We launched our online CS academy with no upfront tuition almost two years ago.
Now with thousands of students enrolled and hundreds already employed and paying back we wanted to take the next step and open up access to folks who couldn’t afford to pay to survive while attending.
Of course, that introduces significant risk on our part, as students still only pay us back if they get a job paying $50k/yr or more, but we’ve spent the last two years perfecting our admissions and course to select hard-working folks who are likely to have what it takes to get hired and do everything we can to get them there.
For context, we have dozens of full-time interview sourcers and multiple companies per day coming in to interview our students - incentive alignment is powerful. Now that that’s working we can afford to take more risk.
We’re hoping we reach a point where anyone anywhere can move quickly to a high paying job, and only pay back if it works!
This is a far, far better deal than the one that I got for university (CS at a major US research institution, class of 2004), which involved a sticker price of about $140k, a work study assignment unjamming printers to justify ~$2k of wages per semester to cover (barely) the meal plan, and ~$X0k of non-dischargeable debt which started ticking the day I graduated, despite the fact that I was earning salaryman wages (~$30k) for the first 6 years of my career.
Lambda School is quite possibly the most impressive startup I'm presently aware of. They are going to hit tertiary education like a freight train.
I'm a current student at Lambda School going part time. So this is pretty biased:
I've been enrolled for about 6 months. I've had previous programming experience so I feel I've had a leg up. But had no idea how to use the skills or build anything. I've never felt this confident with what I've learned in my life. Period. Everyone I've interacted with is genuine, welcoming, and gives me the impression they want me to succeed. I'm truly grateful to be able to be enrolled and I look forward to working to be able to pay back the school the value they've imparted in me.
While I think what Lambda School does seems pretty great I have to wonder what will happen when the next recession hits. If their new grads aren't getting hired, they can't afford to pay for their current class. It feels like something that is only possible right now because of bubble economics and cheap VC capital.
@austenallred What's the catch? Lambda School has always struck me as scam like with a very vocal CEO and over promises.
What happens when regulators start cracking down on these practices and what makes you think Lambda will be successful when most bootcamps have failed or been acquired.
The catch is that you have to pay us back if it works.
What makes Lambda School different than other code schools is a few things:
1. Our incentives are entirely aligned with the student. We don’t get paid unless they get hired so juicing revenue numbers with weak students just isn’t interesting, in fact it’s fatal.
2. We put an insane amount of time, money, effort and energy into instructional design. Lambda School is nine months long, and includes a computer science curriculum most bootcamp grads need (and lack).
Regulators love us - they’re sick of for profit schools promising a lot and delivering little except debt. We’re the antidote to that. That’s why there’s so much hype.
I agree that Lambda School sounds too good to be true, but once you start looking they've got real answers for just about everything. I'm a high school teacher, and after watching students struggle with decisions about what to do after high school, I love what I'm seeing with Lambda School.
What do you think regulators need to address at Lambda School?
I know there are sharks in every industry, but is it a bit odd that this is a company offering free tuition unless you succeed, and draws this comment, while a typical college that charges up front and offers little help finding employment has only recently started to get a little pushback?
The major universities in my city all advertise in really over-the-top, emotive, glowing language.
Luck of the draw with who decides to interview you, I had a guy from the admissions team with zero enthusiasm essentially just reading off of a list of questions. I tried to answer well but giving off good energy from a dead duck is hard. I also was more practical with my answers of wanting to get into coding, jump in profession, curious, experience as a BA, writing technical docs and general data analysis. Each response by the interview was simply: "hmmm ok." Rejected around ten minutes after my TEN minute call. PS tell them you love coding, live and breathe it, etc.
While this program could be useful to many students, it's a loan program.
> Upon completion of the program, students will pay 10% of their salary for a five year period once they're making at least $50,000 per year. The max possible payment is capped at $50,000.
Just a heads up. Your site website navbar header is pretty hard to read (desktop, chrome, on mac). Here's a screenshot of what it looks like for me. The links are blending into the background.
I did a "full time" 3 month long more "traditional" structured boot camp. I really wish it had been longer and that they.... filtered .... students as it went.
Yes, that covers the price of tuition and repayment of the $18,000 Lambda School gives out in stipends, as well as cost of capital and risk (you only pay back if you’re making more than $50k/yr, otherwise you pay $0).
Modern Labor’s founder used to be a finance partner of ours, and decided to do something similar to what we had been working on. Modern Labor is (and this is my biased opinion) focused on the finance part and on bringing cost down, less on building “the school.” We are mostly focused on building the best school there’s ever been, and finance is a necessary piece for us but not necessarily the driver.
