I'm so frustrated with Microsoft. I want to like them -- I'm using (and loving) C# and Visual Studio, I've used Visual Studio Code with Go and Typescript, I'm using whatever they call their cloud version control system, and I'm really enjoying these things... but then they pull moves like this and make me question as to whether I really want to invest my skills and money in their tech. Say what you will about Google's data mining, but I think that putting ads right in the OS is in a whole other league. And as many of us geeks know, this is inevitably going to lead to calls from friends and family trying to figure out what the heck this thing popping up is, and if it's a virus. "Nope, it's just Microsoft."
I feel bad for the MS employees who are making awesome products but then have to deal with all the ridiculous fallout of Windows 10 decisions. Sorry for the rant, but these actions are honestly making me think about discontinuing my use and support of Microsoft's products, and I hope that someone somewhere is listening to us geeks.
That's why I don't like MS, and don't buy the whole "New MS and OS rainbows and unicorns" bit.
I judge companies on how they behave when they're "at the top" - MS in the late 90s-early 00's or Google (Android and search) in the late 00's - now.
The reason is that companies at the bottom have to behave nicely (Cyanogen learned that the hard way), community-cred is literally all they have. You judge companies behavior once they get to the top and can do whatever they want.
Now, back to the topic, MS was losing developer cred lately(and don't want to become IBM), so what do they do? They Open Source some developer tools and part of their language (less than Java, BTW). Oh, they also realize that developers were switching to Apple and Linux, so they added WSL.
It's not they became ethical, it's not that they're stopping vendor lockin, it's not that they're going to finally fully document the Win32 API (their online documentation is quite often inaccurate), it's not that they're going to allow you to stop their spying (unless you're a huge business who had enough purchasing power to actually leave - try telling the CIA that if they're using Windows, everything they type is seen at MS). They're at the top there and don't need to do any favors to anyone.
Totally agreed. I really like Windows 10 - and then you have things like the advertising, forced resets of default browsers, forced reboots, and other things which, as a power user, do exactly nothing except piss me off.
If they just focused on the feature delivery and stopped trying to push their crap, it would be a legitimately great OS. Every time something like this happens, I get a little closer to jumping to a Linux desktop for good.
Quite frankly, I liked the old Microsoft a lot more. Yes, things were more proprietary and closed, but at least they seemed to leave you alone once you paid for the product.
Now it makes perfect sense why the Windows 10 upgrade was "free", and they're giving away/opening up so much other software. They want to become like Google or any other ad-supported company, luring users in with the free/openness but then "monetising" them in this way. And I do not like that at all.
I found myself in a similar situation back in 2011. The .NET ecosystem went stagnant as resources were shifted towards the upcoming Windows 8 release, and that in turn made everything weird. That weirdness continues today in the form of UWP.
I'm glad I extricated myself from their ecosystem when I did. As much as I loved C# and wanted Microsoft to succeed, it felt very much like being on board a sinking ship.
what really pisses me off, is a fact that somewhere in microsoft there was an actual meeting (even many), where this phrase “Show sync provider notifications.” was PROPOSED by a human (like you and me), then discussed and approved.
They're intelligent ones. And no, no some shady/remote executive. One of us (maybe a little more product oriented) who then wrote in some internal memo: "Using this phrase will result in tricking users of not disabling it. It's better to conceal it and not write the truth. It's better to cheat".
And then they signed it off and went home to their families and children. YUCK.
And these "how to stop Microsoft from pissing you off" tips are really a losing game for users, and Microsoft knows it.
Sure, maybe 0.01% of the market will always stop whatever Microsoft is pushing, but let's face it, most don't have time to learn all the tricks on how to stop all of Microsoft's tracking or advertising and whatnot. Plus, I bet Microsoft will change how this works in a near-future update, so this tip will become invalid. It did something similar for the tracking features that were getting stopped by people and tools early on.
One of Microsoft's flaws had long been that the left hand doesn't know what the right is doing. It acts more like a collection of independent companies than a cohesive whole, and this giving while taking is one more example of it.
