Why was this underwhelming ? Elon unveiled the most important aspects - speed, range, safety, price and the range anxiety question - how many superchargers.
I agree that his delivery style is underwhelming and there's a lot of debate about that. I am personally fine with an underwhelming presentation and an overwhelming product.
130 mph top speed for the base model.
Weight: 3549 lb.
220 mile range.
The design mission of this car is very conservative: freeway travel at 70-80 mph, for several hours, with 4 people and their luggage. The payload (I'll guess 900lb) is similar to what you'd need in a Toyota or Mercedes.
However, this is lousy for urban vehicles/pedestrians/congestion. For example, in San Francisco, I need a 50 mph vehicle that can carry 2 people. And at 50 mph, I can drive to Palo Alto in less than an hour.
Could Tesla give me a 1000lb/50mph vehicle? I bet SpaceX could.
Am I the only person in the world who thinks that having a touch screen as the primary interface in a car is a horrible idea? Why is it illegal to mess with our phones while driving but it's ok if it's a built-in touch screen?
I drive a car from 1997, and feel the all-analog cabin is one of the things I'll miss the most in a future automobile. Muscle-memory for the climate controls set in really quickly and even with an aftermarket radio I can still do nearly all common adjustments without looking away from the road or even really thinking about it.
I know someone who drove a second-generation Prius. Sure, yeah, it was 2007, but that awful resistive touchscreen paired with a clunky interface has made me very skeptical of touchscreen controls in cars.
Where I live (Australia) the law is against using a "hand held" mobile phone while driving. The purpose behind the law is to leave your hands available for controlling the vehicle. That is why you can use a "hands free" mount for your phone, and still click on the GPS button or the answer call button for example, while driving.
While I'm happy to clarify your question at least from an Australian point of view (as to why it is illegal to mess with your phone while driving), I actually agree with your main point - that having a touch screen as the main interface is a strange idea.
Having said that, perhaps Tesla tested this a bunch and decided on merit that it works well. Maybe I'm just not used to a touch screen since I miss having a physical knob to turn or button to push. I certainly do miss the tactile edges on certain physical controls - so I can find the right doohickey to press by feeling or counting the edges with my fingers.
No, in almost any discussion about Tesla cars, someone expresses that opinion. There are physical controls on the steering wheel though. You have for example 2 scroll-wheel buttons which can be used to adjust settings while driving without touchscreen interaction.
One consideration in the law's distinction might be that the driver features on touch screens are designed to reduce required attention (or at least consider it during design), while typing a text requires a lot of effort and distraction because phone UX can assume your focus. Touch doesn't really matter, though; you can get similar distraction manipulating even a relatively simple radio, and people do hurt themselves playing with the radio.
There is also a front passenger to consider, though I do concede that point when alone.
Range: 220 miles (EPA estimated)
Supercharging rate: 130 miles of range per 30 minutes .
Home charging rate: 30 miles of range per hour (240V outlet, 32A)
Deliveries begin: Fall 2017
Performance
0-60 mph: 5.6 seconds
Top speed: 130 mph
Interior
15” touchscreen display
Dual zone climate control system
FM/Internet streaming radio
Textile seating
Front Center console with open storage and two USB ports
Convenience
Onboard maps and navigation
Wi-Fi and LTE internet connectivity
Keyless entry and remote climate control using the Tesla app
Voice activated controls
Bluetooth hands-free calling and media streaming
60/40 split folding rear seat to maximize cargo options
Back-up camera
Auto dimming rear-view mirror
One-touch power windows throughout
Power-adjustable side mirrors
12-volt power outlet
Safety
Full LED exterior lighting
Seven cameras, forward radar and twelve ultrasonic sensors enabling active safety technologies including collision avoidance and automatic emergency braking
Six front row and two side curtain airbags
Three-point safety belts with belt-reminders for driver and four passengers
Two LATCH (Lower Anchors and Tethers for Children) attachments in second row
Electronic stability and traction control
Four-wheel antilock disc brakes with electronic parking brake
Child safety locks
Anti-theft alarm system
Tire pressure monitoring system
Warranty
Vehicle: 4 year, 50,000 mile limited warranty
Battery warranty: 8 year, 100,000 mile (120,000 mile with Long Range Battery)
OPTIONS
Long Range Battery – $9,000
Range: 310 miles
Supercharging rate: 170 miles of range per 30 minutes
Home charging rate: 37 miles of range per hour (240V outlet, 40A)
0-60 mph: 5.1 seconds
Top speed: 140 mph
Deliveries begin: July 2017
Paint
Solid Black: Standard
Midnight Silver Metallic: $1,000
Deep Blue Metallic: $1,000
Silver Metallic: $1,000
Pearl White Multi-Coat: $1,000
Red Multi-Coat: $1,000
Wheels
18” Aero: Standard
19” Sport: $1,500
Premium Upgrades Package – $5,000
Upgraded interior with additional features and premium materials.
