What's next, some kind of "purchase another 100 lines of code" DLC package? You know, as a kid I learned BASIC from school friends, neighbors, and family members, and taught BASIC to many more, by trading the source code freely. Books like "BASIC Computer Games" were gotten at the library for free. My computer booted into BASIC for free.
Now I realize how disadvantaged I was, this is the future -- teaching children about "platforms", that hold your code hostage, monetize on your creative works, and nickel and dime away your creative energy.
To think, all that nasty PIRATING of BASIC code !! Without paying anyone?! Thousands of dollars on the table, finally somebody is monetizing this!
Well, let me try explaining how it works, because they honestly do a pretty bad job of it.
So SmileBASIC 4 itself costs 25 USD (40 AUD).
A server ticket costs 5 USD (9 AUD). Despite the name, these tickets never expire or get used up. How these work is as follows:
- If you have 0 tickets, you can only download once every 8 hours, and you can't upload anything.
- If you have n tickets, where n > 0, then you have unlimited downloads, and can upload 10*n projects at once. (Note that you can take down old projects to make room for new ones.)
Personally speaking, unless you really need to upload a lot of projects at once (and 10 slots goes further than you might think), you really only need one ticket.
The reason this server ticket system exists is because SmileBoom is a pretty small company (their site lists 8.2 million yen in capital, about 76,000 USD or 120,000 AUD), and this helps offset server costs.
In any case, if you still find this system distasteful, there's nothing stopping you from continuing to do it the old way, manually typing in programs by hand. That said, I don't think it's so unreasonable to ask for a few bucks for server access, especially as a one-time fee.
(Note also that originally the plan was for SmileBASIC 4 to only be sold as a bundle with one ticket. The standalone version was added because there were issues with it showing up in the eShop properly otherwise.)
EDIT: One more note: this is a project limit, but you can have multiple files in a project, and the maximum project upload size is 20 MB. As you probably know, text doesn't take up much space, so you can cram a LOT of small programs into one project if you need to.
The entire console market is retarded like that: you have to sign onerous NDAs, pay incredibly high fees for the "privilege" of creating additional software for the console vendors and thus making their consoles more valuable and all you get is some shoddy SDK with awful licensing terms (what? You used some (L)GPL'd code as your engine's base? Sorry, no can do. - You wrote your engine in an open source language that has no official support and you ported the runtime? Haha, LOL, no buddy, you can't give this back to the mainline developers, this contains our secret sauce, sucks to be you but you'll need to maintain this forever).
I have a PSVita and i really like its hardware, but honestly it was a waste of money since there isn't anything i can do with it. Switch also looks nice, but again it will soon be useless.
The best you can hope for with these is for someone to find some security flaw after the vendor has stopped supporting the device, that will allow homebrew development in the future. But by that time you might as well buy a cheap Chinese android device (or even better something like GPD Win that is a full proper PC in handheld form - though that isn't very cheap) and chances are it'll be both faster and better.
We need a modern “codable console” in the spirit of the Commodore 64 and Sinclair Spectrum etc.
Something you can just unbox and start playing and programming on right away. The Raspberry Pi is not it, the iPad isn’t it, and neither is any Android. The remakes/revivals of the C64 etc. are not it either.
Something like a laptop that boots into a friendly GUI/CLI hybrid within 1 second, and doesn’t require the internet or signing-up or any other bullshit. Just a big fat blinking cursor.
I presume your ZX-Spectrum didn't come with an online softwar distribution service. Mind certainly didn't. I typed it in from printouts like we all did.
> You know, as a kid I learned BASIC from school friends, neighbors, and family members, and taught BASIC to many more, by trading the source code freely.
Well you can still do all fo that. Get your friends to send you their BASIC code and type that yourself into the console.
Even as a kid, you weren't paying somebody to host your code.
I’m currently mindblown at one of the programs publicly available for download in the software, which is a NEC PC-8801 emulator... I peeked at the BASIC code and it does indeed appear to be emulating a Z80 and it even includes support for loading real BIOS dumps and floppy images seemingly.
I can’t find much information about the software online but I think it was developed for one of the competitions and I’d highly recommend checking it out if you decide to purchase SmileBASIC 4.
Can you share a link? Do you think would it be possible to play with the code from the (free) book "Machine code for beginners" [0] with that emulator? I'd like to get some familiarity with machine code, and thought maybe it's a simplest way to start with. Or maybe you can give other suggestions for the emulator?
From the book (page 3):
> The book is specially written for computers with a Z80 or 6502 microprocessor.
Very cool. This will probably get some kids onto the path of a future programming career. I remember my first PC running MS DOS, being young and curios I just had to try everything, eventually stumbling upon Pascal, and that would basically shape my adult life.
