Here you go: Liver, heart, kidney, eggs, canned mackerel/sardines/oysters/clams. Hard to beat these-- they usually range from dirt cheap to cheap-when-on-sale/discount.
Jack Monroe's Cooking on a bootstrap was written when she was claiming benefits in the UK and subjected to the sanctions regime. Some weeks she had very little money to feed herself and her child.
Because she was poor herself she does a good job of not requiring too much equipment - there's a fair amount of one pot stuff, or microwave only food. And she creates plans so that you use all the food you buy at the start of the week. Some books are cheap per meal, but you need to buy a huge quantity of something that you don't use again.
Agreed... particularly ironic since the author says: "[...] we have no idea what nutrition costs. We needed a way to value food.", but then goes on to discuss nothing other than protein and calories.
I think the list is a good starting point in terms of raw data, but what's with the donation ask on the side of the screen? It's just a list, and it's deficient in a number of ways, the biggest of them being that there's more to the "efficiency" of food than protein and calories per dollar.
Also this copy strikes me as the kind of sales-y humblebrag I see in fitness/self-improvement style online courses sold by "digital nomads":
> We graduated college, Masters and PhD. No Debt.
Why ask for donations then?
Don't fellowships and research grants already cover graduate school tuition? MS/Phd students aren't rich by any means, but they do receive a teaching stipend in addition to not paying tuition.
I get a weird vibe from the way the material on the site is communicated.
I've browsed the website a number of times and I have never figured out how to /use/ the information. I suspect it's useless as a proper diet stretches far beyond calories and protein.
I spent a few months eating for £5 per week - not through choice. Most of what I ate was marked down (nearly out of date) loaves of white sliced bread and damaged cans of beans or spaghetti in tomato sauce. I’m quite tall so this wasn’t enough and after a few weeks I was in constant pain from hunger. There are many people in the UK for whom this is their life.
Curious: why not beg or dumpster dive if you were starving? I personally know somebody who used to panhandle at a freeway exit for drug money. They said $80-120 per day was regular. I also know someone who fed themselves entirely via picking through unwanted food at the back of super markets and restaurants (kind of a loopy hippie, live in a tent in the forest while attending college, etc.).
> loaves of white sliced bread and damaged cans of beans
Don't you realize that those are very expensive? Cook rice, pasta or potatoes for your calories and you could get by on that amount without going hungry. I lived on that amount for years, you'd get around 4000 calories if you just bought cheap things which is more than you need so you can buy lentils, meat, fish and vegetables for the rest which is enough to get all nutrients you need. Might not get 100% optimal diet on this, but it is healthier than what most eat.
Thanks for this. Do you have any recommendations for a DIY aquaponics setup? I've seen a lot of setups using PVC pipe although I'm not clear on how safe that is for food over the long term.
Helpful. But I think he sounds somewhat naive about why people buy what they buy.
"why do people think canned meats are a good deal?”
Canned meats don't go bad. You also don't have to thaw them out. I'm certainly no fan, but I can understand why people keep such things handy. What is the cost of running to the market more often because you refuse to buy such things? Time, after all, is money.
"we have no idea what nutrition costs."
There's more to nutrition than protein.
Yes, I think there's something here. But as-is it's a bit too simplistic. It needs some meat; pun intended ;)
"The most inexpensive fast food item is almost 2 times more expensive than eating at home"
My read of this is that if you can save more than $1000/month by not having a kitchen (say, you're in college or a high-cost-of-living area) then it might be worth it to eat out every day.
I love this type of list. I'm frugal, super busy (read: lazy), and powerlift so I try to make a minimum-cost, high-protein, easy meal-prep every week. Having a high protein / calorie ratio is primary, but keeping it low-cost is a close second. I normally use a pressure cooker, 5-6 lbs of chicken breast, brown rice, and lots of veggies. It may sound boring, but it's great when you add stuff like chickpeas, delicious sauces / salsas, and try out different regional styles of cuisine. Check out the author's protein / dollar list - it's very helpful for the protein-obsessed.
If you can tolerate lactose, milk is the cheapest way to eat a good balance of high quality protein, fat, and carbs. 2400 calories for less than $3 at most grocery stores.