Premium heated seating and cabin materials throughout, including open pore wood décor and two rear USBs
12-way, power adjustable front seats, steering column and side mirrors, with custom driver profiles
Premium audio system with more power, tweeters, surround speakers and subwoofer
Tinted glass roof with ultraviolet and infrared protection
Auto dimming, power folding, heated side mirrors
LED fog lamps
Center console with covered storage and docking for two smartphones
Enhanced Autopilot – $5,000
Model 3 will match speed to traffic conditions, keep within a lane, automatically change lanes, transition from one freeway to another, exit the freeway and self-park at your destination.
Additional features will roll out over time through software updates.
Full Self-Driving Capability – $3,000 (requires Enhanced Autopilot) In the future, Model 3 will be capable of conducting trips with no action required by the person in the driver’s seat.
This feature is dependent upon extensive software validation and regulatory approval, which may vary by jurisdiction.
VEHICLE SPECIFICATIONS
Dimensions & Weight
Length: 184.8”
Width: 76.1” (72.8” with mirrors folded)
Height: 56.8”
Wheelbase: 113.2”
Track (wheel center): 62.2” front and rear
Ground clearance: 5.5”
Head room, standard: 39.6” front row, 37.7” second row
Head room, glass roof: 40.3” front row, 37.7” second row
Leg room: 42.7” front row, 35.2” second row
Shoulder room: 56.3” front row, 54.0” second row
Hip room: 53.4” front row, 52.4” second row
Seating capacity: 5 adults
Luggage capacity: 15 cubic feet
Curb weight:
3549 lbs. (Model 3)
3814 lbs. (Model 3 Long Range)
Weight distribution:
47% front, 53% rear (Model 3)
48% front, 52% rear (Model 3 Long Range)
Body
Hybrid steel/aluminum body
Drag coefficient of 0.23
Chassis
Double wishbone, virtual steer axis front suspension with coil over twin-tube shock absorbers and stabilizer bar
Independent multi-link rear suspension with twin-tube shock absorbers and stabilizer bar
Variable ratio, speed sensitive electronic power steering
Electromechanically boosted four wheel anti-lock disc brakes with electronic brake force distribution
18” Aero or 19” Sport wheels with all-season tires
Standard Accessories
240 volt NEMA 14-50 adapter
120 volt NEMA 5-15 adapter
J1772 public charging adapter
20 foot mobile connector with storage bag
> Full Self-Driving Capability – $3,000 (requires Enhanced Autopilot) In the future, Model 3 will be capable of conducting trips with no action required by the person in the driver’s seat.
I think there are some huge caveats to this claim, above and beyond those here. A whole list of asterisks. To be selling, -today-, for $3,000 (on top of $5,000) a claim of Full Self Driving is hugely optimistic, and, I think, misleading.
How many years away, realistically, is full self driving outside of well-maintained sunny (but not TOO sunny!) roads? I don't see this thing cruising through a Pittsburgh winter any time soon.
It's one thing to promise, in the marketing sense. It's another to be charging money for it now when it's really yet another pre-order, this time with nothing close to a timeline.
I've been wondering for a while what type of radio Tesla is installing in their cars. I assume it has AM/FM capabilities but what type of streaming does it have? Is it XM/Sirius compatible? Does it have Google Play/iTunes capabilities? Is it streamed from your cell phone?
