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Apple Watch Series 3

84 points| mercutio2 | 8 years ago |daringfireball.net

130 comments

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[+] AVTizzle|8 years ago|reply
>> "When are you separated from your iPhone? When you’re exercising. What do you miss most when you’re away from your phone? Messages and phone calls."

Anecdotal, but personally, this is one of the most refreshing and cherished qualities about my exercise time: it's ME time. No messages, no phone calls. Phone goes on airplane mode, and I'm in my own zone for those 60-90 minutes.

After reading My Year with a Distraction Free iPhone* I took steps to drastically reduce notifications and social media apps from my phone (not as drastic as the article, but way quieter than before), and I feel happier for it.

Maybe it's just me, but MORE notifications, messages, and calls to my wrist sounds like exactly what I don't want.

* https://medium.com/time-dorks/my-year-with-a-distraction-fre...

[+] robterrell|8 years ago|reply
I do like having a distraction-free iphone, but I also like to run and hauling a huge phone with me is stupid. But I like to run on the trails on Mt Tam and it can feel surprisingly remote quickly, so I want to keep the ability to make phone calls somehow. I am looking forward to trying the watch for just this use case. (Also, music while running!) I'm assuming I can turn off notifs on the watch just like on the phone.
[+] dkonofalski|8 years ago|reply
That's the best part about this, though. I have a Series 2 and can already set Do Not Disturb on the watch and also set numbers that I want to come through even in DND. No notifications unless it's from my family or my boss when I'm on call.
[+] agumonkey|8 years ago|reply
Same, I understand the taste for continuous reachability. But god when I do run outside I want to free my mind and not stay linked.

The always-online thing is gone for me, but I understand it's entirely subjective. For those who still need or enjoy full reachability then a 3G watch is probably a great thing.

I also see other value:

- hard to lose, it's on your wrist, not in some pocket, etc.. - hard to pickpocket (thus) - probably more battery efficient than thos 5" n-core flat computers we call phones. I'd like a mp3 / time / map / gps tracker / notification instead of my smartphone.

One cons:

- so much radio waves on your wrist ... hmmm .. I'd wrap some tin foil underneath :)

[+] kpwags|8 years ago|reply
Agreed.

I have the series 2 and have started running without my phone since the series 2 can still track my runs without it. The one thing I kind of miss is listening to podcasts while running since I still would need my phone for that.

[+] maxerickson|8 years ago|reply
That's all orthogonal to what the watch is capable of doing. Just like with phones.

I think gps+cellular watches have a lot to offer. Too bad they are still expensive and have modest battery life.

[+] alienreborn|8 years ago|reply
Verge[1] (5/10), WSJ[2] has pretty negative reviews esp reg. battery and LTE reception and Apple acknowledged that problem in their statement. This has to be one of the worst reviewed Apple products in a while. However Wired[3] has good things to say about it and NYT[4] found it alright.

1. https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/20/16334066/apple-watch-seri...

2. https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-watch-series-3-review-unt...

3. https://www.wired.com/2017/09/review-apple-watch-series-3/

4. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/20/technology/personaltech/a...

[+] jhugg|8 years ago|reply
It says this has something to do with connecting to unsecured Wifi networks. That seems, amazingly, like something Apple testing might overlook. Who has unsecured networks these days?

It also sounds like a bugfix that could come shortly and make the review seem pretty dated.

EDIT: To clarify whoever is downvoting me, I’m not arguing that Apple shouldn’t have tested this. They really really should have. I just can see how they might not run across too many unsecured networks in their employee real-world tests.

[+] dkonofalski|8 years ago|reply
I'm sorry, but I kinda wanna call BS on this. The Verge review even admits that the connection issues were happening when the watch connected to a Wi-Fi network that they had connected to before. That's not really a reflection of the LTE connectivity, only a reflection that the watch can't connect and use Wi-Fi networks that require a captive portal where you can't sign in without your phone first. It seems really disingenuous to me for them to openly conflate those 2 things as a problem with the LTE connectivity.
[+] leggomylibro|8 years ago|reply
I was going to say...even this article's optimism seems disingenuous.

