[AnotherHustler]

A respected book on this subject is McKee : Story: Style, Structure, Substance, and the Principles of Screenwriting.

The principle is simple, each atomic item (a moment / a beat etc.) in the story needs to represent a polar change in human values (e.g. Love->Hate, Hope->Despair etc.) - atomic items are grouped into higher levels (scenes), which again have an overarching change in values, and again these levels are grouped into even higher levels (acts etc.) which repeat the same pattern. Finally, at the top level - the story itself from the beginning to end also has the value change idea.

One of the things McKee taught me - if a scene, beat or moment doesn't have a change in values - then it's probably not interesting (filler) and you should think about cutting it.

Hope this helps anyone interested in story structure... I highly recommend reading McKee.

[tossaway1]

Can you describe what a polar change in values would be on a small scale (moment/beat)? I can kind of understand at the scene level but even then I don't feel like most stories have many scenes with polar changes. I must not be interpreting this correctly...

[danielvf]

I picked a really random scene from the screenplay of the Lord of the Rings, Fellowship. Here's just the opening lines, setting us up for the real scene payoff later.

------

Nighttime. Boromir wanders up to a painting on the wall, depicting Isildur cutting the Ring from Sauron's finger and his sword breaking. He looks in awe at it,

(Peaceful)

then suddenly turns as he hears a faint noise.

(Changes from peaceful to alarm)

He sees Aragorn reading and looks at him quizzically.

(Changes from alarm to puzzled. B though he was the only human in with the elves. )

BOROMIR: You are no elf

(B politely tries to get information)

ARAGORN: Men of the South are welcome here

(A politely replies with absolutely no information about himself)

BOROMIR: (nods) Who are you ?

(Changes to directly asking)

ARAGORN: I'm a friend of Gandalf the Grey.

(A still doesn't say who he is. Says he a good guy though)

BOROMIR: (nods) Then we are here on a common purpose.

(Says he's also a good guy. Plays a status move to establish his leadership. )

B: (he pauses) friend.

(Offers friendship)

Aragorn just looks back at him.

(Denied)

Boromir turns, a little confused. He notices a statue of a lady holding an elven shield with broken sword pieces on it....

(Attention shifts off Aragorn)

Boromir: The shards of Narsil (he picks up the hilt part of the broken sword) The blade that cut the Ring from Sauron's hand...

(B opened the scene by looking at memories of old ledgends. Legends just changed to reality. )

-----

So behind what looks like a polite conversation between strangers, beat by beat what the character expects to happen as a result of his actions does not happen. We've established that Boromir's confidence is only skin deep, that the legends are real, and that Aragorn is a heck of a mysterious dude. In about 30 seconds, this will reverse and the audience will finally know who Aragorn is and why he is that way....

https://youtu.be/B1uGDjSVLOk

[iopq]

And then there's a movie like Clerks which has a lot of filler, but ends up being endearing. Most of the dialogue is just people saying funny random stuff.

[huxley]

If you enjoyed that approach, it's worth checking out the Nouvelle Vague/New Wave films.

Channel Criswell did a decent short intro:

https://youtu.be/0R7R0JHvvgo

[mathgeek]

Clerks actually has a lot of polar changes in that filler, though. As the topics of conversation change, your mind goes with it and your emotions shift. Similar to other "geek out" movies.

[erikb]

Yes, but don't hang on it too much. Some part of story telling is, for instance, also to stay in that moment, enjoy it, explore it. Or to put it in another way, sometimes the change doesn't have to come from you, it happens inside the reader/viewer/player, like when studying a painting. Always enforcing change can be too harsh on the other people's mind.

[viewtransform]

The downside for consumers is that once you know the patterns that storytellers follow, it becomes one of those 'can't unsee it' things that just stand out in movies. It's only the few good movies that manage to draw you into the story despite the obvious story telling pattern.

[noblethrasher]

On the other hand, knowing how something is made can let you appreciate it on a whole other level, because you're aware of all the constraints and how they were satisfied (which is an art unto itself).

[perseusprime11]

Very Interesting! This will work great for creating good presentations.

[mxstbr]

Thanks for the recommendation, will definitely check that out!