The dish mentioned sounds far better than what is usually served as vegetarian food at canteens and restaurants. Quite often they offer just a compilation of side-dishes to have something vegetarian on their menu. (Dumblings with red cabbage and - wait for it - gravy from roasting meat is a widespread menu offer for vegetarians in southern Germany. Not sure if it counts as vegetarian option though).
Once people notice that vegetarian food does not have to be heaps of vegetables or to taste bland, they're far more open to actually try it. I think it's rather a problem with chefs not being familiar with vegetarian recipes than people actually not liking it at all.
POV: Omnivore with a (previously) vegetarian spouse. We generally ate veg @ home
One of my biggest issues with modern veg diets is all of the veg food trying to masquerade as other food. Soy bacon does not taste like, or taste as good as, real bacon. Tofu and Boca burgers do not taste like actual meat. But tofu and the like can taste amazing on its own merit. It's an ingredient with it's own flavors and textures, so put it where it can do some good.
And don't get me started on veg patties. I have a (very) meat loving father who got completely hooked on Boca burgers while on Weight Watchers. He'll still eat them on a regular basis, even though he looooves regular burgers, just because they're delicious.
In my mind, you don't have to try to pretend to be something else to be good, especially veg sandwich patties. Latkes are amazing. Refried beans bound together with eggs, breaded and deep fried sounds amazing. Don't put yourself next to something else and force a comparison. Just be tasty.
Western cuisine seems to fundamentally misunderstand vegetables. Methinks it was partly the unavailability of spices, and partly the easy availability of meat.
Meat is like a cheat code when you're cooking. A good cut of meat needs a little more than some salt and fat to taste good.
With vegetables, you're forced to be more inventive.
Take okra for instance. In India, its a favorite vegetable. Saute it with some Indian spices and it becomes a crunchy, flavorful dish.
Whenever I've seen okra in western menus, it is usually boiled which turns it into a gooey, sticky mess.
I love eating meat but I would be perfectly happy sticking to vegetarian-only food as long as I'm living in India
I'm a meat eater myself but have I have 4 vegan family members. It's amazing how the range of vegan / vegetarian food has exploded in the UK over the last few years, I think this has made it much easier to maintain a vegan diet because socially it's much easier to eat almost anywhere rather than having to pick somewhere specifically for the vegetarian options.
In my experience, and in particular with conference food, vegetarian dishes has its own food culture and tastes. To be specific they usually do not include any pepper, garlic, chili, or herbs like parsley, sage, rosemary, thyme and cumin. Salt and umami is also often missing. Instead the cooks tries to create tastes through using different grains, seeds, fruits, salads and vegetables. Food without meat does not have to follow that culture but it is a bit like telling thai cooks to not use fish sauce, cilantro and chilies.
For me if food without meat want to raise a larger audience it must first be separated from the vegetarian food culture, because not everyone like the taste of that food culture.
Anecdote: a friend (vegetarian) studied abroad and had a scholarship that included housing and food at the canteen. Being a vegetarian made it pretty lacking in variety because the lunchs consisted of a bowl of rice or pasta, depending on which of these was the side-dish to meat that day. There was different fruit yoghurts for dessert at least ;)
(Edit: removed country to not blame anyone for their cuisine)
In their attempt to make a shoddy substitute for meat dishes, they completely butcher the innate capabilities of the vegetables.
I know that sounds a bit snooty, but western cuisines simply do not lend themselves well to vegetarian ingredients.
India is obviously the most familiar with good veg food, but most cuisines in Asia have good vegetarian offerings. Everything from China, Thailand, Iran, Lebanon and even Eastern Africa have some if not many great veg offerings.
Any cuisine that is based around spices (not necessarily the hot ones, but spice in general) is much better suited to vegetarian ingredients.
What we need is for people to become slightly adventurous in the way they eat, and stop living in their food bubbles.
Vegetables are hard to prepare, especially in a production setting. Of course it has to taste good, but also not turn to mush on the trip from the kitchen to the table. Meat, especially when started with sous vide portions, is much less critical of timing and other conditions.
It's a lot easier at home, and in fact, even heaps of vegetables can be quite good if they're fresh and prepared to your taste.