>Battery life has been fine. “All day” is about right — charging at night, using it all day

That does not sound anywhere close to 'fine' for a watch. I get annoyed at my Pebble Time's battery life from time to time, and it still lasts at least 5 days/nights on a charge.

[+] goodroot|8 years ago|reply
Phone anxiety is a weird, and, for me at least, irrational thing. I know that mankind survived for millennia without the ability to communicate with each other out of earshot. But once you get used to having your phone with you at all times, you get used to feeling that if anyone needs you, they can get you.

Apple Watch Series 3 with cellular networking completely alleviates this anxiety. It is not a replacement for a phone, and is not supposed to be. But it lets you leave your phone at home when you go for a run, or in your locker while you’re at the gym, or in your hotel while you go to the beach, and not worry in the least that you’re out of touch.

It alleviates the anxiety of leaving your phone at home by... further conditioning your dependence on interconnectivity? Blind logic is the dark-side of the reality distortion field.

Applied differently: To help me with my alcoholism, I leave my 40oz at the hotel or in my locker-room. Now, I just sip on it from a smaller container filled with liquor that I keep on my wrist.

If your phone generates anxiety, fix the issue.

[+] eridius|8 years ago|reply
The phone doesn't generate anxiety. Not having the phone generates anxiety. The Apple Watch series 3 with LTE fixes the issue. So what's the problem?

Your comment seems to be implying that being used to always being available if someone needs to contact you is a bad thing (e.g. is the same thing as alcoholism). But why? Personally, I'm all for disconnecting, but even when I'm not available to anyone else, I still want to be available if my wife needs to talk to me. And even if I didn't have a wife, that doesn't mean it's unreasonable for other people to want to be available at any time. And finally, even if you want to disconnect regularly, you may still want to disconnect on your terms rather than being forced to disconnect because of the activity you're doing at the moment (e.g. going for a run).

[+] nfriedly|8 years ago|reply
Hah, that's a great analogy. Except now I want a watch-shaped flask...
[+] amazingman|8 years ago|reply
>It alleviates the anxiety of leaving your phone at home by... further conditioning your dependence on interconnectivity? Blind logic is the dark-side of the reality distortion field.

You seem to be applying cold logic to human behavior. This is a bad strategy for understanding products.

>Applied differently: To help me with my alcoholism, I leave my 40oz at the hotel or in my locker-room. Now, I just sip on it from a smaller container filled with liquor that I keep on my wrist.

You're trolling, right? You have to be.

>If your phone generates anxiety, fix the issue.

Language games are fun! The (lack of) phone isn't generating anxiety, the human brain is. The (lack of) phone is merely a trigger. A trigger whose manifestations this product has been designed to dramatically reduce.

[+] sisk|8 years ago|reply
Perhaps I'm in the minority but I've decided to purchase this precisely to stay connected while running. To be fair, it's not the during that I'm worried about, it's the after. I've never been able to get used to running with a phone (or really anything other than a watch, for that matter) so I'm always disconnected while exercising. I often, however, participate in races with a handful of other people and have learned that standing in a predetermined meeting spot after a race for an indeterminate amount of time isn't a great solution.

When pebble announced the Pebble Core, I thought I'd finally found the answer to my problem: complete a race—having been completely disconnected—while still have the option to connect afterwards as a means of coordination.

When that product was killed off with the sale of Pebble to Fitbit, I was back to hoping someone would fill that niche. This watch now makes that viable. Yes, it's an expensive price to pay (particularly as compared to the Core) but you only have to stand around windy, 20℉ weather in running shorts for an hour once before the price becomes of less consequence.

[+] gamblor956|8 years ago|reply
A number of my friends purchased the AW2 for running, and none of them use it anymore. It simply doesn't have the battery life for long runs (>3 hours) if you're actually using the GPS. This rules it out for marathons, as it dies before you finish (even for BQ-qualifying times. And note, this was the non-LTE version of the watch; if the LTE version has worse battery life, you're not going to be organizing anything post-run with it.)

