> Of course, equating the Nobel committee with the Norwegian government is as wrong as equating a newspaper editor printing Islamic cartoons with it, then torching down an embassy.
This is very western way of seeing thing, which I happen to agree. The current Chinese education system has been trying very hard, and quite successfully, to mix these concepts together: country, geographic land, government, ethnic group in order to make the current political system legitimate by "natural".
Now, if you ask me what will happen to liuxiaobo, I'd bet 80%+ on that he will stay in prison. Based on my observation of the a few years after the tian'an'men massacre and the economic position China is having right now, I don't expect Chinese government to back off on this particular issue under external pressures. What'll happen is the news will soon move on to the next interesting topic and what's going on with China will continue on its path.
As a Chinese, I'm quite impressed by the fact that the Nobel committee has the gut to take the risk and stick with their own decision. I'd, humbly, call this the triumph of humanity since it values human rights and the pursue of personal freedom over pure economic considerations.
This is very western way of seeing thing, which I happen to agree. The current Chinese education system has been trying very hard, and quite successfully, to mix these concepts together: country, geographic land, government, ethnic group in order to make the current political system legitimate by "natural".
I agree as far as the current situation, but I don't think it's anything inherent about western or non-western ways of thinking, just a result of where Europe and China happen to be currently in their politics. Mixing country/land/government/ethnic-group into a "natural" whole used to be a very European idea as well, and was probably the dominant view of nation-states throughout the period of European ethnic nationalism in the 18th and 19th centuries.
I think that today it's unpopular in Europe partly because it's so associated with 20th-century fascism: no mainstream German today would want to promote the idea that the German people, the German land, the German state, and German culture are some sort of natural, unified whole, because that sort of rhetoric marks you out as a member of the far-right.
Even if the news moves on having the first Chinese citizen to win a Nobel Peace prize rotting in prison sends a strong message to the world, and to any Chinese citizens reading about their own country.
I don't think the Nobel committee has ever given out the price without having been slammed by someone or some government. The price is political so it's no wonder. Apparently, Chinese foreign affairs has already stated that this may damage Chinese-Norwegian relations (sorry no citation). Of course, equating the Nobel committee with the Norwegian government is as wrong as equating a newspaper editor printing Islamic cartoons with it, then torching down an embassy.
Of course, equating the Nobel committee with the Norwegian government is as wrong as equating a newspaper editor printing Islamic cartoons with it, then torching down an embassy.
Strictly speaking it's as wrong as the first part, the torching-an-embassy bit is a whole new level of wrong.
Chinese Foreign Ministry:
The Nobel Committee awarding Liu this prize, which runs contrary to the principle of the Peace Prize, will bring damage to two-way relations.
Here is the statement Mr Liu made to the court when being sentenced:
I hope to be the last victim of China's endless literary inquisition, and that after this no one else will ever be jailed for their speech.
Freedom of expression is the basis of human rights, the source of humanity and the mother of truth. To block freedom of speech is to trample on human rights, to strangle humanity and to suppress the truth.
When Dalai Lama received the prize in 1989, the relationship between Norway and China became ice cold for a few years. Then everything went back to normal. Presumably, that will be the turn of events this time as well.
This is not an award given by the Norwegian government. It is given by the independent Norwegian Nobel Committee. If the means anything for the chinese I don't know, but it is a huge difference with regard to the two countries political relations.
It should be marked as the most "unpeaceful" night of Nobel Peace Prize. As to date, More than ten people in Beijing and Shanghai who voluntarily celebrated the event were taken into custody.
Two most well-known Chinese liberals share the same name -Xiaobo, what a coincidence!
The other one is Wang Xiaobo, whose name is much more influencial in China.
China is going to be really mad! I hope they don't harm him for this. I guess the world is watching - now, but later? And secret less noticeable stuff?
According to Norwegian newspapers, he probably doesn't even know that he was nominated. The Nobel Institute have asked the Chinese government to tell Liu Xiaobo about the prize.
Liu Xiaobos wife says the Chinese police have allowed her to tell her husband about the prize on Saturday.
[+] [-] alexdong|15 years ago|reply
This is very western way of seeing thing, which I happen to agree. The current Chinese education system has been trying very hard, and quite successfully, to mix these concepts together: country, geographic land, government, ethnic group in order to make the current political system legitimate by "natural".
Now, if you ask me what will happen to liuxiaobo, I'd bet 80%+ on that he will stay in prison. Based on my observation of the a few years after the tian'an'men massacre and the economic position China is having right now, I don't expect Chinese government to back off on this particular issue under external pressures. What'll happen is the news will soon move on to the next interesting topic and what's going on with China will continue on its path.
As a Chinese, I'm quite impressed by the fact that the Nobel committee has the gut to take the risk and stick with their own decision. I'd, humbly, call this the triumph of humanity since it values human rights and the pursue of personal freedom over pure economic considerations.
[+] [-] _delirium|15 years ago|reply
I agree as far as the current situation, but I don't think it's anything inherent about western or non-western ways of thinking, just a result of where Europe and China happen to be currently in their politics. Mixing country/land/government/ethnic-group into a "natural" whole used to be a very European idea as well, and was probably the dominant view of nation-states throughout the period of European ethnic nationalism in the 18th and 19th centuries.
I think that today it's unpopular in Europe partly because it's so associated with 20th-century fascism: no mainstream German today would want to promote the idea that the German people, the German land, the German state, and German culture are some sort of natural, unified whole, because that sort of rhetoric marks you out as a member of the far-right.
[+] [-] avar|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] trunk|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sbt|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hugh3|15 years ago|reply
Strictly speaking it's as wrong as the first part, the torching-an-embassy bit is a whole new level of wrong.
[+] [-] sasvari|15 years ago|reply
Chinese Foreign Ministry: The Nobel Committee awarding Liu this prize, which runs contrary to the principle of the Peace Prize, will bring damage to two-way relations.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11499931
[+] [-] russellallen|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] russellallen|15 years ago|reply
Here is the statement Mr Liu made to the court when being sentenced:
I hope to be the last victim of China's endless literary inquisition, and that after this no one else will ever be jailed for their speech.
Freedom of expression is the basis of human rights, the source of humanity and the mother of truth. To block freedom of speech is to trample on human rights, to strangle humanity and to suppress the truth.
[+] [-] razin|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sasvari|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] RaRic|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] superos|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lovskogen|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] liuliu|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|15 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] 0_o|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thomasfl|15 years ago|reply
All Norwegian sites will probably blocked out too.
BTW. I live in Norway.
[+] [-] garply|15 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ars|15 years ago|reply
This link may be more informative: http://news.google.com/news/more?ncl=dbvIvqx2eu3bnMMiDfa9ho_...
China is going to be really mad! I hope they don't harm him for this. I guess the world is watching - now, but later? And secret less noticeable stuff?
Anyone know if he agreed to accept the prize?
[+] [-] user24|15 years ago|reply
It's clearly legitimate; highest rank on google for "nobel", listed on wikipedia as the official site, etc etc etc
[+] [-] geirr|15 years ago|reply
Liu Xiaobos wife says the Chinese police have allowed her to tell her husband about the prize on Saturday.