Hope some of them go to reviewers since Tesla doesn't seem to want to tell us very much about the vehicle they've build.
And I know people get all up in arms when you criticise Tesla; but let's be honest, there's a lot more to a vehicle than just the range and outside appearance. For example, do the rear seats fold down? Is there rear air vents? Spare tire? HD Radio? Do the mirrors fold in? Any other vehicle, even on release day, these are trivial questions that are answered. But we cannot answer much about the Model 3, except its range and 0-60.
And by the way Tesla's website got updated, but only contains 0-60/range/and a vague note about having autopilot hardware (which is odd in itself as there are three tiers of Tesla's autopilot hardware available).
> For example, do the rear seats fold down? Is there rear air vents? Spare tire? HD Radio? Do the mirrors fold in? Any other vehicle, even on release day, these are trivial questions that are answered. But we cannot answer much about the Model 3, except its range and 0-60.
> The ventilation system is a marvel, stretching in one long strip that spans the front seat.
> The touch screen allows both the driver and the passenger to instantly direct a wide flow of air wherever they want it.
> The scrolling dials on the steering wheel move in all four directions and allow you to adjust everything from the side windows to the music playlist.
None of that matters now because you can't buy one yet. They kept their promise to reveal the production car in July 2017 and start deliveries. Anything more than that subjects the S and X to the Osborne Effect.
The cars all went to employees. There will be no news from their owners.
Elon said it in the live stream, they have built 50 Model 3 in production. 30 got delivered at the event 20 are going to be used internally. Production ramps up from that, the target rate for December is 5000/week, expect the production numbers to raise in the months in between.
There are some pretty big worries[1] about tesla's plans for hitting the sales target with the Model S. I remember watching very sad stories on GM's EV car way back in the day.
Basically they want to sell 100K cars within this year this is ~5 times what they sold with the model X/S last year. Time will tell though...
That is not correct. They sold about 80k S/X last year, with the X still growing, achieving 100k does not sound too far-fetched, they sold 47k cars in the first two quarters of the year. The article is extremely biased and full of FUD. The transition to 100kWh batteries was not without problems, that is why they kept the 90kWh option until last quarter. As usual, Tesla might have been slightly optimistic with their timing of the transition from 90 to 100 kWh, consequently there was a slight delay in getting enough 100kWh vehicles made. But they managed to build 25k vehicles in the second quarter as planned. Deliveries lag behind that, as many vehicles have been made but not delivered yet.
They said it comes with all the hardware necessary but that didn't seem to provide any more information about software and being able to enable it for customers, i.e. regulation and certification of those capabilities.
I think both Audi and Volvo have said they will accept 100% liability for crashes in autonomous mode but I haven't seen a similar statement from Tesla yet.
[+] [-] slg|8 years ago|reply
The lower capacity one will start at $35k, have 220 mile range, 5.6 sec 0-60 time, and 130 mph top speed.
The higher capacity one will start at $44k, have 310 mile range, 5.1 sec 0-60 time, and 140 mph top speed.
EDIT: For comparison the Chevy Bolt starts at $37,495, has 238 mile range, 6.3 sec 0-60 time, and 91 mph top speed.
[+] [-] nealyoung|8 years ago|reply
Looks like the first production cars will start at $49k, with no $35k cars available until November.
[+] [-] deepGem|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] blendo|8 years ago|reply
The design mission of this car is very conservative: freeway travel at 70-80 mph, for several hours, with 4 people and their luggage. The payload (I'll guess 900lb) is similar to what you'd need in a Toyota or Mercedes.
However, this is lousy for urban vehicles/pedestrians/congestion. For example, in San Francisco, I need a 50 mph vehicle that can carry 2 people. And at 50 mph, I can drive to Palo Alto in less than an hour.
Could Tesla give me a 1000lb/50mph vehicle? I bet SpaceX could.
At least Motor Trend did really like the Model 3's handling: http://www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2018/exclusive-...
[+] [-] greglindahl|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ntaylor|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tdiggity|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nodesocket|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zippergz|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tmilburn|8 years ago|reply
I know someone who drove a second-generation Prius. Sure, yeah, it was 2007, but that awful resistive touchscreen paired with a clunky interface has made me very skeptical of touchscreen controls in cars.