Additionally, they noted that sweat made using the AW2 problematic, due to the way the touch screen interacted with sweat. It's not a problem once you finish and can wipe it off, but it's a definite issue during the run itself.

Finally, the GPS on the AW2 sucks. It's the quality of early-2000s GPS watches. The watch is great for tracking time, but if you're trying to track pace or distance, you're going to need another data source.

Best bet post-race: keep your phone in your race bag, grab the bag after you finish, and use your phone to coordinate.

[+] mikestew|8 years ago|reply
but you only have to stand around windy, 20℉ weather in running shorts for an hour once before the price becomes of less consequence.

Way off-topic, but if you’re standing around for an hour without going back to the car, putting on warm clothes, and coming back, technology is not the problem here. Grab your phone while you’re getting your sweatpants, BTW.

[+] 5_minutes|8 years ago|reply
Though always well written, Daring Fireball’s articles are always sprinkled with some fanboyism, I do miss a real critical and objective voice in his writing.

Because somehow the voice pretends it is.

But actually the glass is always a bit more than half full, no matter what.

[+] m_st|8 years ago|reply
My wife ordered one, upgrading from her first gen model. The single biggest reason is GPS tracking while running without being forced to carry her iPhone 6S Plus. And the (much) improved battery life over her first gen model.

She ordered the Series 3 with cellular, just in case it becomes affordable. But boy do we both agree that this red dot looks ugly. As Gruber mentions, we also worry that it won't work well with the otherwise really nice watch bands.

Can't have it all...

[+] jws|8 years ago|reply
There is a company which sells alternative color accents for the digital crown and button. http://watchdots.com

They are just stickers, but apparently they last well.

[+] Clubber|8 years ago|reply
I wonder if you could find a googly eye sticker to cover the red dot. I'd get a kick out of that. The cyclops!
[+] nfriedly|8 years ago|reply
Question for Apple Watch wearers: is Siri on the Apple Watch the exact same as Siri on the iPhone?

I ask, because it's not the case with the one on Android Wear - the watch version can't answer factoid-style questions ("What's the tallest building in Dayton, Ohio?"), can't identify songs, can't perform simple system commands ("Increase scree brightness"), etc.

It's still convenient and useful, but it's just not as good as I had expected.

I'm due for a phone upgrade sometime soon and starting to seriously think about switching from Android to iOS.

Update: it looks like phone version has regressed and can't identify songs any more :(

[+] matrixtransform|8 years ago|reply
Siri is much the same on the watch, except for when it can't answer a question - on the phone, it says "I found this on the web" which the watch can't do as it doesn't have a browser
[+] eridius|8 years ago|reply
Siri on the watch is the same as Siri on the phone, the only real difference is Siri on the watch will often tell you that you have to continue the question on the phone (e.g. if the answer requires searching the web or something of that nature).

Also, I haven't tested with iOS 11, but Siri on iOS 10 still recognizes songs just fine. I haven't tried recognizing a song with my watch though (and the question there is if the microphone on the watch is good enough to pick up the song well enough to identify).

[+] gallerdude|8 years ago|reply
With iOS 11 and watchOS 4, it feels like watchOS is taking aim for iOS, and iOS is taking aim for macOS. What’s Apple’s endgame here? The whole Mac Pro mini-crisis last year proved that professionals are a super loud minority, so they can’t flat out kill macOS.

I think they’ll just make iOS more and more attractive, while they make macOS more... iOS-like? And in turn, watchOS is an added benefit to iOS that macOS won’t fully utilize.

There’s some sort of uneasy tension here, I’ll be interested to see how it (slowly) develops.

[+] matrixtransform|8 years ago|reply
I notice that the watch now covers all 3 tentpoles from the original iPhone launch:

a phone, an ipod with touch controls and an internet communications device.