I switched away from ms some time ago. I almost left Ubuntu because of the one Amazon link that comes in the default install.
Operating systems are abundant nowadays. Something has to be really good to not switch away from based purely on its own merit.
The real problem is compatibility with applications. I bet the real thing holding most to a single OS is that availability of their applications on a given OS.
The virus fear by family is worse than you suggest: now, it will be difficult to remotely diagnose whether they have a nasty virus/trojan/infected system or whether it's just Windows. They are emulating behavior from bad actors. I can't imagine how this got approved.
Google's data mining where Google aggregates a full profile about you and some billion other people. And (except china-like) there is no simple 'checkbox' to switch off. THIS, I call 'a whole other league'!
-- Of course I don't like the intrusion by MS either, but if people don't pay for the product (and updates!), this is what happens. Worse with Google/Facebook and now also with MS.
When they started "admitting" that they made a mistake with the way they pushed the Win10 upgrade onto unwilling users, I was hoping that it was an early sign that they realized that they made a mistake, and were slowly working on reversing it.
The fact that they continue to roll out this sort of user-hostile "features" shows that it was just an empty marketing gesture.
Time to start some bounties on making Linux usable for desktop, I guess.
As seemingly one of the older guys on HN these days, I went through this kind of frustration several times already with Microsoft.
In the late 80s / early 90s Windows was, in my personal opinion, one of the worst UIs. It wasn't even a proper OS. Nearly every other personal computer shipped a better windowing system. But IBM-compatible PCs were dominant so whichever windowing system monopolised on that was going to be dominant regardless of their quality. This made me grumpy.
But then Windows 95 came along and it was actually pretty impressive. I liked Windows 95 - for a bit. However it didn't take long for the 9x to show it's warts and instead of fixing the constant stream of kernel panics, fixing their reliance on DOS bootloaders, or even just adding desperately needed power user tools (many power users like myself ended up writing our own utilities to get around Windows 9x's short comings) Microsoft just kept bundling new features; forcing the system requirements to jump significantly with each new iteration for seemingly no real functional benefit. Windows ME was easily the worst of all Microsoft's OS (it made Vista look usable in comparison).
But thankfully there was an alternative to the Windows 9x line, and to ME specifically. Microsoft had done some serious investment into their NT line and released Windows 2000. Hooray as because they added so many much needed usability little tweaks: shortcuts to Notepad (back then people still actually used Notepad) so no more clicking File->Save for quick edits. Windows 2000 was also rock solid compared to the Windows 9x range. In fact the only times I've managed to BSOD Windows 2000 was when playing around with undocumented APIs - so pretty much my own fault.
Windows 2000 also looked doubly good because around that time Mac users were stuck on OS 9 (albeit OS X was released shortly after). Mac OS 9 was just as poor as Windows 9x in terms of the frequency one would need to reinstall. Linux was obviously around at that time but we're talking before the time when people even joked about "this year will be the year of the Linux desktop". Linux was usable but a long way from being a recommendable desktop solution for those who want something to "just work". There was another option back then though: BeOS. Sadly by the time of Windows 2000 BeOS was in it's twilight years. Struggling to gain any traction and suffering from the blow of Apple buying up Next (and Jobs). I still used BeOS 5 a fair bit around that time though but more for fun than for productivity as Windows 2000 had better software support, better development tools, etc.
This was when I started to forgive Microsoft for releasing such substandard software in the 80s and 90s. It didn't last long though. XP was twice as resource hungry, twice as ugly and -upon it's initial release- offers nothing of benefit to 2000 aside quickly booting times. XP obviously branched off significantly with each new service pack but it was too late because I held onto 2000 for a long while and then by the time XP really evolved into a new entity, desktop Linux was already good enough that I'd migrated to it as my main OS (only using Windows for specialised "pro" tools). Then with the release of Vista I ditched Microsoft entirely. To be honest I'm glad I did because with each new release of Windows it's felt like control has been inched away from the power user in favour of dumbing things down for the tech-illiterate home users.