[+] [-] hiisukun|8 years ago|reply
While I'm happy to clarify your question at least from an Australian point of view (as to why it is illegal to mess with your phone while driving), I actually agree with your main point - that having a touch screen as the main interface is a strange idea.
Having said that, perhaps Tesla tested this a bunch and decided on merit that it works well. Maybe I'm just not used to a touch screen since I miss having a physical knob to turn or button to push. I certainly do miss the tactile edges on certain physical controls - so I can find the right doohickey to press by feeling or counting the edges with my fingers.
[+] [-] _ph_|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sliken|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jsmthrowaway|8 years ago|reply
There is also a front passenger to consider, though I do concede that point when alone.
[+] [-] mandeepj|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shard972|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] grecy|8 years ago|reply
It's extremely, extremely positive.
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2018/exclusive-...
[+] [-] RodericDay|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tdiggity|8 years ago|reply
I found a YouTube livestream from a fan that’s decent. So if you’re also having problems, go here: https://youtu.be/cBZeJaqa6ZM
[+] [-] SteveGregory|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] function_seven|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] smachiz|8 years ago|reply
Price – $35,000
Standard Battery
Range: 220 miles (EPA estimated) Supercharging rate: 130 miles of range per 30 minutes . Home charging rate: 30 miles of range per hour (240V outlet, 32A) Deliveries begin: Fall 2017
Performance
0-60 mph: 5.6 seconds Top speed: 130 mph Interior
15” touchscreen display Dual zone climate control system FM/Internet streaming radio Textile seating Front Center console with open storage and two USB ports Convenience
Onboard maps and navigation Wi-Fi and LTE internet connectivity Keyless entry and remote climate control using the Tesla app Voice activated controls Bluetooth hands-free calling and media streaming 60/40 split folding rear seat to maximize cargo options Back-up camera Auto dimming rear-view mirror One-touch power windows throughout Power-adjustable side mirrors 12-volt power outlet
Safety
Full LED exterior lighting Seven cameras, forward radar and twelve ultrasonic sensors enabling active safety technologies including collision avoidance and automatic emergency braking Six front row and two side curtain airbags Three-point safety belts with belt-reminders for driver and four passengers Two LATCH (Lower Anchors and Tethers for Children) attachments in second row Electronic stability and traction control Four-wheel antilock disc brakes with electronic parking brake Child safety locks Anti-theft alarm system Tire pressure monitoring system
Warranty
Vehicle: 4 year, 50,000 mile limited warranty Battery warranty: 8 year, 100,000 mile (120,000 mile with Long Range Battery)
OPTIONS
Long Range Battery – $9,000
Range: 310 miles Supercharging rate: 170 miles of range per 30 minutes Home charging rate: 37 miles of range per hour (240V outlet, 40A) 0-60 mph: 5.1 seconds Top speed: 140 mph Deliveries begin: July 2017
Paint
Solid Black: Standard Midnight Silver Metallic: $1,000 Deep Blue Metallic: $1,000 Silver Metallic: $1,000 Pearl White Multi-Coat: $1,000 Red Multi-Coat: $1,000
Wheels 18” Aero: Standard 19” Sport: $1,500
Premium Upgrades Package – $5,000 Upgraded interior with additional features and premium materials.
Premium heated seating and cabin materials throughout, including open pore wood décor and two rear USBs 12-way, power adjustable front seats, steering column and side mirrors, with custom driver profiles Premium audio system with more power, tweeters, surround speakers and subwoofer Tinted glass roof with ultraviolet and infrared protection Auto dimming, power folding, heated side mirrors LED fog lamps Center console with covered storage and docking for two smartphones
Enhanced Autopilot – $5,000 Model 3 will match speed to traffic conditions, keep within a lane, automatically change lanes, transition from one freeway to another, exit the freeway and self-park at your destination.
Additional features will roll out over time through software updates.
Full Self-Driving Capability – $3,000 (requires Enhanced Autopilot) In the future, Model 3 will be capable of conducting trips with no action required by the person in the driver’s seat.
This feature is dependent upon extensive software validation and regulatory approval, which may vary by jurisdiction.