Then chicken is the lowest cost per calorie meat, so you're good there. May I also suggest large quantities of cheddar cheese and heavy whipping cream from Costco? Amazing value per dollar spent. Cheddar cheese (we have Tillamook at Costco out here on the west coast) is basically entirely protein and fat and then whipping cream is all fat.
I don't understand the protein/dollar column. Flour has protein listed as "3" and price as 1.68 but I can't see how to get 134 protein/dollar from these numbers. The calorie/dollar column works the way you would expect.
Chicken thighs are much cheaper than breasts, are much more forgiving of over-cooking, and (IMO) taste better too. They presumably have a higher fat:protein ratio than breasts, but I imagine not enough to make a tangible difference.
I would like to see a version of this list (and the nutrient/calorie list) modified for ethically raised meat and other animal products. Sure chicken can be dirt cheap, but often that's enabled by raising them in unconscionable conditions.
The way we allow farmed animals to be raised is, honestly, horrifying.
I'm a meat eater, but I try to ensure I never buy meat or eggs unless the animal has been raised in good conditions.
In the past when money was tight, if I couldn't afford such meat, I'd just go without meat.
TBH, I don't really understand why governments allow animals to be kept in terrible conditions. I get that lobbying is strong in the US, but what about elsewhere? Or am I mistaken, are there countries that have good laws in place around animal welfare?
Efficiency is not everything when it comes to nutrition.
Once someone is beyond being able to procure enough food to survive, utility is important to quality of life and long term health.
What sort of utility?
1) Total caloric intake depending on if the goal is maintenance, weight loss, or weight gain.
2) Macronutrient split depending on specific health and/or performance goals. E.G. high protein for strength trainees.
3) Micronutrient split and density for general health and/or to correct deficiencies. For example, many people are Vitamin D deficient.
4) Mental health. An extreme approach to diet can create eating disorders and may lead to social isolation.
As with most things in life, there is a cost/benefit equation associated with nutrition choices, and focusing purely on efficiency most certainly has its costs - some of which are not obvious. Those costs can have a negative impact on short-term and long-term health. Health is easy to take for granted - until there’s an issue.
The point of my post? I hope that the takeaway from this article isn’t: “make cost efficiency your primary goal in food selection,” but rather, “carefully evaluate your specific situation, establish nutrition goals, and treat food intake like a solution to a problem - just make sure the problem(s) are very well defined.”
This advice applies to those that have the discretionary funds to facilitate this level of selectiveness, which I’m guessing applies to most people reading this.
Good for you. I know it's a lot harder, but as we've been seeing over teh past 5-10 years, borrowing money to live on while you're in school will really mess up the next 10-20-30 years of your life.
This list looks wrong, you get way more than 1600 calories for $1 of pasta. 1kg of pasta is roughly 3,500 calories and shouldn't cost much more than a dollar. They must buy some very expensive brand to pay over $2 per kg, typically you can get it for less than $1 per kg...
Edit: Fixed calories per kg of dry pasta. Their value is still off though.
Edit again: I used Scandinavian prices which are typically much higher than American ones, but looking around it seems like people think it is normal for 1kg of pasta to cost $2? How can that be? Pasta is super cheap to produce and has years of shelf life, there is no reason at all why it should be expensive. It should be the cheapest wheat based product you can buy, certainly much cheaper than bread.
However, sometimes you want to maximize protein per a meal's calories. Some things may seem 'cheap' but to maximize protein with those items you will blow out the calories chart. For example, it's better to rely on cottage cheese for protein instead of flour, despite the monetary cost looking favorable for the latter -- because the former will have your protein needs met with a smaller number of total calories, preventing you from gaining fat mass, assuming the rest of your diet follows similar reasoning.
I wish I could eat in this purely-thermodynamic way but I know I would be miserable. Carbohydrates just don't induce satiety in me like they seem to for other people.
It'd be nice to see data for vegetables, too. For instance, broccoli is relatively high in protein (and definitely micronutrients), but is rather cost ineffective. It'd also be fun to see how absurdly inefficient lettuce is.