With one vegetarian in the household, we eat great at home, but restaurants are always a coin toss.
Vegetarian food can be delicious or disgusting, just as meat can be.
I wouldn't salivate over sitting down to a dinner of boiled stew beef cubes without any seasoning at all...
Which is pretty much the equivalent of boiled rice and broccoli. (Standard vegetarian fare at a lot of cafeterias in North America).
I noticed something yesterday...
Capitalistic enterprises really shit on vegetarians for some reason, and I can't quite figure out why.
The local pizza place put a flyer in my mailbox... they have plant based pizza now with cauliflower based crusts... vegetarian peperoni and vegan cheese... two servings of vegetables in the crust alone etc etc...
That's great, but why does it cost twice as much as all of the other pizzas on offer?
Or all of these plant based meat patties that are coming out... twice as expensive as the admittedly more delicious meat based counterparts... and that's buying in bulk, looking for the best deal.
I travel to Europe about once a year and I've noticed they're far behind the US in terms of vegetarian options. In the US it's been easy to get a high quality, vegetarian meal at almost any restaurant for at least a decade (edit: at least in metro areas; perhaps rural areas are different, although I haven't noticed this personally). Meanwhile in Europe it's almost impossible to get anything resembling a full meal. Like you say, it's usually simply a meal based around meat with the meat removed. I hope things are getting better over there.
There's never been a better (ie. easier) time to be a vegetarian.
I switched a little while ago, and was expecting restaurant meals to be a huge pain. In actuality I rarely have to worry about it, and even though I'm a picky eater most decent restaurants now have enough options that I can find something that I like.
On top of that, the increased diversity of vegetarian options that restaurants are offering has been really helpful in expanding my pallet in general. It's more likely when eating out that something I've never tried before catches my eye and I discover that I really like it when prepared a certain way. Eating out more (within reason) can be an effective way to get yourself to try new foods -- there are a lot of vegetables that I've gotten accustomed to that I used to heavily avoid.
I would highly suggest vegetarian food seekers to try out cuisines that have worked out vegetarian options over time (Indian / Thai) rather than the options that try to substitute a green salad.
I also have a HUGE resistance for stuff like Beyond meats - When I want meat, I really don't want to try out synthetic haeme or whatever that makes this taste like meat - at least for the next 15-20 years when we figure out what cancer it causes. A bean burger is an awesome meal, so is milk based products (pizza et al). Even better are a combination of pita bread + hummus and so on.
It is very much possible to start off small - eat real vegetarian x days of a week or move to meat only for lunch or only dinner and you can go from there in small steps. You can even switch to white meat to start with. A planned setup like that actually makes me enjoy the meat more when I get it. A good reuben is extra good when it happens only once a month.
I also don't really buy we have to be fully vegetarian to see all the benefits (I grew up vegetarian, picked up meat eating and I would like to think I walk a reasonable line).
> to try out synthetic haeme or whatever that makes this taste like meat
The synthetic hemoglobin is Impossible's (patented) technique to make it cook like meat, because it's fake red blood cells. Long story short, it's a slightly differently different way to (kind of) ferment soy beans, and while it may not be as old as Soy Sauce, after as long as Asian cultures have been (ab)using the soy bean, Impossible's process would be quite hard pressed to find some new cancer to cause.
The rest is just mostly various combinations of plants (beans, plant fibers, spices), just as bean burgers and veggie burgers have always been.
Though don't let me stop your skepticism. Beyond / Impossible are useful beef substitutes and probably aren't healthier than beef, but they probably aren't any worse than beef either.
My favorite carhop burger joint (Hire's Big H, SLC) makes their own veggie patty that to me is their best thing on their menu. It's really crafted to be a flavorful/textural experience without being "fake meat". I'm not even vegetarian and it's been my go to there for a while now.
This was all before I had a grasp of the environmental impact of meat production.
Twenty years ago there was a restaurant in Bethesda that made its own veggie burger. To my taste, it was the best thing on the menu. And I only started experimenting with veggie/vegan/pescetarian cuisine a couple years ago (I go pescetarian a couple days a week).