As someone who spent their entire career OS-hopping with no real alliance it was painfully obviously how Microsoft was hurting competition. But I guess that's what you do when you're on top. If you're an underdog then you fight for market share by being better at particular things - lots of things if needed. But when you're at the top it's all about retaining market share - so you focus on keeping people on your platform. A priority which doesn't necessarily fall in line with being technically the "best". However the internet has dislodged the importance of the OS. In many ways the browser is now the kernel. Sure many people -myself included- still prefer native applications but the rise of web apps has done more to aid Linux adoption than anything any single company has contributed (Canonical included). Bill Gates could see this coming though. Hence why he tried to dominate the webspace with Internet Explorer and platform specific web controls like ActiveX and it's predecessors. He did a pretty good job too - for a while.
I actually don't hate Windows 10. I have it on a spare work laptop as an emergency in case I manage to foobar my other Linux machines (I run Arch, so it's not too difficult to break if I'm feeling careless - but usually equally easy to fix as well). WSL is a nice feature, miles better than Cygwin ever was. The cmd terminal finally has some much needed usability tweaks. Overall it reminds me of the subtle usability improvements Windows 2000 pushed that made me warm to Windows nearly 2 decades ago. But I'm happy with Linux - it functions the way I personally find the most productive and, frankly, I doubt I would ever trust Microsoft as my primary platform again anyway. However it is amusing to watch new power users go through the same highs and lows with Microsoft as I had done in the 90s. It's just another one of those cyclic trends I've observed in IT (along with technology being discovered and reinvented)
Yes, it makes one wonder what's next, advertising in Visual Studio? Advertising in the command line shell? Third-party advertising in programs you compiled?
Yes this. I can't bring myself to upgrade our Windows PCs for fear of having to seek and destroy constant advertising when I'm just trying to get stuff done. I'm happy to pay for MS services but don't shove it in my face when it's inappropriate, and don't give me a sales pitch.
Maybe I am a linux hermit, but you guys really abide this shit? I can't fathom a tech savvy person giving this kind of software a pass anymore. I know, lock in, standards, etc. But damn.
I ran Linux for 19 years, leaving for macOS a few years ago, but I work for a boss who LOVES Microsoft. He's awesome. Fairly technical (but out of date), awesome at corporate politics, cares about his employees: all-around great guy. But Microsoft can do no wrong in his eyes. He still has a Windows phone and watch, when he knows the platform has been effectively dead for over a year or more.
I think what it boils down to is that he's abdicated his technical thinking to Microsoft because he can't keep up with it any more. When Microsoft was at it's 90's peak, he concluded that he could snuggle into their product-bosom, and ride out the rest of his career on his knowledge of Visual Basic. He wasn't necessarily wrong, but it's a decision that he doesn't have the bandwidth to reevaluate now, as his career is centered around managing. So he just ignores all of these kinds of articles. I guess that's one approach.
People at much higher levels in large companies are in much the same boat. They make purchasing decisions based on Microsoft doing no wrong, and give them the capital to ignore feedback from the public sector. And that's why we are where we are.
> Maybe I am a linux hermit, but you guys really abide this shit?
Didn't Ubuntu do something like this with search in the past? These companies love to cream off whatever extra income they can get. Turning operating systems into services, with their increasing reliance on expensive cloud data centers is only going to make the problem worse.
In the enterprise space you used to buy "Software assurance" to make sure you were always licenced to have the latest version.
NOW, with Win10, Software assurance is the reverse. you have to PAY EXTRA to make sure that your win10 version DOESNT get new feature updates. To keep it at certain level. (ie prior to when they started pumping it full of adverts).
To me thats a stand-over tactic... "Nice OS you got there... it'd be a shame if something was to 'Appen to it..."
Every time I install Ubuntu I have to remove amazon links from my dock. So I dunno how niche the other side of, "you guys" is, but it's not simply Linux vs. Windows.
I set a group policy when i first installed it over a year ago to disable all telemetry and advertising. I have never once seen any of these big stories people keep posting about Win10.
The problem I think is the same one that ISPs face: some products really should be “boring” but companies hate that. Just like ISPs hate being dumb pipes that do a good job and stay out of your way, Microsoft just can’t resist being in your face when it really has no business doing so.