VEHICLE SPECIFICATIONS
Dimensions & Weight
Length: 184.8” Width: 76.1” (72.8” with mirrors folded) Height: 56.8” Wheelbase: 113.2” Track (wheel center): 62.2” front and rear Ground clearance: 5.5” Head room, standard: 39.6” front row, 37.7” second row Head room, glass roof: 40.3” front row, 37.7” second row Leg room: 42.7” front row, 35.2” second row Shoulder room: 56.3” front row, 54.0” second row Hip room: 53.4” front row, 52.4” second row Seating capacity: 5 adults Luggage capacity: 15 cubic feet Curb weight: 3549 lbs. (Model 3) 3814 lbs. (Model 3 Long Range) Weight distribution: 47% front, 53% rear (Model 3) 48% front, 52% rear (Model 3 Long Range)
Body
Hybrid steel/aluminum body Drag coefficient of 0.23 Chassis
Double wishbone, virtual steer axis front suspension with coil over twin-tube shock absorbers and stabilizer bar Independent multi-link rear suspension with twin-tube shock absorbers and stabilizer bar Variable ratio, speed sensitive electronic power steering Electromechanically boosted four wheel anti-lock disc brakes with electronic brake force distribution 18” Aero or 19” Sport wheels with all-season tires Standard Accessories
240 volt NEMA 14-50 adapter 120 volt NEMA 5-15 adapter J1772 public charging adapter 20 foot mobile connector with storage bag
[+] [-] FireBeyond|8 years ago|reply
I think there are some huge caveats to this claim, above and beyond those here. A whole list of asterisks. To be selling, -today-, for $3,000 (on top of $5,000) a claim of Full Self Driving is hugely optimistic, and, I think, misleading.
How many years away, realistically, is full self driving outside of well-maintained sunny (but not TOO sunny!) roads? I don't see this thing cruising through a Pittsburgh winter any time soon.
It's one thing to promise, in the marketing sense. It's another to be charging money for it now when it's really yet another pre-order, this time with nothing close to a timeline.
[+] [-] Corrado|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] vuyani|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nixgeek|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ntaylor|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ryanmarsh|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ntaylor|8 years ago|reply
Definitely was not necessary to provide payment info to view.
[+] [-] Fej|8 years ago|reply
Will they start selling parts to independent mechanics? (Will we have to eventually force them to?)
[+] [-] UnoriginalGuy|8 years ago|reply
And I know people get all up in arms when you criticise Tesla; but let's be honest, there's a lot more to a vehicle than just the range and outside appearance. For example, do the rear seats fold down? Is there rear air vents? Spare tire? HD Radio? Do the mirrors fold in? Any other vehicle, even on release day, these are trivial questions that are answered. But we cannot answer much about the Model 3, except its range and 0-60.
And by the way Tesla's website got updated, but only contains 0-60/range/and a vague note about having autopilot hardware (which is odd in itself as there are three tiers of Tesla's autopilot hardware available).
[+] [-] ttam|8 years ago|reply
Here are some answers: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-29/tesla-s-m...
> The ventilation system is a marvel, stretching in one long strip that spans the front seat.
> The touch screen allows both the driver and the passenger to instantly direct a wide flow of air wherever they want it.
> The scrolling dials on the steering wheel move in all four directions and allow you to adjust everything from the side windows to the music playlist.
[+] [-] sowbug|8 years ago|reply
The cars all went to employees. There will be no news from their owners.
[+] [-] _ph_|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chrisfrantz|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] itissid|8 years ago|reply
Basically they want to sell 100K cars within this year this is ~5 times what they sold with the model X/S last year. Time will tell though...
[1] https://seekingalpha.com/article/4085784-tesla-story-becomin...
[+] [-] _ph_|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Robotbeat|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gabrielgoh|8 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nixgeek|8 years ago|reply
I think both Audi and Volvo have said they will accept 100% liability for crashes in autonomous mode but I haven't seen a similar statement from Tesla yet.
http://fortune.com/2015/10/07/volvo-liability-self-driving-c... https://www.wired.com/story/self-driving-car-user-interface/
[+] [-] unknown|8 years ago|reply
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