I am not vegetarian, but I still sometimes choose the vegetarian option because it tastes good. I'm not very surprised by more people finding tasty vegetarian options when more are made available.
> I'm not very surprised by more people finding tasty vegetarian options when more are made available.
This is a bit off-topic, but this always bothers me. Just because we're discussing a topic doesn't mean we're surprised by it. Some data being new and worth discussing doesn't mean it broke from expectations.
>When the proportion of meatless options doubled from one to two of four choices, overall sales remained about constant. But sales of meat-containing meals dropped, and sales of vegetarian meals, such as “wild mushroom, roasted butternut squash and sun blushed tomato risotto with parmesan”, rose 40–80%.
So they cut the available meat options and doubled the available vegetarian options and find it surprising they sold more vegetarian food? Making things unavailabile does tend to have that effect.
This research is pretty laughable. Made by one university, 3 locations - ages/demographics are not represented properly at all, the cultural environment is the same (one university). The ratio of veg doubled (0.25 to 0.5) while the ratio of meat fell 33 % (0.75 to 0.5).
Also it doesnt at all mention the in volume of the eaters: What if the people who predominantly eat meat simply stopped going to the cafeterias as often since the food choice became less interesting ?
They also say the sales rose 40%-80% - why is the range so big (and is it even reliable then)?
Speaking from personal experience, I've been eating a lot more plant-based meals now that Beyond and Impossible Beef are available in grocery stores. I wouldn't say I'm completely vegetarian but I'm 60% there.
I was so excited about the Impossible Burger at Burger King. But I made the mistake of ordering it and a regular Whopper for comparison. I tried the Impossible Burger and thought wow, this is amazingly delicious. Then I took a bite of a Whopper and realized that the Impossible Burger will never be able to replace this. You could make the world's best vegetarian burger and some discount meat from the local dollar store would still taste better.
I think that's a very positive step. We don't need everyone to turn vegan to flight climate change. We only need everyone to consume significantly less meat.
I've been on a vegan diet the last 11 years. Starting while still living with my parents at 17, it forced me to try new foods and get better at cooking. Before I was mostly on a junk diet of fast food and frozen meals before changing my diet. I lost some weight and felt my energy levels increase. I mostly attribute this to having to skip on most fast food and sweets.
During the initial few years I ate a lot of meat and dairy replacements along with accidentally vegan junk food like oreos and the purple bag doritos. But around the 4 yr mark this stuff kinda lost its allure - too processed and artificial tasting (imo) to be foods I eat frequently.
The staples I landed on are just basic food: tofu, beans, rice, bread, noodles, vegetables, and fruit. I found not trying to reproduce American food improved my diet, was cheaper, and easier to share with people who don't follow a vegan diet. A vegetable curry is a lot easier to sell to someone you're sharing dinner with than something with a bunch of meat/dairy replacements. And it just tastes better.
I'll mix it up and have fake meat sometimes or indulge in junk like candy or chips. But my point is following a vegan diet is quite easy once you adjust your staples a bit. Also just go easy on yourself, if you're eating out the bread might have a little whey in it but I personally think that's okay. I'd rather just eat that than make it difficult for the people I'm dining with or to bug the server to go check. Eating 95% vegan for a lifetime is clearly better than burning out. This was a lesson that took a few years to learn as I was a pretty annoying vegan the first few years when I was in my teens/early 20's.
vegan for 25 years here. not a competition - just wanted to say it has gotten a lot easier over the years. when i first went vegan, not many people even knew what vegan meant. and many grocery stores carry items that i could previous only find at food co-ops (vegan cheeses, vegan ice creams, and so on).
also with apps and websites like Happy Cow (https://www.happycow.net) it is even easier to find vegan food on the go.
I always found vegan movement oddly close to religion. At my work, guy drives a car that has a custom VEGAN plate. I am not sure why I should know his dietary restrictions. I don't like liver. Do I add bumper indicating my dislike for liver consumption? Can someone rationalize it for me? Is it like sub-culture?
Veganism is often a moral/ethical stance rather than a dietary restriction. It's not a food preference, it's a worldview. So this can be an attempt to attract attention to the movement and normalize it.