The ideal OS, much like the ideal ISP, stays the hell out of the way and does an excellent, efficient job, doing only what you need it to do.
I'm a bit conflicted about this. I don't want ads in my OS either. But I don't think this occasion is such a big problem. Microsoft offers a paid OneDrive plan, and they have to let people know how to subscribe. The UI of OneDrive happens to be File Explorer. Granted, I would prefer the banner to be shown only in the OneDrive "Folder" and not in Quick Access.
I find other things much more annoying:
- I really like the random lockscreen pictures. But sometimes, I get ads for Xbox Games or movies from the Windows Store. It seems inappropriate at work, and people think I'm a fan of game XY although I've never heard about it before.
- On one PC, I get the infamous "Try edge, it is 20% faster than Firefox" every time I start Firefox. I assume (strongly hope) that this is a glitch...
- A OneDrive ad that really annoys me is a popup window, telling me to login to OneDrive (and possibly purchase something, IDK). It opens at startup, and at random times when using office. I think when an application tries to open a file that doesn't exist on a network drive triggers it also (!?). I can deactivate it, but it comes back after some time.
I have no need for OneDrive (as I already use Dropbox and Nextcloud). It's fine that you offer it to me once, but please let me opt out and never be bothered again.
----
On the positive side, maybe this means that there will be finally a proper common integration of sync providers? Every service places their icons in different places. Dropbox, Nextcloud, OneDrive, Google Drive, CERNBox (proprietary service at work). It would be really funny, because then this would mean the linked tip is another one of those frequently repeated tips that actually make you experience worse (as you can't see when a future Dropbox is trying to tell you there was a sync failure...).
While I still think Windows 10 is essentially the best version of Windows Microsoft has released (I think it in some ways more than Windows 7 and other ways less) moves like ads and the forced updates / restarts just really bring down the quality. I don't understand why they would shoot themselves in the foot so badly.
It's baffling how many ad spaces they have in this paid for operating system. By default, there's not only this, but also "notifications" that are ads and lock screen ads. I would understand it if it was free, but my employer probably paid $100 or more for it.
With all the tech giants now engaged in a veritable race to the bottom, it is a good time to point out that people who work at these places seriously reconsider opening their mouths (or typing the words their brain thinks) when there are arguments around ethical practices in business.
Somehow I am reminded of this essay by PG:
"The other big force leading people astray is money. Money by itself is not that dangerous. When something pays well but is regarded with contempt, like telemarketing, or prostitution, or personal injury litigation, ambitious people aren't tempted by it. That kind of work ends up being done by people who are "just trying to make a living." (Tip: avoid any field whose practitioners say this.)"
Have you noticed how close to telemarketing the entire Windows 10 upgrade process was, especially to Windows 7 customers who were very happy with their OS?
As a Mac user I don't really see how this is any different from when you fill up the paltry iCloud Drive space on OS X and it shows a message every time you boot where both options of the dialog box take you to the iCloud pref pane to buy more storage.
> (Ad-like notifications for OneDrive do appear in File Explorer in the Anniversary Update, but people running the Creators Update are now seeing actual advertising)
At somepoint I think windows 10 would be my best desktop ever since the interface is good, hardware compatability is good and the release of things like Linux Subsystem and new Powershell is awesome. But now it left me with great discouragement to use it. Beside the general privacy concern with it for a long time, now it got these ads and more. Common Microsoft, you are better than this.
Does any know an alternative version of windows 10 costing extra $$ for which is guaranteed without "telemetry" "forced updates" and other hostility? 3rd party add-ons to disable this behavior are just temporary hacks.
If there isnt a 'windows-10-guaranteed-isolated-edition' kicking around windows 7 will be the last microsoft OS I ever install on bare metal.
To me this is as dumb as my kitchen table having ads laminated on it. Windows is the table on which I do my work. I don't want to see it or notice it, I just want it to support me and my stuff and be a damn good table.