Of course, the iPhone is now marketed as a multipurpose computing device, a 4k video camera and an AR viewer, so things have moved on.

It would make sense to me to add more power-user features to MacOS in future, rather than making it more iOS-like? Apple made that mistake with Lion and the app grid with folders and massive icons that can't be resized is crappy to this day.

iOS won't be a MacOS replacement at least until all Apple's professional apps are available on it. Processing-wise they are probably only a couple of generations away from being able to support Final Cut Pro, Logic X and XCode, but interface-wise there is a huge amount of work involved in reinventing those apps as touch-first.

[+] eridius|8 years ago|reply
I don't think iOS is "taking aim" at macOS. But a lot of people do use the iPad as a primary computing device these days, and the new iPad features in iOS 11 are definitely aimed at making the device even better for these people. For the things an iPad can do, it should do them as best it possibly can. For the things an iPad can't do, or can't do well, there's always macOS. And making the iPad better at the things it can do well doesn't harm macOS in any way.
[+] js2|8 years ago|reply
> But it lets you leave your phone at home when you go for a run, or in your locker while you’re at the gym, or in your hotel while you go to the beach, and not worry in the least that you’re out of touch.

I'm a big fan of Apple. I own their stock, and I can count at least 10 Apple devices in my house at this moment. But the Apple Watch is not for me. I tried.

When I go for a run, I want to be out of touch. The only reason I ever take my iPhone on a run is so that I can take pictures or that I can reach someone else if I have an emergency. Mostly I don’t take my phone and when I do, it’s in do not disturb mode.

I'm a serious runner. I tried the first Apple Watch as running watch. It was inferior in that role to my Garmin at the time. But that Garmin wasn't a proper watch, it was really just for running. I liked the Apple Watch's fitness tracking features and that I could wear it all the time. But it just wasn't suitable for running with. So I would take it off when I went for a run and put on my Garmin, which means Apple didn't think I exercised at all. That was a bummer.

When Garmin came out with the 230, I immediately bought it. It could replace my existing Garmin for running, it was the size of a proper watch, battery life that lasts a week or more, and fitness tracking. Notifications if you want them.

I've since upgraded to the Garmin 935 and I love it. I don't see anything about the Series 3 that would compel me to purchase it. The touch screen is still an inferior interface to physical buttons if physical buttons will do the job. (In fact, the thing I hate most about taking my iPhone with me as a camera is that I can't take pictures with it when my hands are covered in sweat, which when I run, is mostly the case.)

The ironic thing is that it's the Apple Watch which got me used to the idea of wearing a watch all the time, and that made me realize the important of physical buttons, and that I don't want notifications on my watch.

[+] bgun|8 years ago|reply
> The only reason I ever take my phone is so that I can take pictures or that I can reach someone else if I have an emergency

That doesn't sound like you really want to be "out of touch" at all. When I go for a run, I want to become fitter, healthier, and a better runner. Apple isn't suggesting that the purpose of the device is to let you surf Facebook while you run; it's to do exactly what you said - have access if you need it.

[+] rconti|8 years ago|reply
Don't you have two wrists? Why not wear both? That's what I did when transitioning from Suunto for running to Apple Watch. I'm not a serious runner or athlete really, so Strava suffices for my daily bike commute and occasional runs, but I agree the touch interface is bordering on unusable at times, and autopause is not good enough to trust. (and, overall, optical HR sensors don't handle intervals (recovery) well.

My wife has a Forerunner 235 I bought for her and she LOVES it.

For serious runs (eg, half marathon or something) I still take the suunto just to have the 'real' data but I do that less and less.

[+] taloft|8 years ago|reply
Also have a Garmin 735xt for the same reasons. Another big issue is battery life. Garmin can go for a solid week or more between charges, while Apple Watch is about a day.
[+] heartbreak|8 years ago|reply
If you can sweaty-hands the Camera app open with the side swipe, you can use the volume up physical button to take a picture.
[+] JKCalhoun|8 years ago|reply
A year or so ago I saw that the Apple Watch is a stealth product category.