The first point is that for many, being vegan isn't a "dietary restriction", but a lifestyle based on a moral philosophy that we shouldn't harm sentient beings more than necessary. Eg, the Vegan Society's definition is (in part): "A philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose."
There are vegans who really get into being VEGAN as an identity. Then there are the other ones who just do what we do and don't see a need to volunteer it or announce it at every possible chance. Some just live their lives, some participate in various aspects of animal rights activism. Either way, the VEGAN identity folks tend to be the ones that you will notice and remember. The rest, you pass by every day and probably never even know. (It's also worth mentioning that there are also a lot of people who are "vegan" as a fad diet (like "keto" or "paleo") but don't subscribe to the philosophy (vegans will usually try to make the distinction that those folks really just follow a plant-based diet), there are vegans who also get into weird things like raw food, alkaline water, fasting, etc. Like it or not, any large group of people will have fringes like this and they tend to be very vocal and attention seeking.)
Similarly, there are meat eaters who make BACON a huge part of their identity and like to remind you every chance they get how much they like it and "carnivore" dieters, etc.
It’s like any other modern movement, really. In the West, Christianity defined every aspect of life for over a thousand years. That has slowly eroded away over the last few centuries.
In the contemporary absence of a cohesive worldview, people look toward communities and philosophies like veganism, atheism, political affiliations, and so on for a sense of identity.
Veganism is not a dietary preference, it's a system of ethics. If there had been vanity plates in the 1910s there probably would have been some that said 5UFFR4G3, too.
Veganism extends to all modes of consumption, not just food--for example, vegans don't buy leather or animal-tested makeup. Side note, to reduce confusion like yours, some people use 'plant-based' specifically to describe vegan food. People are vegan, products are "suitable for vegans".
What people choose to identify with/as is pretty fundamental psychology and it's fascinating. There's only room in your mentality for so many categories of self-identification... it's gotta be something that distinguishes you from others. Everybody does it. You do it, I do it. He does it, in part, with his diet.
Yes and no. There certainly is what you describe. They are what many people think as vegan because it is the most vocal subset of vegans. There are many who eat vegan but don't proclaim it.
It is like my father-in-law who believes all gay people are loud and flamboyant. When in reality, he is dense and requires someone to hit him over the head to see it.
I've seen this out workplaces where a coworker A is vegan. A new coworker B notices and starts having a friendly chat with A about vegan food. Coworker B, who has been working and eating lunch with A for two years, is surprised to learn that A is vegan the whole time.
For some, it stems from values that differ from the norm, ie. antispecism, and values have something to do with religion. It allows for virtue signalling. But I don't see rituals associated with veganism.
i really think the way to getting millions to change their meat eating ways is one animal at a time. Don't tell a typical meat eater give up all meat. Tell them give up cows only. Then pigs. Then maybe stop there for a while. Exist on chicken and seafood and that would change the world. Just place cows and pigs in same category as dogs and cats and all of a sudden, wow, huge win for everyone.
The thing is, you don't need to be entirely vegetarian to have a big impact on your environmental footprint, etc.
Many meals can do well, or even be improved, by having 'much less meat'. After all, meat has been a sign of prosperity for a long time, and so it's been stuffed into many recipes that probably don't need it, or that need much less of it than curretly practiced.
I went vegetarian about two years ago, and it's been way easier than I thought it would be. Plenty of meal variety when you draw ideas from across the globe.
The article doesn't go into enough details for us to evaluate the study.
Some possible scenarios:
They offered meat-free options that mirrored the meat-containing options. For example, they had beef lasagna and as an alternative vegetarian lasagna. If this dramatically increased the selection of vegetarian options it seems like a good indicator that there was a preference for meat free options that wasn't being satisfied.
They offered meat-free lasagna as an additional option, independent of the other available choices (so no 'regular' lasagna was offered at the same time). If this increased selection of vegetarian options, it tells us absolutely nothing. It's quite possible that many people 'felt like lasagna' that day, and that was that. To phrase this scenario another way: they could increase the selection of vegetarian options to 100% by eliminating all meat from the cafeteria, but this wouldn't demonstrate any preference for vegetarian by the customers.
