech crunch? No there’s nothing, there’s no loops here. I say what if I give you this Mac book pro that I’m writing? That kind of joke.
Interviewee: Exactly!
Andrew: We’re not giving you the Mac book pro but we’re kidding around.
Interviewee: Yeah
[+] [-] Sam_Odio|16 years ago|reply
I'm trying to respect Daniel's wishes by not releasing transcipts of our conversations.
However if Daniel feels that I wasn't fair or accurate then i'll release transcripts. I'll leave it up to him.
[+] [-] AndrewWarner|16 years ago|reply
And these two accounts of the conversations contradict each other. What you excerpted here is pretty much what he told me before the interview.
A few lines down from your excerpt:
Interviewee: There are IMs. They’re not made public and hopefully they won't be made public.
[+] [-] electromagnetic|16 years ago|reply
Regardless of his intention, it was gross professional misconduct and he fully deserved being dismissed.
[+] [-] dasil003|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ryanhuff|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jaxc|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] minalecs|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jasonmcalacanis|16 years ago|reply
Daniel wants to be treated like an adult when he is writing a story or claiming to be the stage manager at TechCrunch50 (uhhh.... no, he wasn't). Then he wants to be forgiven for a folly of youth when he extorts startups.
He's an adult, he f-ed up and he really never apologized correctly. "A line was crossed" is not an apology... he really should have said "I tried to extort thousands of dollars from companies in exchange for blogs posts and I betrayed the trust of the people who helped me most in my professional life: the TechCrunch team."
[+] [-] tlrobinson|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tdm911|16 years ago|reply
http://www.1938media.com/crunchgate-what-makes-sammy-run/
Me personally? I signed up for Divvyshot a few weeks ago and forgot about it. I'm about to go check it out again now. I like Sam's attitude and honesty.
[+] [-] portman|16 years ago|reply
Crunchgate - What Makes Sammy Run? By Loren Feldman, on March 2nd, 2010
Well it seems we have yet more about Crunchgate to discuss. I thought we were all done with this. It really is the gift that keeps giving. It seems our newest character in this pathetic tale is some guy named Sam Odio. Seems Sam owns Divvyshot. Sam’s also an idiot, see he’s the guy who Dainel Brusivlosky wanted the McAir from for reviews on Techcrunch. He says he never got it for him though. Good for you Sam. HIS FRIEND DID GET DANIEL AN IMAC though for coverage. Right Sam? Anyway, Sam wrote a big woe is me blog post about how I outed his crimes with Jason Calacanis. Only problem is it never happened. A lot of people knew that Sam was dirty and weak. Many people know of his story with Daniel Bru. I had 3 different people tell me in fact. Amateurs like these guys tend to have big mouths. Especially dopey ones with shitty iphone apps.
Knowing how weak and stupid someone must be to be in this situation to begin with I knew I could scare this guy into confessing his evil ways. I tweeted. “You have 24hrs.” That’s it. That’s all I said. Well, when you are guilty and stupid that’s all it takes to make you cave, because that’s exactly what Sam did. Sam, you are a weak dishonest dope. You were played by Daniel Bru, and now you were just played by your own guilt.
All I needed to do was give the mere suggestion that Sam might get caught and he confessed, and that’s what happened here. Social engineering FTW!! Sam you need to stop crying. You are weak, dishonest and stupid. I can’t imagine these traits help you with building quality iphone apps.
The real story Sammy boy is not you, but which one of your friends BOUGHT DANIEL BRUSIVLOVSKY AN IMAC FOR COVERAGE ON TECHCRUNCH?
C’mon Sammy the truth will set you free. WHO BOUGHT DANIEL BRUSIVLOVSKY AN IMAC FOR COVERAGE ON TECHCRUNCH?
[+] [-] eslifka|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|16 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] patio11|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] davidw|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|16 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] starkfist|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ctingom|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] AdamN|16 years ago|reply
Anybody who forwards private emails is way beyond the pale of somebody who offers a MacBook Air for good coverage. The latter is an ethical lapse, the former is evidence of a deep character flaw.
Jason Calcanis owes the community a large, unequivocal apology through his newsletter - without ads and hyperbole.
[+] [-] covercash|16 years ago|reply
What part of this, if any, is constructive to the startup community?
[+] [-] _delirium|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gruseom|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] smokinn|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pilif|16 years ago|reply
Who cares about some crappy MacBook Air (that whould not have been fun to work with anyways) and a startup like so many others doing what so many others do?
There are so many much bigger issues than stuff like this. Get a grip.
Sorry. I had to vent. Now mod me down into oblivion. I guess European and US cultures don't quite mix - over here, stuff like this just is no big deal.
[+] [-] aresant|16 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jasonmcalacanis|16 years ago|reply