I've not seen anything to suggest they've fundamentally changed since then. The Microsoft that wrote the following in 2002:
"Messages that criticize OSS, Linux, & the GPL are NOT effective. Messaging that discusses possible Linux patent violations, pings the OSS development process for lacking accountability, attempts to call out the 'viral' aspect of the GPL, and the like are only marginally effective in driving unfavorable opinions around OSS, Linux, and the GPL, and in some cases backfire. On the other hand ‘positive’ OSS, Linux, and GPL messages are very effective - both across geographies and audiences."
... is still with us today, and their current strategy is merely a reflection of their assessment of their marketing.
The 'nice' Microsoft you see today is a PR exercise based on their discoveries, 15 years ago, about the (in)effectiveness of FUD tactics against open source software.
There must be a solution for corporate IT that doesn't involve endless settings. Does the Enterprise edition (or whatever it's called now) exclude these features?
When I dared to question publicly Micro$oft's motives in releasing and open sourcing .net core, I was downvoted and swarmed by the community, who are probably just grateful for a little good will from a long time enemy.
But I am convinced this good will was a ruse, a charade, to excuse their questionable business practices at the the expense of the consumer. Advertising directly inside the O.S. is a good example.
And we, who reaped the benefits of this goodwill, are more likely to turn the other cheek when they are out of line - especially if (god forbid) our product relies on Windows.
"Oh, that's just Micro$oft being Micro$oft again."
"But what about all the good things they've done lately?"
So reading TFA, it's simply ads for OneDrive/Office 365 (MS File Sync Products Only). Not general 3rd party ads like it makes it sounds. I still don't like the change but it's not nearly as bad as full blown ads.
Is there a tool / script to "fix" Windows 10 related privacy issues. I want to create a new user on my laptop but I dread going through tonnes of obscure settings to make Windows 10 usable.
[+] [-] muraiki|9 years ago|reply
I feel bad for the MS employees who are making awesome products but then have to deal with all the ridiculous fallout of Windows 10 decisions. Sorry for the rant, but these actions are honestly making me think about discontinuing my use and support of Microsoft's products, and I hope that someone somewhere is listening to us geeks.
[+] [-] greenhouse_gas|9 years ago|reply
I judge companies on how they behave when they're "at the top" - MS in the late 90s-early 00's or Google (Android and search) in the late 00's - now.
The reason is that companies at the bottom have to behave nicely (Cyanogen learned that the hard way), community-cred is literally all they have. You judge companies behavior once they get to the top and can do whatever they want.
Now, back to the topic, MS was losing developer cred lately(and don't want to become IBM), so what do they do? They Open Source some developer tools and part of their language (less than Java, BTW). Oh, they also realize that developers were switching to Apple and Linux, so they added WSL.
It's not they became ethical, it's not that they're stopping vendor lockin, it's not that they're going to finally fully document the Win32 API (their online documentation is quite often inaccurate), it's not that they're going to allow you to stop their spying (unless you're a huge business who had enough purchasing power to actually leave - try telling the CIA that if they're using Windows, everything they type is seen at MS). They're at the top there and don't need to do any favors to anyone.
MS is simply business as usual.
[+] [-] cheald|9 years ago|reply
If they just focused on the feature delivery and stopped trying to push their crap, it would be a legitimately great OS. Every time something like this happens, I get a little closer to jumping to a Linux desktop for good.
[+] [-] userbinator|9 years ago|reply
Now it makes perfect sense why the Windows 10 upgrade was "free", and they're giving away/opening up so much other software. They want to become like Google or any other ad-supported company, luring users in with the free/openness but then "monetising" them in this way. And I do not like that at all.
[+] [-] rl3|9 years ago|reply
I'm glad I extricated myself from their ecosystem when I did. As much as I loved C# and wanted Microsoft to succeed, it felt very much like being on board a sinking ship.
[+] [-] rdslw|9 years ago|reply
They're intelligent ones. And no, no some shady/remote executive. One of us (maybe a little more product oriented) who then wrote in some internal memo: "Using this phrase will result in tricking users of not disabling it. It's better to conceal it and not write the truth. It's better to cheat".
And then they signed it off and went home to their families and children. YUCK.