Since whoever wrote this article didn't mention the methodology, my guess is that the methodology is more like my second scenario, which is to say that it was not a meaningful study but they don't want to say that because they are pushing an agenda. Either that or it's incompetence, I think Hanlon's Razor attaches at this point.
30 year vegetarian here: I'd say in the UK we've had good vegetarian options for maybe 10 years. Before that it was "have a crappy tomato sauce with pasta" as a terrible substitute for whatever the fleshies were eating. Now, pretty much everywhere in the UK has reasonable non-meat options.
What has also happened though is that low end food places - pubs, cafes, other "beige food" eateries [burgers, chips, you know, beige] - have become extraordinarily more expensive, whereas really great places have only incrementally increased prices. So you'd probably pay £15 for a crappy fish and chips in a pub, but say £18 for a really great dish in a restaurant. This has been a bit of a leveller - but also alongside this you find exponentially better veggie food in a good restaurant, whereas pubs are all still a bit "meat and two veg"...
Not sure how good the study is but I wouldn't find it surprising.
I can understand how people find it hard to stay vegetarian when e.g. the only vegetarian main on a restaurant menu is risotto (this happens comically often!).
Meat eaters tend to say "what would you even eat?!" because they're used to seeing menus with 90% meat options.
I'm kind of a food snob. I don't eat burgers. They're horrible. I don't eat hotdogs. They're horrible.
Reading this article tempts me to want to say "Newsflash: Tasty food sells!" but I'm sure that would be flagged to death as low content snark. Also, it's possibly stupid saying anything at all because people who eat stuff like burgers and hot dogs will get all mad when you give your honest opinion that it isn't exactly gourmet health food.
I often go with, say, French fries and apple pie because it's the least worst option on a burger-based menu. When they offer chicken as an alternative to burgers, it's typically also deep fried etc. It's only very recently that some burger joints genuinely offer tasty, healthy alternatives to their bland and unhealthy ground beef patty on nasty circular white bread staple food item.
I think it is more difficult to prepare good tasting vegetarian food, based on my experience also cooking with meat a couple of times a week.
In any case I am happy that more people are getting the chance to eat more food that they prefer.
I like to stay out of any organic food, vegetarian food, etc., food arguments. People should have the freedom to buy and eat the types of food they like.
I worry a little about keeping this freedom since the single political party in the USA the republicrats (also referred to as the Demopublicans) in servicing their main constituency (I am obviously talking about corporations), might try to curtail things like accurate packaging labels, etc. if that is what their corporate constituents want.
[+] [-] _Microft|6 years ago|reply
Once people notice that vegetarian food does not have to be heaps of vegetables or to taste bland, they're far more open to actually try it. I think it's rather a problem with chefs not being familiar with vegetarian recipes than people actually not liking it at all.
[+] [-] jedimastert|6 years ago|reply
One of my biggest issues with modern veg diets is all of the veg food trying to masquerade as other food. Soy bacon does not taste like, or taste as good as, real bacon. Tofu and Boca burgers do not taste like actual meat. But tofu and the like can taste amazing on its own merit. It's an ingredient with it's own flavors and textures, so put it where it can do some good.
And don't get me started on veg patties. I have a (very) meat loving father who got completely hooked on Boca burgers while on Weight Watchers. He'll still eat them on a regular basis, even though he looooves regular burgers, just because they're delicious.
In my mind, you don't have to try to pretend to be something else to be good, especially veg sandwich patties. Latkes are amazing. Refried beans bound together with eggs, breaded and deep fried sounds amazing. Don't put yourself next to something else and force a comparison. Just be tasty.
[+] [-] puranjay|6 years ago|reply
Meat is like a cheat code when you're cooking. A good cut of meat needs a little more than some salt and fat to taste good.
With vegetables, you're forced to be more inventive.
Take okra for instance. In India, its a favorite vegetable. Saute it with some Indian spices and it becomes a crunchy, flavorful dish.
Whenever I've seen okra in western menus, it is usually boiled which turns it into a gooey, sticky mess.