When Siri was capable enough to answer the things a Safari search would have provided me and when the watch got a cellular radio I might actually ditch my phone and just wear a watch.

One down.

[+] cschep|8 years ago|reply
I really like the automatic audio remote. I am a very happy AirPods user, but I missed being able to adjust the volume easily. Now I can glance at the watch and use the digital crown to change the volume, very slick!
[+] rconti|8 years ago|reply
I just upgraded my iPhone to iOS11 and my Series 2 Watch to WatchOS4 (which 2+ goddamned hours, but I digress), and noticed that Sonos allows me to use my watch to control volume!

I'm not sure what the various parameters are, but I fired up a podcast on the Sonos controller app on my phone, walked partay through the house, raised my wrist to check the time, and I had control for the sonos right there -- turned the crown, sure enough, volume went up! It was really cool. Hopefully the UX is intuitive enough that it won't be popping up all the time when i don't want it.

[+] minimaxir|8 years ago|reply
So why does the LTE Watch have the red dot anyways? I asked on Reddit and no one has any idea: https://reddit.com/r/apple/comments/70homi/so_why_does_the_a...

The most sensible theory is that it’s related to the LTE antenna, but Apple admitted in the Keynote the Watch screen is the antenna.

[+] jhugg|8 years ago|reply
It’s because in many parts of the world, people won’t buy expensive things unless there is some way for people to know you spent a lot of money and have the newest thing.

I hate the red dot too. Already ordered my WatchDots.

[+] arielweisberg|8 years ago|reply
I think it's so you can tell at a glance what generation watch you are looking at.

They did a similar change series 1 to 2.

There are people for whom that matters.

[+] alienreborn|8 years ago|reply
Probably the classic syndrome of design being dictated by branding/marketing.
[+] m_st|8 years ago|reply
Time to buy black nail polish... It sure is ugly.
[+] smakkadoula|8 years ago|reply
I suspect the person who wrote posted this blog isn't into fitness on any serious level beyond 'how many steps did i get in today'.

The first and second generation Apple Watches were average fitness companions at best. Even the weakest Garmin did the job far better. More specifically, the accelerometer was just awful unless you run at one pace, forever. For anyone who is actually interested in tracking real-time their peformance there are too many cheaper alternatives to justfiy this thing for fitness.

Apparently, this is not just my opinion: https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/02/apple-watch-review.html

[+] spiderfarmer|8 years ago|reply
Why does Gruber refuse to make his website responsive? For someone so focused on the elegance of Apple’s products, it seems strange that he forgets that his website looks like a forgotten/neglected website from the early 00’s.
[+] folksinger|8 years ago|reply
I read this as,

"Do you hate freedom? Buy yourself an Apple Watch and always, literally always, be shackled to someone else's priorities!"

I realize this is not a charitable interpretation but I feel like it deserves a counter-narrative.

[+] ksec|8 years ago|reply
I am still waiting on the report of W2 and Intel Modem. The first one i am hoping someday Apple will make their own 802.11ax WiFi Chipset for Router / Apple TV / Mac and iPhone. The latter because I am not aware of any Intel Modem that can be fitted inside a Apple Watch. It shows Intel aren't really far off in Modem space compared to Qualcomm if true.
[+] brentis|8 years ago|reply
This guy must get a monthly paycheck from Apple. He always comes out swooning over new Apple hardware despite everyone else slamming it. It’s a tired routine.

This is coming from someone with more Apple devices than I care to mention and even last week bought a new iMac. My personal phone however, is a Pixel.

[+] stepcellwolf|8 years ago|reply
I will buy it only when they fix the issue swimming in an ocean and loosing your watch. It happens to me in an open ocean. First fix the wrist and then I'll buy a new one.
[+] TomSawyer|8 years ago|reply
Were you swimming with a band that uses a magnetic clasp?
[+] eugenekolo2|8 years ago|reply
Do you guys actually read this website at the default size? The sites much more enjoyable at 150%...