There was a recent article on HN about nurses being evicted from their homes for being nurses because of the pandemic. So it's really honest to god not just gig workers who are getting shafted here and treated like "lepers" so to speak.
Some of the stuff described in the article is really unfortunate and all too often an outcome of a large bureaucracy. That doesn't make it okay. They need to come up with better procedures and err on the side of making sure people don't deliver while infected and that they get any sick pay they deserve.
Supposedly, there's a stimulus package coming out that may help give some people relief as well. And I think we need a whole lot more emphasis on preventative measures generally for this pandemic.
If the US had universal healthcare, this would be less of a problem. If we solved some of our other issues, like our housing supply issues, this would be less of a problem.
Blaming the distress these workers are experiencing entirely on the fact that they are gig workers isn't reasonable. That's just one piece of the picture here.
> ...all too often an outcome of a large bureaucracy
> If the US had universal healthcare, this would be less of a problem.
Italy's socialized healthcare apparently didn't cut it. There are plenty of examples of the existing U.S. healthcare bureaucracy royally screwing up in the covid response.
Do I'm not buying the logic that an even bigger bureaucracy is the solution to Kafkaesque bureaucracy, at least not for this problem.
I especially don't understand people who are railing on the responses of Trump or BoJo also arguing that the U.S. president should be even more in charge of this sort of thing.
The really stupid part is that keeping the delivery workers safe is ALSO keeping the wealthy consumers (and owners of those businesses) safe!
If you're holed up at home and SARS-CoV-2 strolls in your front door on the outside of your toilet paper then you might as well have just taken the risk and gone shopping yourself! Such painful short-sightedness.
Thats the whole point of creating a precariat: rich peoples lives get safer and easier, poor peoples lives become less secure and harder. The system is working as intended. Three cheers for the gig-economy!!
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
I doubt that the birth of the precariat was consciously and intentionally master planned by anyone. In some sense, that's attributing too much competence to the upper classes to think they could mastermind such a plan.
In another, it's calling them more deeply and comically idiotic than they merit because even rich people are scared here lately of what is going on in the world. At least some of them wish they could figure out how to stamp out the economic instability we have and they just can't figure out how on earth that works.
It's hard to design good systems. It's much easier to design a system that does some of the things you want while overlooking a lot of important details and thereby fostering a lot of unintended consequences.
with the food-industry people cannot afford healthcare for themselves and made to work, to get the means to live, I'm very scared to order anything from any prepared-food establishments. the chances of getting contaminated food are incredibly high, esp if you order smth not thermally processed.
in some cases they might not have a choice. One of my friends is a nurse at the largest hospital in Croatia which has so far not too many cases and they're still bracing themselves for what happens when they reach capacity. They're not allowed to speak up about what's happening inside the hospitals or complain - they are in fact threatened with prison if they decide to speak up.
Despite this 2 nurses have tested positive but are asymptomatic. They aren't allowed to stop working as long as they don't develop strong symptoms. To add insult to injury there are no PPE and even if there are limited quantities available they're not allowed[1] to use it due to rationing. Visiting a hospital right now can be deadly if you're not certain to be positive already or if not in a life-threatening condition. I'd imagine it's similar in many other undeveloped or poor countries.
So tired of all this living wage crap. Hopefully you are just young idealogues. Sorry but working at McDonald's, Walmart, Disney World, or instacart were never meant to pay a living wage. They are unskilled positions meant for young workers entering the workforce to gain skills and experience or other workers to make extra money. And they don't have to exist at all. Someone think of a way to create extra money for people and all of the sudden it must support a living wage! Stop repeating platitudes ad nauseum. You are not as smart as you think you are. Why should picking up someone's groceries and bringing to their house justify a living wage as you call it?
The great part about the flexibility afforded by participating in the gig economy is that gig workers can't get unemployment, and you don't have to provide them with health insurance.
That was the major innovation of the last business cycle. It's coming home to roost in a truly spectacular way over the past month.
Before gig delivery workers, all I could get delivered was on behalf of Domino's or UPS. It's a complicated question to answer, so it's probably rhetorical, but if delivery workers needed to work full time and get significantly higher compensation, would we even have the same magnitude delivery service we're talking about here?
[+] [-] DoreenMichele|6 years ago|reply
Some of the stuff described in the article is really unfortunate and all too often an outcome of a large bureaucracy. That doesn't make it okay. They need to come up with better procedures and err on the side of making sure people don't deliver while infected and that they get any sick pay they deserve.
Supposedly, there's a stimulus package coming out that may help give some people relief as well. And I think we need a whole lot more emphasis on preventative measures generally for this pandemic.
If the US had universal healthcare, this would be less of a problem. If we solved some of our other issues, like our housing supply issues, this would be less of a problem.
Blaming the distress these workers are experiencing entirely on the fact that they are gig workers isn't reasonable. That's just one piece of the picture here.
[+] [-] humanrebar|6 years ago|reply
> If the US had universal healthcare, this would be less of a problem.
Italy's socialized healthcare apparently didn't cut it. There are plenty of examples of the existing U.S. healthcare bureaucracy royally screwing up in the covid response.
Do I'm not buying the logic that an even bigger bureaucracy is the solution to Kafkaesque bureaucracy, at least not for this problem.
I especially don't understand people who are railing on the responses of Trump or BoJo also arguing that the U.S. president should be even more in charge of this sort of thing.
[+] [-] erpellan|6 years ago|reply
If you're holed up at home and SARS-CoV-2 strolls in your front door on the outside of your toilet paper then you might as well have just taken the risk and gone shopping yourself! Such painful short-sightedness.
[+] [-] pixl97|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] fergie|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DoreenMichele|6 years ago|reply
I doubt that the birth of the precariat was consciously and intentionally master planned by anyone. In some sense, that's attributing too much competence to the upper classes to think they could mastermind such a plan.
In another, it's calling them more deeply and comically idiotic than they merit because even rich people are scared here lately of what is going on in the world. At least some of them wish they could figure out how to stamp out the economic instability we have and they just can't figure out how on earth that works.
It's hard to design good systems. It's much easier to design a system that does some of the things you want while overlooking a lot of important details and thereby fostering a lot of unintended consequences.
[+] [-] amelius|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] altmind|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] netfl0|6 years ago|reply
Source?
[+] [-] onetimemanytime|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DyslexicAtheist|6 years ago|reply
Despite this 2 nurses have tested positive but are asymptomatic. They aren't allowed to stop working as long as they don't develop strong symptoms. To add insult to injury there are no PPE and even if there are limited quantities available they're not allowed[1] to use it due to rationing. Visiting a hospital right now can be deadly if you're not certain to be positive already or if not in a life-threatening condition. I'd imagine it's similar in many other undeveloped or poor countries.
[1] in Croatian https://www.medicinskasestra.eu/2020/03/25/medicinske-sestre... images from article OCR'ed and google translated: https://pastebin.com/nVXTdDgT
[+] [-] grandridge|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] neonate|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mrtweetyhack|6 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] Proven|6 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] vkou|6 years ago|reply
That was the major innovation of the last business cycle. It's coming home to roost in a truly spectacular way over the past month.
[+] [-] humanrebar|6 years ago|reply