This is fine except for the low-cost carbs. These have high glycemic indexes and glycemic loads. That means they cause insulin spikes in your bloodstream, which causes type 2 diabetes. And no, that is not just my opinion, it's the research-proven scientific consensus.
It's better to get your carbs from beans and also calories from healthy oils like olive and canola.
- provides an entry it lots of interesting scientific questions, both in food preparation and digestion/health.
- is a big money saver over a lifetime.
- is a great social activity with deep cultural roots.
As a programmer, I also enjoy the approximate and ephemeral nature of the process and product, similar to software engineering in some ways, completely different in others.
[+] [-] redm|6 years ago|reply
https://chriskresser.com/what-is-nutrient-density-and-why-is...
[+] [-] gregwebs|6 years ago|reply
I created a site that will display a nutrient density graph for foods that you search for: https://eatnutrients.com/
[+] [-] QuantumAphid|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DanBC|6 years ago|reply
Because she was poor herself she does a good job of not requiring too much equipment - there's a fair amount of one pot stuff, or microwave only food. And she creates plans so that you use all the food you buy at the start of the week. Some books are cheap per meal, but you need to buy a huge quantity of something that you don't use again.
https://cookingonabootstrap.com/
Sadly, she's not a cook or chef and some of the recipes in the original book just don't work, so go careful. The reviews on Amazon can be useful.
[+] [-] Falling3|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Alex3917|6 years ago|reply
https://books.leannebrown.com/good-and-cheap.pdf
[+] [-] wybiral|6 years ago|reply
You need more than flour and sugar to survive.
[+] [-] asdfasgasdgasdg|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] loblollyboy|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] amdanil|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|6 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] unknown|6 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] unknown|6 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] rchaud|6 years ago|reply
Also this copy strikes me as the kind of sales-y humblebrag I see in fitness/self-improvement style online courses sold by "digital nomads":
> We graduated college, Masters and PhD. No Debt.
Why ask for donations then?
Don't fellowships and research grants already cover graduate school tuition? MS/Phd students aren't rich by any means, but they do receive a teaching stipend in addition to not paying tuition.
I get a weird vibe from the way the material on the site is communicated.
[+] [-] x2f10|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rikkus|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] toasterlovin|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] username90|6 years ago|reply
Don't you realize that those are very expensive? Cook rice, pasta or potatoes for your calories and you could get by on that amount without going hungry. I lived on that amount for years, you'd get around 4000 calories if you just bought cheap things which is more than you need so you can buy lentils, meat, fish and vegetables for the rest which is enough to get all nutrients you need. Might not get 100% optimal diet on this, but it is healthier than what most eat.
[+] [-] mactrey|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] _1tan|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ph0rque|6 years ago|reply
Edit: I need to replace the stevia with honey, much more realistic from the advice I got.
[+] [-] iamnothere|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chiefalchemist|6 years ago|reply
"why do people think canned meats are a good deal?”
Canned meats don't go bad. You also don't have to thaw them out. I'm certainly no fan, but I can understand why people keep such things handy. What is the cost of running to the market more often because you refuse to buy such things? Time, after all, is money.
"we have no idea what nutrition costs."
There's more to nutrition than protein.
Yes, I think there's something here. But as-is it's a bit too simplistic. It needs some meat; pun intended ;)
[+] [-] cbhl|6 years ago|reply
My read of this is that if you can save more than $1000/month by not having a kitchen (say, you're in college or a high-cost-of-living area) then it might be worth it to eat out every day.
[+] [-] Fenrisulfr|6 years ago|reply
https://efficiencyiseverything.com/applying-protein-per-doll...
[+] [-] toasterlovin|6 years ago|reply
Then chicken is the lowest cost per calorie meat, so you're good there. May I also suggest large quantities of cheddar cheese and heavy whipping cream from Costco? Amazing value per dollar spent. Cheddar cheese (we have Tillamook at Costco out here on the west coast) is basically entirely protein and fat and then whipping cream is all fat.