I love eating meat but I would be perfectly happy sticking to vegetarian-only food as long as I'm living in India
[+] [-] VBprogrammer|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] belorn|6 years ago|reply
For me if food without meat want to raise a larger audience it must first be separated from the vegetarian food culture, because not everyone like the taste of that food culture.
[+] [-] _Microft|6 years ago|reply
(Edit: removed country to not blame anyone for their cuisine)
[+] [-] screye|6 years ago|reply
In their attempt to make a shoddy substitute for meat dishes, they completely butcher the innate capabilities of the vegetables.
I know that sounds a bit snooty, but western cuisines simply do not lend themselves well to vegetarian ingredients.
India is obviously the most familiar with good veg food, but most cuisines in Asia have good vegetarian offerings. Everything from China, Thailand, Iran, Lebanon and even Eastern Africa have some if not many great veg offerings.
Any cuisine that is based around spices (not necessarily the hot ones, but spice in general) is much better suited to vegetarian ingredients.
What we need is for people to become slightly adventurous in the way they eat, and stop living in their food bubbles.
[+] [-] analog31|6 years ago|reply
It's a lot easier at home, and in fact, even heaps of vegetables can be quite good if they're fresh and prepared to your taste.
With one vegetarian in the household, we eat great at home, but restaurants are always a coin toss.
[+] [-] DennisP|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nicoburns|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] randomsearch|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] flyGuyOnTheSly|6 years ago|reply
I wouldn't salivate over sitting down to a dinner of boiled stew beef cubes without any seasoning at all...
Which is pretty much the equivalent of boiled rice and broccoli. (Standard vegetarian fare at a lot of cafeterias in North America).
I noticed something yesterday...
Capitalistic enterprises really shit on vegetarians for some reason, and I can't quite figure out why.
The local pizza place put a flyer in my mailbox... they have plant based pizza now with cauliflower based crusts... vegetarian peperoni and vegan cheese... two servings of vegetables in the crust alone etc etc...
That's great, but why does it cost twice as much as all of the other pizzas on offer?
Or all of these plant based meat patties that are coming out... twice as expensive as the admittedly more delicious meat based counterparts... and that's buying in bulk, looking for the best deal.
I live in Canada, btw.
[+] [-] LifeLiverTransp|6 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] coldpie|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] danShumway|6 years ago|reply
I switched a little while ago, and was expecting restaurant meals to be a huge pain. In actuality I rarely have to worry about it, and even though I'm a picky eater most decent restaurants now have enough options that I can find something that I like.
On top of that, the increased diversity of vegetarian options that restaurants are offering has been really helpful in expanding my pallet in general. It's more likely when eating out that something I've never tried before catches my eye and I discover that I really like it when prepared a certain way. Eating out more (within reason) can be an effective way to get yourself to try new foods -- there are a lot of vegetables that I've gotten accustomed to that I used to heavily avoid.
[+] [-] SubuSS|6 years ago|reply
I also have a HUGE resistance for stuff like Beyond meats - When I want meat, I really don't want to try out synthetic haeme or whatever that makes this taste like meat - at least for the next 15-20 years when we figure out what cancer it causes. A bean burger is an awesome meal, so is milk based products (pizza et al). Even better are a combination of pita bread + hummus and so on.
It is very much possible to start off small - eat real vegetarian x days of a week or move to meat only for lunch or only dinner and you can go from there in small steps. You can even switch to white meat to start with. A planned setup like that actually makes me enjoy the meat more when I get it. A good reuben is extra good when it happens only once a month.
I also don't really buy we have to be fully vegetarian to see all the benefits (I grew up vegetarian, picked up meat eating and I would like to think I walk a reasonable line).
[+] [-] WorldMaker|6 years ago|reply
The synthetic hemoglobin is Impossible's (patented) technique to make it cook like meat, because it's fake red blood cells. Long story short, it's a slightly differently different way to (kind of) ferment soy beans, and while it may not be as old as Soy Sauce, after as long as Asian cultures have been (ab)using the soy bean, Impossible's process would be quite hard pressed to find some new cancer to cause.
The rest is just mostly various combinations of plants (beans, plant fibers, spices), just as bean burgers and veggie burgers have always been.