[+] [-] timcederman|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mtgx|9 years ago|reply
Sure, maybe 0.01% of the market will always stop whatever Microsoft is pushing, but let's face it, most don't have time to learn all the tricks on how to stop all of Microsoft's tracking or advertising and whatnot. Plus, I bet Microsoft will change how this works in a near-future update, so this tip will become invalid. It did something similar for the tracking features that were getting stopped by people and tools early on.
[+] [-] Bjartr|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sqeaky|9 years ago|reply
Operating systems are abundant nowadays. Something has to be really good to not switch away from based purely on its own merit.
The real problem is compatibility with applications. I bet the real thing holding most to a single OS is that availability of their applications on a given OS.
[+] [-] e40|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chappi42|9 years ago|reply
There is one checkbox to switch off the ad
Google's data mining where Google aggregates a full profile about you and some billion other people. And (except china-like) there is no simple 'checkbox' to switch off. THIS, I call 'a whole other league'!-- Of course I don't like the intrusion by MS either, but if people don't pay for the product (and updates!), this is what happens. Worse with Google/Facebook and now also with MS.
[+] [-] tgsovlerkhgsel|9 years ago|reply
The fact that they continue to roll out this sort of user-hostile "features" shows that it was just an empty marketing gesture.
Time to start some bounties on making Linux usable for desktop, I guess.
[+] [-] tw04|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] laumars|9 years ago|reply
In the late 80s / early 90s Windows was, in my personal opinion, one of the worst UIs. It wasn't even a proper OS. Nearly every other personal computer shipped a better windowing system. But IBM-compatible PCs were dominant so whichever windowing system monopolised on that was going to be dominant regardless of their quality. This made me grumpy.
But then Windows 95 came along and it was actually pretty impressive. I liked Windows 95 - for a bit. However it didn't take long for the 9x to show it's warts and instead of fixing the constant stream of kernel panics, fixing their reliance on DOS bootloaders, or even just adding desperately needed power user tools (many power users like myself ended up writing our own utilities to get around Windows 9x's short comings) Microsoft just kept bundling new features; forcing the system requirements to jump significantly with each new iteration for seemingly no real functional benefit. Windows ME was easily the worst of all Microsoft's OS (it made Vista look usable in comparison).
But thankfully there was an alternative to the Windows 9x line, and to ME specifically. Microsoft had done some serious investment into their NT line and released Windows 2000. Hooray as because they added so many much needed usability little tweaks: shortcuts to Notepad (back then people still actually used Notepad) so no more clicking File->Save for quick edits. Windows 2000 was also rock solid compared to the Windows 9x range. In fact the only times I've managed to BSOD Windows 2000 was when playing around with undocumented APIs - so pretty much my own fault.
Windows 2000 also looked doubly good because around that time Mac users were stuck on OS 9 (albeit OS X was released shortly after). Mac OS 9 was just as poor as Windows 9x in terms of the frequency one would need to reinstall. Linux was obviously around at that time but we're talking before the time when people even joked about "this year will be the year of the Linux desktop". Linux was usable but a long way from being a recommendable desktop solution for those who want something to "just work". There was another option back then though: BeOS. Sadly by the time of Windows 2000 BeOS was in it's twilight years. Struggling to gain any traction and suffering from the blow of Apple buying up Next (and Jobs). I still used BeOS 5 a fair bit around that time though but more for fun than for productivity as Windows 2000 had better software support, better development tools, etc.
This was when I started to forgive Microsoft for releasing such substandard software in the 80s and 90s. It didn't last long though. XP was twice as resource hungry, twice as ugly and -upon it's initial release- offers nothing of benefit to 2000 aside quickly booting times. XP obviously branched off significantly with each new service pack but it was too late because I held onto 2000 for a long while and then by the time XP really evolved into a new entity, desktop Linux was already good enough that I'd migrated to it as my main OS (only using Windows for specialised "pro" tools). Then with the release of Vista I ditched Microsoft entirely. To be honest I'm glad I did because with each new release of Windows it's felt like control has been inched away from the power user in favour of dumbing things down for the tech-illiterate home users.
