The Milkman Model Returns, This Time for Shampoo and Haagen-Dazs

[kwhitefoot]

The cost of returning containers whole, washing, inspecting, rejecting breakages outweighs the benefits.

It would be much more efficient to use extremely lightweight containers that can be crushed in a reverse vending machine in any supermarket.

That's how returnable bottles and cans work here in Norway (and several other European and Scandinavian countries). At the moment it only covers drinks containers but that is probably because they are the only ones that pose a major littering problem.

See https://www.tomra.com/en/collection/reverse-vending

This way the energy cost of returning the containers is minimised and the returned material is suitable for immediate, industrial scale, automated recycling.

But of course that doesn't allow the producer to use just any container so it limits their branding opportunities.

Edit: removed repeated link.

[martokus]

Yeah but it locks you in. Another example of how the hysteria around climate change is exploited by companies for profit. Once you buy Tide washing liquid in a returnable container there's a higher cost barrier switching to another brand. Unless they standardize the packaging this is a pure profit move.

On a broader note I often wonder if all the talk about climate change and plastics is not fueled by corporations ready to exploit it. I just cannot believe that a topic can suddenly become so big without an agenda behind it.

[Pfhreak]

I'm here for this. The less plastic garbage we pump out, the better. Why packaging is considered single use is beyond me.

Edit: Even better if it can be optimized for shipping, but I know not everything packages into a cube shape easily.

[chrisseaton]

> Why packaging is considered single use is beyond me.

People used to get ice cream in reusable containers.

It spread tuberculosis and cholera. People died.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/foods/penny-lick-ice-cream

[thaumasiotes]

> Why packaging is considered single use is beyond me.

Disease.

[Jill_the_Pill]

Don't the emissions from the home delivery and pickup offset any good done by re-using the containers?

[newsoul2019]

We can absolutely get ride of single use packaging. This will come at a cost, which may include things like: Expending energy to wash dishes, expending energy to transport containers around to and from being washed, and disease/death when it all goes wrong.

[mogadsheu]

I believe this is less of a technology issue than a culture/adoption issue, and if widely adopted, could really improve consumer efficiency.

The idea makes plenty of sense from both a producer and a consumer standpoint. Packaging, especially when not automated, accounts for a significant portion of the cost of goods for many basic goods.

You already see this in grocery stores: the deli counter and often the nuts/grains sections, and I'd argue the produce section use minimal packaging. Expanding this to other sections seems like a pretty straightforward to reduce deadweight, if consumers adopt the practice.

[RubberSoul]

I wish grocery stores near me had better bulk goods sections. I notice the ones that exist are currently presented as upscale choices, and are often more expensive than the packaged goods.

I think consumers will widely adopt the practice when it lowers, or at least doesn't increase, their grocery bill.

[Consultant32452]

My mom and pop butcher uses old school butcher paper to wrap my steaks which he cuts after I tell him what I want. The local chain used styrofoam, cold packs, and plastic wrap.

[maxerickson]

The popularity of packaged goods (even though bulk goods are pretty well available) provides some contrary evidence that it would improve consumer efficiency (at least if you measure what consumers think instead of cost/calorie or whatever).

Things like prepared vegetables and prepackaged deli meats are getting more popular, not less popular.

[galago]

This is an interesting concern for the big companies because a lot of bulk grocery items in the US are generic. Like, when I buy bulk peanuts they're just peanuts, not Planters™ peanuts. I've noticed that a grocery store near me house has laundry and dish soap in bulk dispensers, which has a brand on it, but I think the containers are unbranded. This would be a big problem if Tide™ were sold that way. Another problem for the big companies is keeping people from putting other brands in the nice reusable packages.

[dsfyu404ed]

Bulk dispensers are already the standard in commercial/institutional settings. Motor oil often comes in boxes (like boxed wine) now.

[newsoul2019]

I like this idea. I wouldn't have a problem bringing my Tide branded reusable dispenser to my local store to refill it with Tide. I like Tide, it's a good product. We have all recently been retrained to bring reusable bags to the grocery store, hell, what's one more container to bring.

[newsoul2019]

Or perhaps I would leave my Tide refillable container by the curb and some dude in a Tide truck would stop by and refill it and put it on the porch. It's like Filld but not for gas. Or maybe the Filld truck could have a bunch of different liquids on it, not just fuel.

[twic]

The obvious (though depressing) solution to this is DRM on the containers and dispensers.

[dsfyu404ed]

There's enough margin in premium consumables to cater to customer whims like this.

Until the value priced product lines and retailers start doing this it's not gonna make a dent whatsoever in plastic usage. This is a nice step but the model is not useful yet because it only works at the top of the market.

[nagVenkat]

There are some Whole Foods in New Jersey where you can buy milk and chocolate milk in glass containers. They cost a dollar or two more but get the difference back when you return the glass bottle. The actual price of the contents is pretty close to the milk available in plastic containers. Pretty close to what loop is doing

[frutiger]

Ronnybrook Dairy sells milk and milk products in thick glass bottles which you can return and get the 2 dollars back.

[ducttape12]

Something like this really could have an impact on reducing garbage. Combine this with more and more people switching to grocery delivery and it could actually work!

[chaostheory]

Loop (https://loopstore.com) is by Terracycle? I'm glad they're still doing well after their natural fertilizer lawsuit fight with Scotts Miracle-Gro.

Too bad this is only available in a few states in the North East.

[jetrink]

Ha, I was just wondering about this recently. It's great to see that someone is exploring this idea.

1. https://i.imgur.com/MYQ1uTl.png

[jaggederest]

Agreed. I've been thinking that we need a universal deposit system for disposable items. Tag, collect a deposit, and make companies responsible for end-to-end managing the stream of waste their products create.

There was an interesting thread on reddit just recently that is related:

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/brt43t/scientist...

[honkycat]

Every piece of plastic you have ever encountered still exists somewhere. Think about that. Humans create a STAGGERING amount of trash and we need to stop.

[SilasX]

Why is Bloomberg using the subject's propaganda photos for their article?

[ghaff]

So staged photos shot by Bloomberg would add sufficient value to the article to lead you to pay more? (Or, for that matter, would add any real editorial value at all?)

[p1necone]

It's just photos of the product, why shouldn't they?

[perfmode]

it _is_ PR