Though don't let me stop your skepticism. Beyond / Impossible are useful beef substitutes and probably aren't healthier than beef, but they probably aren't any worse than beef either.
[+] [-] ebg13|6 years ago|reply
It's not synthetic, though. It's real heme in real leghemoglobin produced in yeast instead of hemoglobin in animals.
[+] [-] DanCarvajal|6 years ago|reply
My favorite carhop burger joint (Hire's Big H, SLC) makes their own veggie patty that to me is their best thing on their menu. It's really crafted to be a flavorful/textural experience without being "fake meat". I'm not even vegetarian and it's been my go to there for a while now.
This was all before I had a grasp of the environmental impact of meat production.
[+] [-] dhimes|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chousuke|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] coldpie|6 years ago|reply
This is a bit off-topic, but this always bothers me. Just because we're discussing a topic doesn't mean we're surprised by it. Some data being new and worth discussing doesn't mean it broke from expectations.
You can see the same thing in this other thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21146856 No one is clutching their pearls, folks. We're just having a conversation.
[+] [-] okmokmz|6 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] grawprog|6 years ago|reply
So they cut the available meat options and doubled the available vegetarian options and find it surprising they sold more vegetarian food? Making things unavailabile does tend to have that effect.
[+] [-] reportgunner|6 years ago|reply
They also say the sales rose 40%-80% - why is the range so big (and is it even reliable then)?
[+] [-] elektor|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] merpnderp|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mavdi|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] aloisdg|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] perkorounded|6 years ago|reply
During the initial few years I ate a lot of meat and dairy replacements along with accidentally vegan junk food like oreos and the purple bag doritos. But around the 4 yr mark this stuff kinda lost its allure - too processed and artificial tasting (imo) to be foods I eat frequently.
The staples I landed on are just basic food: tofu, beans, rice, bread, noodles, vegetables, and fruit. I found not trying to reproduce American food improved my diet, was cheaper, and easier to share with people who don't follow a vegan diet. A vegetable curry is a lot easier to sell to someone you're sharing dinner with than something with a bunch of meat/dairy replacements. And it just tastes better.
I'll mix it up and have fake meat sometimes or indulge in junk like candy or chips. But my point is following a vegan diet is quite easy once you adjust your staples a bit. Also just go easy on yourself, if you're eating out the bread might have a little whey in it but I personally think that's okay. I'd rather just eat that than make it difficult for the people I'm dining with or to bug the server to go check. Eating 95% vegan for a lifetime is clearly better than burning out. This was a lesson that took a few years to learn as I was a pretty annoying vegan the first few years when I was in my teens/early 20's.
[+] [-] veganjay|6 years ago|reply
also with apps and websites like Happy Cow (https://www.happycow.net) it is even easier to find vegan food on the go.
[+] [-] A4ET8a8uTh0|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nfoz|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thraxil|6 years ago|reply
There are vegans who really get into being VEGAN as an identity. Then there are the other ones who just do what we do and don't see a need to volunteer it or announce it at every possible chance. Some just live their lives, some participate in various aspects of animal rights activism. Either way, the VEGAN identity folks tend to be the ones that you will notice and remember. The rest, you pass by every day and probably never even know. (It's also worth mentioning that there are also a lot of people who are "vegan" as a fad diet (like "keto" or "paleo") but don't subscribe to the philosophy (vegans will usually try to make the distinction that those folks really just follow a plant-based diet), there are vegans who also get into weird things like raw food, alkaline water, fasting, etc. Like it or not, any large group of people will have fringes like this and they tend to be very vocal and attention seeking.)
Similarly, there are meat eaters who make BACON a huge part of their identity and like to remind you every chance they get how much they like it and "carnivore" dieters, etc.
[+] [-] keiferski|6 years ago|reply
In the contemporary absence of a cohesive worldview, people look toward communities and philosophies like veganism, atheism, political affiliations, and so on for a sense of identity.
[+] [-] sterkekoffie|6 years ago|reply
Veganism extends to all modes of consumption, not just food--for example, vegans don't buy leather or animal-tested makeup. Side note, to reduce confusion like yours, some people use 'plant-based' specifically to describe vegan food. People are vegan, products are "suitable for vegans".