Hey Lambda team. Congratulations on the ISA program and living stipend! I'm sorry for having so many questions. We have an ISA program as well and I found these to be the most important questions people have about coding bootcamp ISAs:
1. Do the payments begin if the new job is not in-field (not related to Software Engineering)?
2. Is there a grace period or deadline (depending on your point of view) before the payments begin? If so, how is the monthly payment amount calculated?
2. Is there a grace period in the event they stop working after the payments begin?
3. Do the ISA payments kick in if it's not a new job? In other words, if they continue working in a job that makes >=$50K/yr?
4. Are the requirements for participating in your ISA program similar to obtaining a loan? Good credit, no defaults, etc..
Sorry if I missed any of these answers in the announcement or terms. We have been offering an ISA program at our Houston and Atlanta based bootcamp for just over 6 months now and recently adjusted it based off feedback so that payments only kick in when the new job is in-field, includes a grace period, and must be a new job. However, we couldn't do much for the credit history requirements. An ISA is essentially a delayed loan and requires the same (if not stricter) credit history requirements. It's a good alternative to taking out a loan for some, but it's usually not a fallback if you can't get one.
1. The language around what counts as in-field is in our ISA. It's more dependent on what skills you use in your job as opposed to your title. You can see a sample ISA we use at https://lambdaschool.com/faq/.
2. You pay nothing between when you finish the technical portion of the class and when you get a job, and after you start your job, there's a 30-day grace period.
2. The payments stop if you stop working. You can think of them as being 24 monthly repayments that will pause if you lose your job.
3. It does, but only after they finish the technical portion of the class, and they're using the skills they learned. We do look at things on a case-by-case basis.
4. Nope! We don't care about your credit score or your debt load. Things get tricky if you have a fraud conviction, but anything short of that won't impact our decision.
Austen: does your admissions process give any weight to outside referrals? I have a friend who would be an incredible fit for your program. I'm an engineer at a top company and I'm sure he could reach my level with some guidance, I just don't have time to give him that support myself.
Austen, I was wondering if you would consider some online version of Lambda for regions where Lambda isn't there. I don't mean the academic part, but the hiring part. Sort of an evaluation of a student's skills to see if they are on par with those educated by Lambda Faculty.
On the basis of those evaluations/tests/ projects , you can use your network to get those people jobs/ internships.
For eg: I am from India. Currently in a 2nd tier college. Learning ML,NN, Data science and am doing Kaggle currently. But, college CGPA and college name is a major hindrance while getting internships. Am thinking of dropping out after 2nd year, because it's a huge waste of time.
So if I'm reading this right, the normal LS program costs 17% of your salary, but this program pays you $2K/mo while you attend and then only charges 10% after? Of is it 10% on top of the 17%?
Either way, good on you guys for trying to do something that helps people that are disadvantaged. You guys should start a charity arm that people can donate to so that more people can get the stipend!
Looks amazing. Just recommended it to a few of my friends who are considering moving into a career in technology. I hope this becomes a new model for education, both tech and non-tech.
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
We launched our online CS academy with no upfront tuition almost two years ago.
Now with thousands of students enrolled and hundreds already employed and paying back we wanted to take the next step and open up access to folks who couldn’t afford to pay to survive while attending.
Of course, that introduces significant risk on our part, as students still only pay us back if they get a job paying $50k/yr or more, but we’ve spent the last two years perfecting our admissions and course to select hard-working folks who are likely to have what it takes to get hired and do everything we can to get them there.
For context, we have dozens of full-time interview sourcers and multiple companies per day coming in to interview our students - incentive alignment is powerful. Now that that’s working we can afford to take more risk.
We’re hoping we reach a point where anyone anywhere can move quickly to a high paying job, and only pay back if it works!
[+] [-] patio11|7 years ago|reply
Lambda School is quite possibly the most impressive startup I'm presently aware of. They are going to hit tertiary education like a freight train.
[+] [-] raidicy|7 years ago|reply
I've been enrolled for about 6 months. I've had previous programming experience so I feel I've had a leg up. But had no idea how to use the skills or build anything. I've never felt this confident with what I've learned in my life. Period. Everyone I've interacted with is genuine, welcoming, and gives me the impression they want me to succeed. I'm truly grateful to be able to be enrolled and I look forward to working to be able to pay back the school the value they've imparted in me.
Thank you Austen and everyone from Lambda School!
[+] [-] dtrailin|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
I can’t go into all the details publicly, but it’s something we have to take serious consideration to prepare for.