[+] [-] adrianN|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] clojurestan|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] GordonS|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] iamnothere|6 years ago|reply
* Author's cookbook: https://efficiencyiseverything.com/The-Cookbook-v-1.4.pdf
* Author's weekly grocery list: https://efficiencyiseverything.com/Weekly_Groceries.pdf
[+] [-] atomical|6 years ago|reply
https://twitter.com/eieMichaelKirk/status/102609142423065804...
[+] [-] shmageggy|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] GordonS|6 years ago|reply
I'm a meat eater, but I try to ensure I never buy meat or eggs unless the animal has been raised in good conditions.
In the past when money was tight, if I couldn't afford such meat, I'd just go without meat.
TBH, I don't really understand why governments allow animals to be kept in terrible conditions. I get that lobbying is strong in the US, but what about elsewhere? Or am I mistaken, are there countries that have good laws in place around animal welfare?
[+] [-] rayssgyms|6 years ago|reply
Once someone is beyond being able to procure enough food to survive, utility is important to quality of life and long term health. What sort of utility?
1) Total caloric intake depending on if the goal is maintenance, weight loss, or weight gain.
2) Macronutrient split depending on specific health and/or performance goals. E.G. high protein for strength trainees.
3) Micronutrient split and density for general health and/or to correct deficiencies. For example, many people are Vitamin D deficient.
4) Mental health. An extreme approach to diet can create eating disorders and may lead to social isolation.
As with most things in life, there is a cost/benefit equation associated with nutrition choices, and focusing purely on efficiency most certainly has its costs - some of which are not obvious. Those costs can have a negative impact on short-term and long-term health. Health is easy to take for granted - until there’s an issue.
The point of my post? I hope that the takeaway from this article isn’t: “make cost efficiency your primary goal in food selection,” but rather, “carefully evaluate your specific situation, establish nutrition goals, and treat food intake like a solution to a problem - just make sure the problem(s) are very well defined.”
This advice applies to those that have the discretionary funds to facilitate this level of selectiveness, which I’m guessing applies to most people reading this.
[+] [-] djrogers|6 years ago|reply
"We graduated college, Masters and PhD. No Debt."
Good for you. I know it's a lot harder, but as we've been seeing over teh past 5-10 years, borrowing money to live on while you're in school will really mess up the next 10-20-30 years of your life.
[+] [-] username90|6 years ago|reply
Edit: Fixed calories per kg of dry pasta. Their value is still off though.
Edit again: I used Scandinavian prices which are typically much higher than American ones, but looking around it seems like people think it is normal for 1kg of pasta to cost $2? How can that be? Pasta is super cheap to produce and has years of shelf life, there is no reason at all why it should be expensive. It should be the cheapest wheat based product you can buy, certainly much cheaper than bread.
[+] [-] madcaptenor|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] schemathings|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ZeroFries|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] notyourloops|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nategri|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] isbjorn16|6 years ago|reply
Fat and (to a lesser extent) protein seem to have the largest effect on suppressing my appetite, and I have no idea why that is.
[+] [-] _nhynes|6 years ago|reply
Also, soybeans are more efficient than lentils and white beans are more versatile (e.g., https://github.com/nhynes/pbean)
[+] [-] SketchySeaBeast|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] woodandsteel|6 years ago|reply
It's better to get your carbs from beans and also calories from healthy oils like olive and canola.
[+] [-] gus_massa|6 years ago|reply
It's weird that in the recipes at the bottom they never use eggs, that have a good protein/dollar ratio and are easy to store and cook.
It would be nice to see a dispersion graph of protein/dollar vs calories/dollar.
[+] [-] dahart|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ZeroFries|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Creationer|6 years ago|reply
https://www.amazon.com/Food-Cooking-Science-Lore-Kitchen/dp/...
You can also use a microwave to do things like cooking potatoes.
[+] [-] mxschumacher|6 years ago|reply
I've been looking for a resource like this.
I consider cooking a fantastic hobby, it
- provides an entry it lots of interesting scientific questions, both in food preparation and digestion/health.
- is a big money saver over a lifetime.
- is a great social activity with deep cultural roots.
As a programmer, I also enjoy the approximate and ephemeral nature of the process and product, similar to software engineering in some ways, completely different in others.