As someone who spent their entire career OS-hopping with no real alliance it was painfully obviously how Microsoft was hurting competition. But I guess that's what you do when you're on top. If you're an underdog then you fight for market share by being better at particular things - lots of things if needed. But when you're at the top it's all about retaining market share - so you focus on keeping people on your platform. A priority which doesn't necessarily fall in line with being technically the "best". However the internet has dislodged the importance of the OS. In many ways the browser is now the kernel. Sure many people -myself included- still prefer native applications but the rise of web apps has done more to aid Linux adoption than anything any single company has contributed (Canonical included). Bill Gates could see this coming though. Hence why he tried to dominate the webspace with Internet Explorer and platform specific web controls like ActiveX and it's predecessors. He did a pretty good job too - for a while.
I actually don't hate Windows 10. I have it on a spare work laptop as an emergency in case I manage to foobar my other Linux machines (I run Arch, so it's not too difficult to break if I'm feeling careless - but usually equally easy to fix as well). WSL is a nice feature, miles better than Cygwin ever was. The cmd terminal finally has some much needed usability tweaks. Overall it reminds me of the subtle usability improvements Windows 2000 pushed that made me warm to Windows nearly 2 decades ago. But I'm happy with Linux - it functions the way I personally find the most productive and, frankly, I doubt I would ever trust Microsoft as my primary platform again anyway. However it is amusing to watch new power users go through the same highs and lows with Microsoft as I had done in the 90s. It's just another one of those cyclic trends I've observed in IT (along with technology being discovered and reinvented)
[+] [-] roryisok|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] LoSboccacc|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] amelius|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] skywhopper|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|9 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] Neliquat|9 years ago|reply
Maybe I am a linux hermit, but you guys really abide this shit? I can't fathom a tech savvy person giving this kind of software a pass anymore. I know, lock in, standards, etc. But damn.
[+] [-] TheRealDunkirk|9 years ago|reply
I think what it boils down to is that he's abdicated his technical thinking to Microsoft because he can't keep up with it any more. When Microsoft was at it's 90's peak, he concluded that he could snuggle into their product-bosom, and ride out the rest of his career on his knowledge of Visual Basic. He wasn't necessarily wrong, but it's a decision that he doesn't have the bandwidth to reevaluate now, as his career is centered around managing. So he just ignores all of these kinds of articles. I guess that's one approach.
People at much higher levels in large companies are in much the same boat. They make purchasing decisions based on Microsoft doing no wrong, and give them the capital to ignore feedback from the public sector. And that's why we are where we are.
At least, that's the way I think it works.
[+] [-] Drumlin|9 years ago|reply
Didn't Ubuntu do something like this with search in the past? These companies love to cream off whatever extra income they can get. Turning operating systems into services, with their increasing reliance on expensive cloud data centers is only going to make the problem worse.
[+] [-] senectus1|9 years ago|reply
In the enterprise space you used to buy "Software assurance" to make sure you were always licenced to have the latest version.
NOW, with Win10, Software assurance is the reverse. you have to PAY EXTRA to make sure that your win10 version DOESNT get new feature updates. To keep it at certain level. (ie prior to when they started pumping it full of adverts).
To me thats a stand-over tactic... "Nice OS you got there... it'd be a shame if something was to 'Appen to it..."
[+] [-] paulddraper|9 years ago|reply
Our shit-abiding tolerance is higher than you might think.
[+] [-] Waterluvian|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] altrego99|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] SippinLean|9 years ago|reply
I can see a philosophical opposition to this stuff, but practically it doesn't affect me at all.
[+] [-] rjbwork|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dorian-graph|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|9 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] makecheck|9 years ago|reply
The ideal OS, much like the ideal ISP, stays the hell out of the way and does an excellent, efficient job, doing only what you need it to do.
[+] [-] captainmuon|9 years ago|reply
I find other things much more annoying:
- I really like the random lockscreen pictures. But sometimes, I get ads for Xbox Games or movies from the Windows Store. It seems inappropriate at work, and people think I'm a fan of game XY although I've never heard about it before.