[+] [-] pl0x|7 years ago|reply
What happens when regulators start cracking down on these practices and what makes you think Lambda will be successful when most bootcamps have failed or been acquired.
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
What makes Lambda School different than other code schools is a few things:
1. Our incentives are entirely aligned with the student. We don’t get paid unless they get hired so juicing revenue numbers with weak students just isn’t interesting, in fact it’s fatal.
2. We put an insane amount of time, money, effort and energy into instructional design. Lambda School is nine months long, and includes a computer science curriculum most bootcamp grads need (and lack).
Regulators love us - they’re sick of for profit schools promising a lot and delivering little except debt. We’re the antidote to that. That’s why there’s so much hype.
[+] [-] japhyr|7 years ago|reply
What do you think regulators need to address at Lambda School?
[+] [-] prawn|7 years ago|reply
The major universities in my city all advertise in really over-the-top, emotive, glowing language.
[+] [-] wycs|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hiei|7 years ago|reply
Luck of the draw with who decides to interview you, I had a guy from the admissions team with zero enthusiasm essentially just reading off of a list of questions. I tried to answer well but giving off good energy from a dead duck is hard. I also was more practical with my answers of wanting to get into coding, jump in profession, curious, experience as a BA, writing technical docs and general data analysis. Each response by the interview was simply: "hmmm ok." Rejected around ten minutes after my TEN minute call. PS tell them you love coding, live and breathe it, etc.
[+] [-] t0mmycollison|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] paxy|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hkdobrev|7 years ago|reply
> Upon completion of the program, students will pay 10% of their salary for a five year period once they're making at least $50,000 per year. The max possible payment is capped at $50,000.
[+] [-] WestCoastJustin|7 years ago|reply
https://imgur.com/Gil5L9c
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] duxup|7 years ago|reply
I did a "full time" 3 month long more "traditional" structured boot camp. I really wish it had been longer and that they.... filtered .... students as it went.
[+] [-] MarkMc|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] RandomBacon|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pmoriarty|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] immichaelwang|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jacobajit|7 years ago|reply
https://modernlabor.com
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
Just different models!
[+] [-] _JasonE|7 years ago|reply
1. Do the payments begin if the new job is not in-field (not related to Software Engineering)?
2. Is there a grace period or deadline (depending on your point of view) before the payments begin? If so, how is the monthly payment amount calculated?
2. Is there a grace period in the event they stop working after the payments begin?
3. Do the ISA payments kick in if it's not a new job? In other words, if they continue working in a job that makes >=$50K/yr?
4. Are the requirements for participating in your ISA program similar to obtaining a loan? Good credit, no defaults, etc..
Sorry if I missed any of these answers in the announcement or terms. We have been offering an ISA program at our Houston and Atlanta based bootcamp for just over 6 months now and recently adjusted it based off feedback so that payments only kick in when the new job is in-field, includes a grace period, and must be a new job. However, we couldn't do much for the credit history requirements. An ISA is essentially a delayed loan and requires the same (if not stricter) credit history requirements. It's a good alternative to taking out a loan for some, but it's usually not a fallback if you can't get one.
Thanks Lambda team!
[+] [-] t0mmycollison|7 years ago|reply
2. You pay nothing between when you finish the technical portion of the class and when you get a job, and after you start your job, there's a 30-day grace period.
2. The payments stop if you stop working. You can think of them as being 24 monthly repayments that will pause if you lose your job.
3. It does, but only after they finish the technical portion of the class, and they're using the skills they learned. We do look at things on a case-by-case basis.
4. Nope! We don't care about your credit score or your debt load. Things get tricky if you have a fraud conviction, but anything short of that won't impact our decision.
Hope this helps!
[+] [-] titanomachy|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
Email me the details and I’ll pass on to the admissions team. [email protected].
[+] [-] sharcerer|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] raj7desai|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jedberg|7 years ago|reply
Either way, good on you guys for trying to do something that helps people that are disadvantaged. You guys should start a charity arm that people can donate to so that more people can get the stipend!
[+] [-] austenallred|7 years ago|reply
It’s either:
1. No stipend, 17% for 2 yrs
2. Stipend, 10% for 5 yrs
They’re mutually exclusive.
And we do have a charity arm! https://lambdapaf.org
[+] [-] joshvm|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] absorber|7 years ago|reply
> We offer part time courses for some of our tracks. Part-time course hours are Monday-Thursday 6 p.m. to 9 p.m., Saturday 9 a.m. to 12 noon Pacific.
Are these times also for EU students?
[+] [-] crb002|7 years ago|reply
[+] [-] meowface|7 years ago|reply