[+] [-] dsjoerg|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bobbytherobot|6 years ago|reply
It is like my father-in-law who believes all gay people are loud and flamboyant. When in reality, he is dense and requires someone to hit him over the head to see it.
I've seen this out workplaces where a coworker A is vegan. A new coworker B notices and starts having a friendly chat with A about vegan food. Coworker B, who has been working and eating lunch with A for two years, is surprised to learn that A is vegan the whole time.
[+] [-] abyssin|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] andrewfromx|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jacknews|6 years ago|reply
Many meals can do well, or even be improved, by having 'much less meat'. After all, meat has been a sign of prosperity for a long time, and so it's been stuffed into many recipes that probably don't need it, or that need much less of it than curretly practiced.
'less-itarian', if you like.
[+] [-] Majestic121|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Pfhreak|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ltbarcly3|6 years ago|reply
Some possible scenarios:
They offered meat-free options that mirrored the meat-containing options. For example, they had beef lasagna and as an alternative vegetarian lasagna. If this dramatically increased the selection of vegetarian options it seems like a good indicator that there was a preference for meat free options that wasn't being satisfied.
They offered meat-free lasagna as an additional option, independent of the other available choices (so no 'regular' lasagna was offered at the same time). If this increased selection of vegetarian options, it tells us absolutely nothing. It's quite possible that many people 'felt like lasagna' that day, and that was that. To phrase this scenario another way: they could increase the selection of vegetarian options to 100% by eliminating all meat from the cafeteria, but this wouldn't demonstrate any preference for vegetarian by the customers.
Since whoever wrote this article didn't mention the methodology, my guess is that the methodology is more like my second scenario, which is to say that it was not a meaningful study but they don't want to say that because they are pushing an agenda. Either that or it's incompetence, I think Hanlon's Razor attaches at this point.
[+] [-] dmje|6 years ago|reply
What has also happened though is that low end food places - pubs, cafes, other "beige food" eateries [burgers, chips, you know, beige] - have become extraordinarily more expensive, whereas really great places have only incrementally increased prices. So you'd probably pay £15 for a crappy fish and chips in a pub, but say £18 for a really great dish in a restaurant. This has been a bit of a leveller - but also alongside this you find exponentially better veggie food in a good restaurant, whereas pubs are all still a bit "meat and two veg"...
[+] [-] seanwilson|6 years ago|reply
I can understand how people find it hard to stay vegetarian when e.g. the only vegetarian main on a restaurant menu is risotto (this happens comically often!).
Meat eaters tend to say "what would you even eat?!" because they're used to seeing menus with 90% meat options.
[+] [-] DoreenMichele|6 years ago|reply
Reading this article tempts me to want to say "Newsflash: Tasty food sells!" but I'm sure that would be flagged to death as low content snark. Also, it's possibly stupid saying anything at all because people who eat stuff like burgers and hot dogs will get all mad when you give your honest opinion that it isn't exactly gourmet health food.
I often go with, say, French fries and apple pie because it's the least worst option on a burger-based menu. When they offer chicken as an alternative to burgers, it's typically also deep fried etc. It's only very recently that some burger joints genuinely offer tasty, healthy alternatives to their bland and unhealthy ground beef patty on nasty circular white bread staple food item.
[+] [-] subpixel|6 years ago|reply
I'm not a vegetarian but I am the sort of person who would never eat a Whopper b/c it's garbage meat. Hadn't eaten in BK for probably a decade.
I ate an Impossible Whopper and I'm gonna be eating BK a lot more often.
[+] [-] mark_l_watson|6 years ago|reply
In any case I am happy that more people are getting the chance to eat more food that they prefer.
I like to stay out of any organic food, vegetarian food, etc., food arguments. People should have the freedom to buy and eat the types of food they like.
I worry a little about keeping this freedom since the single political party in the USA the republicrats (also referred to as the Demopublicans) in servicing their main constituency (I am obviously talking about corporations), might try to curtail things like accurate packaging labels, etc. if that is what their corporate constituents want.
[+] [-] unknown|6 years ago|reply
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