Skype lies, breaks "Skype-to-Skype"calls are free promise

[Yaggo]

Not fair. I pay my operator a monthly fee for mobile data (10 € for unlimited 384 kb/s including two SIMs / devices, to be exact). Skype pays for their incoming/outgoing data – it doesn't cost extra for them whether the data is originated from mobile network or <any-type> network. Skype is simply not justified to charge extra based on client's connection type, not even if I used Iridium network to route my bytes to them. Maybe Skype has grown big enough to behave as asshole and they know it.

[sjs]

Skype-to-skype is cool but when you're tethered to a computer and internet connection it clearly has limited to value to most people.

Now that phones that run apps and have internet connections are popular the game is changed entirely. They had to give it away for free before because it wasn't as useful. When you can use this on the go it becomes much more useful and they will see many more people using it.

When things change that drastically sometimes you have to re-evaluate your business model.

[stellar678]

This probably has to do with whether or not a device is able to participate in Skype's p2p call routing. If being on 3g introduces too much latency or has too limited bandwidth to contribute in the network, then each client will have a marginal cost to Skype. Maybe they're trying to ensure they can keep up with that.

Or maybe they're just grubbing for money.

[gsiener]

Interesting point. Though I thought I read recently that their planned switch to SIP would end p2p functionality.

[iamdave]

I'm intensely curious who's pulling the strings behind this, is Skype really to blame or is it the mobile carriers putting pressure on them to collect more ARPU by creating yet another fee to collect from subscribers.

[ryanhuff]

Skype was sold for multiple billions of dollars. The purchasing group must have seen some untapped opportunity to generate revenue that eBay was not able to effectively address. So, I think its realistic to think that this turn of events is tied to the purchasing group's revenue strategy, and not carrier action.

With that said, if this ends up only applying to AT&T, and not other countries iPhone apps, then its clear who's to blame. I didn't see anything in the article that noted this was limited to AT&T.

[sukuriant]

my bet is on the mobile carriers putting pressure on them, especially AT&T. The last I checked, Skype was still plenty free for Verizon. In fact, it seemed like Verizon and Skype took time to make sure their system worked wonderfully together, forcing local calls to go through Verizon themselves, international to have the option of going through Skype, and Skype to Skype going through a special phone number. In fact, I just tested Skype on my Motorola Droid on Verizon's service. It works wonderfully and said nothing of a soon ending of the free service.

[papersmith]

Most, if not all pay-as-you-go plans have an expiration date.

[evanwolf]

Skype will break its freemium promise to Skype users in three months. Skype for iPhone will require a subscription to make Skype-to-Skype calls over 3G/Edge starting in September 2010 according to Skype. This changes things from "Skype-to-Skype calls are free", which they've been saying since launch, to "Skype-to-Skype calls are free over landlines and Wi-Fi unless your Verizon or Three mobile operator subsidizes your service."

Skype has no marginal cost if I make that iPhone 3G call. Why are they charging separately?

Presumably subscriptions will apply to future use of Skype-to-Skype on Blackberry, Nokia, and Android phones.

[stcredzero]

Skype has no marginal cost if I make that iPhone 3G call.

If I were AT&T and I could start charging Skype for 3G calls, I would do it.

[neonfunk]

From Skype's perspective, how is the cell network different from any other ISP? It's the carriers who will shoulder the burden; and there's no indication that any of the fee is going to them, given that Skype says "operator fees may still apply". I don't get it.

[viraptor]

It's many times more useful to use Skype on your mobile. If you're on 3G, it means you have no access to desktop Skype. And if it's more useful to you, they can charge for it.

[paul9290]

Upon seeing this I am contemplating canceling AT&T service - keeping my iphone and get a Verizon or Sprint MiFi router and use Skype to place the calls, as well use my Google VOice number to ring my skype in number. I use my GV # now anyway so I can just forward it. I dont talk on the phone that much more so text, facebook, email and twitter.

Im not sure im going to do this but it's tempting even more when skype will be able to run in the background on my 3GS when 4.0 comes out. I would save myself $10 to $20 a month doing this. THe MiFi I can carry in my wallet.

[stretchwithme]

was it a promise to be free forever? or just one of their features, which they are free to change whenever they wish?

[milkshakes]

http://www.skype.com/intl/en/security/safety/safe-payments/

Skype-to-Skype calls will always be free

[riobard]

I'm wondering how long Skype calling in fring <http://www.fring.com>; will remain for free.

[loyaltyspace]

What a sensationalist headline.

So what if they've introduced charges? If someone else provides this for free, go there. If not, cough up!

[arbitraryperson]

But they gave me their word!

[freescale]

I agree the sensationalist headline. The moderators should delete this submission. Inflammatory headlines do nothing to encourage discussion.