- On one PC, I get the infamous "Try edge, it is 20% faster than Firefox" every time I start Firefox. I assume (strongly hope) that this is a glitch...
- A OneDrive ad that really annoys me is a popup window, telling me to login to OneDrive (and possibly purchase something, IDK). It opens at startup, and at random times when using office. I think when an application tries to open a file that doesn't exist on a network drive triggers it also (!?). I can deactivate it, but it comes back after some time.
I have no need for OneDrive (as I already use Dropbox and Nextcloud). It's fine that you offer it to me once, but please let me opt out and never be bothered again.
----
On the positive side, maybe this means that there will be finally a proper common integration of sync providers? Every service places their icons in different places. Dropbox, Nextcloud, OneDrive, Google Drive, CERNBox (proprietary service at work). It would be really funny, because then this would mean the linked tip is another one of those frequently repeated tips that actually make you experience worse (as you can't see when a future Dropbox is trying to tell you there was a sync failure...).
[+] [-] BinaryIdiot|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] xelxebar|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bajsejohannes|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hota_mazi|9 years ago|reply
Disappointed in you, Microsoft.
And I say this as someone who's been really enjoying Windows 10 and Microsoft's recent opening to the world at large.
[+] [-] thr0waway1239|9 years ago|reply
Somehow I am reminded of this essay by PG:
"The other big force leading people astray is money. Money by itself is not that dangerous. When something pays well but is regarded with contempt, like telemarketing, or prostitution, or personal injury litigation, ambitious people aren't tempted by it. That kind of work ends up being done by people who are "just trying to make a living." (Tip: avoid any field whose practitioners say this.)"
http://www.paulgraham.com/love.html
Have you noticed how close to telemarketing the entire Windows 10 upgrade process was, especially to Windows 7 customers who were very happy with their OS?
[+] [-] intoverflow2|9 years ago|reply
It's sucky but definitely not just an MS thing.
[+] [-] speg|9 years ago|reply
> (Ad-like notifications for OneDrive do appear in File Explorer in the Anniversary Update, but people running the Creators Update are now seeing actual advertising)
[+] [-] PleaseHelpMe|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pweissbrod|9 years ago|reply
Does any know an alternative version of windows 10 costing extra $$ for which is guaranteed without "telemetry" "forced updates" and other hostility? 3rd party add-ons to disable this behavior are just temporary hacks.
If there isnt a 'windows-10-guaranteed-isolated-edition' kicking around windows 7 will be the last microsoft OS I ever install on bare metal.
[+] [-] nkrisc|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] duncan_bayne|9 years ago|reply
http://www.catb.org/esr/halloween/
I've not seen anything to suggest they've fundamentally changed since then. The Microsoft that wrote the following in 2002:
"Messages that criticize OSS, Linux, & the GPL are NOT effective. Messaging that discusses possible Linux patent violations, pings the OSS development process for lacking accountability, attempts to call out the 'viral' aspect of the GPL, and the like are only marginally effective in driving unfavorable opinions around OSS, Linux, and the GPL, and in some cases backfire. On the other hand ‘positive’ OSS, Linux, and GPL messages are very effective - both across geographies and audiences."
... is still with us today, and their current strategy is merely a reflection of their assessment of their marketing.
The 'nice' Microsoft you see today is a PR exercise based on their discoveries, 15 years ago, about the (in)effectiveness of FUD tactics against open source software.
[+] [-] ouid|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hackuser|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wodencafe|9 years ago|reply
But I am convinced this good will was a ruse, a charade, to excuse their questionable business practices at the the expense of the consumer. Advertising directly inside the O.S. is a good example.
And we, who reaped the benefits of this goodwill, are more likely to turn the other cheek when they are out of line - especially if (god forbid) our product relies on Windows.
"Oh, that's just Micro$oft being Micro$oft again."
"But what about all the good things they've done lately?"
[+] [-] nightski|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] inertial|9 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DanBC|9 years ago|reply
It'll be interesting to see if this is compatible with UK regulation of advertising, which says that any adverts must be clearly identified as ads.