[cljs-js-eval]

Yeah - I've seen and worked with (very talented!) people like Brad, and I feel for them. They're good at working with this presentational stuff, but it's never been necessary to learn that when they're creating an <input> they're secretly creating an HTMLInputElement. And then one day, they're expected to learn this framework that fits so nicely with the frontend because they try to emulate that hierarchy of objects on the frontend and deal with them in code.

It would be weird to go from a DSL and realize that to move forward you have to get good at general programming. I'm not sure that I would handle that transition very well.