[cookiecaper]

I guess I don't think it's that big of a deal. When Skype promised "free Skype-to-Skype", I don't think they considered that they would eventually be used on smartphones. It'd probably be smarter if they'd just charged a few bucks from the app first place, though.

This may also be a condition imposed by Apple, because people with unlimited data plans would use Skype instead of their (limited) included airtime, which I'm sure doesn't make cellular partners too happy.

[jallmann]

But does Skype via 3G actually cost them more than a WiFi call? Assuming their calls still use the data network, it's not like they have to buy and maintain gateway equipment. I don't see how the smartphone issue is relevant.

I agree though, that this move may be more political than anything else w.r.t cellular partners.

[dc2k08]

When I bought my last phone nearly three years ago, the selling point was that pre-installed skype app worked for free over their 3G network and skype to skype calls were free. Skype out calls were barred though. I presume this new charge only applies to iphones? If it is the case that Apple badgered them into applying a charge which some are suggesting, I presume this information will leak at some stage. Won't be good PR if true.

[bbatsell]

I can think of absolutely zero reasons, technical or otherwise, that Apple would want Skype to charge for only its iPhone software, much less a reason strong enough to "badger" them into charging. Isn't it far more likely that Skype's new buyers see that they need to begin to monetize their largest usage stream in order to survive, especially since that usage stream has started to migrate to more "usable" platforms?

[moolave]

Somewhere, some company will level the playing field on this feature. It's happened to phone companies, why not on this app?

[pixelcort]

Does this have anything to do with a potential difficulty in establishing direct connections between Skype clients that are both on 3G networks? Are they running relays for these clients that they are trying to recuperate from?

[ephealy]

I was already considering a full jump to Google Voice. This may seal the deal.

[adrianscott]

I think they started lying earlier when they offered 'unlimited' that isn't really unlimited, but subject to a so-called fair use policy. I would call that 'virtually unlimited'. FTC, where are you??

[johnrob]

I lost any trust for Skype the first time they emailed me that I had 7 days to use some credit or they would confiscate all of it. How is that not theft?

[pdx]

That was discussed here, probably when you brought it up last time. It's the same reason that gift cards expire and properly written NDA's have time limits. Nobody wants to owe somebody something until the universe dies, especially accountants, and especially if the people to whom that debt is owed, are dead or have forgotten about it. It would be insane to carry it on your books until doomsday.

[jodrellblank]

It's not theft if, when paying them money to give as credit, you agreed to use it within a certain time frame.

[spicyj]

Although that's partly true, I believe you only have to use one minute of the credit and the rest will stick around for another 12 months.

[RabidChihuahua]

Skype mobile is really a different kind of product. If they want to charge for it they are entitled. Phone calling is getting cheap enough as is.

[bdfh42]

Skype not playing honest with their customers? Hardly news is it? I dropped them several years ago because of basic dishonesty on their part.

[cabalamat]

I'm not bothered by this, because it's their funeral. There are other VoIP programs, it's not particularly difficult to write one, and with Android set to dominate open-architecture 3G phones, something else will dominate VoIP. Hopefully, something open source and using an open protocol. (SIP?)

Oh and if you bought an iPhone and can't access the cost-free VoIP solution? That'll teach you to buy locked-down hardware, you idiot[1].

1: this description does not apply to people who took an eyes-open decision to buy locked-down hardware, knowing it was locked down, realising the consequences and accepting them.

[rmc]

It's not easy to create a competitor to Skype.

Skype's main attraction is not the technology, but the network effect and it's closed system. You could make a cool SIP client for Android/iPhone/etc. but it wouldn't matter because you wouldn't be able to talk to 90% of the mundane's who only have Skype.

[neonfunk]

iPhone? I'm sure this will apply to Skype's Andrioid client, too. (Also, "you idiot"? Really?)

[bruceboughton]

Can you explain what this has to do with the iPhone hardware? Skype is charging for this, not Apple or the telcos, right?

[mcantelon]

My guess is Google is gearing up to do to VoIP what it did with email.

[DaniFong]

Skype won in part because other attempts at VoIP didn't work very well. There are lots of practical problems in just getting a p2p connection to work, there are often firewalls to route through. Trying to debug these is not helpful when you're just trying to find a way to talk with your mom.

[ig1]

I'm guessing the reasoning behind this is that phone based Skype calls actually cost Skype money because more data has to be routed via them rather than the peer-to-peer infrastructure that regular desktop Skype uses. If there's a technical reason why this is the case (i.e. you can't use peer-to-peer on phones because of bandwidth issues) then I can't see how a competitor would be able to undercut them without finding someone to subsidise it.

[dalore]

What are some good alternative providers?