Sometimes I worry about the new generation though, despite the prevalence of technology and information, most grow up on locked down mobile systems, which are made for consumption and don't promote creating very well. They are also very opaque to what's actually happening under the hood. Mobile UI is an godsend for user experience, but it's also one heck of an abstraction layer.
Maybe that's why so many people are trying their luck with becoming influencers, streamers or youtubers, because that's seems like the kind of content creation these devices promote.
Anyway, on the same vein, I was positively surprised when Overwatch added some kind of visual coding environment for custom games a year or so ago. Seemed a bit silly, but give kids the tools, and they'll create. I'm sure that alone will have a real positive impact for many young adults.
I’ve gotten my kid very into Nintendo Labo. You build toys from cardboard that hold the controllers and so you can drive a car in the game with a cardboard wheel, for example. But the whole thing is a veneer on learning how the toys work through additional activities, and then a drag and drop programming interface is available so you can make your own interactive tools using the Switch. He’s not quite old enough to grasp the programming interface, but the discovery section demystifies the abstraction layer of the controller. Its not just a box. Its a box you open up and change.
If you are interested in this topic (coding on mobile), can you take a look at my pet project https://github.com/stefanhaustein/tantilla and and let me know what you think? O:)
i waited forever for a release on the DS. it finally came but on the switch. also the developers told me that a switch lite wouldn't be the best experience (not TV output among a few things).
I believe Fuze doesn’t have a server for sharing your work, but they do have a moderated forum where you can share your Nintendo friend code, and this way you can share your project.
That's not the first solution, when gaming console gave access to hardware through simple programming language for the purpose of entertainment and education. There was Sega Saturn Game Basic [0], published in 1998 and giving access to almost all console hardware capabilities.
However, 2020 is not 1998, and I personally consider Basic a bit outdated even for education purposes. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool to introduce world of programming to kids, but Python would have been much more practical and extremely simple to learn.
[+] [-] jquast|6 years ago|reply
ok.. so it costs money, but if I want to share a game I write, or look at others, I'd have to buy some kind of ticket? $9 to upload a limited amount of code, https://ec.nintendo.com/AU/en/titles/70010000010544/consumab...
What's next, some kind of "purchase another 100 lines of code" DLC package? You know, as a kid I learned BASIC from school friends, neighbors, and family members, and taught BASIC to many more, by trading the source code freely. Books like "BASIC Computer Games" were gotten at the library for free. My computer booted into BASIC for free.
Now I realize how disadvantaged I was, this is the future -- teaching children about "platforms", that hold your code hostage, monetize on your creative works, and nickel and dime away your creative energy.
To think, all that nasty PIRATING of BASIC code !! Without paying anyone?! Thousands of dollars on the table, finally somebody is monetizing this!
[+] [-] niconii|6 years ago|reply
So SmileBASIC 4 itself costs 25 USD (40 AUD).
A server ticket costs 5 USD (9 AUD). Despite the name, these tickets never expire or get used up. How these work is as follows:
- If you have 0 tickets, you can only download once every 8 hours, and you can't upload anything.
- If you have n tickets, where n > 0, then you have unlimited downloads, and can upload 10*n projects at once. (Note that you can take down old projects to make room for new ones.)
Personally speaking, unless you really need to upload a lot of projects at once (and 10 slots goes further than you might think), you really only need one ticket.
The reason this server ticket system exists is because SmileBoom is a pretty small company (their site lists 8.2 million yen in capital, about 76,000 USD or 120,000 AUD), and this helps offset server costs.
In any case, if you still find this system distasteful, there's nothing stopping you from continuing to do it the old way, manually typing in programs by hand. That said, I don't think it's so unreasonable to ask for a few bucks for server access, especially as a one-time fee.
(Note also that originally the plan was for SmileBASIC 4 to only be sold as a bundle with one ticket. The standalone version was added because there were issues with it showing up in the eShop properly otherwise.)
EDIT: One more note: this is a project limit, but you can have multiple files in a project, and the maximum project upload size is 20 MB. As you probably know, text doesn't take up much space, so you can cram a LOT of small programs into one project if you need to.
[+] [-] badsectoracula|6 years ago|reply
I have a PSVita and i really like its hardware, but honestly it was a waste of money since there isn't anything i can do with it. Switch also looks nice, but again it will soon be useless.
The best you can hope for with these is for someone to find some security flaw after the vendor has stopped supporting the device, that will allow homebrew development in the future. But by that time you might as well buy a cheap Chinese android device (or even better something like GPD Win that is a full proper PC in handheld form - though that isn't very cheap) and chances are it'll be both faster and better.
[+] [-] Razengan|6 years ago|reply
Something you can just unbox and start playing and programming on right away. The Raspberry Pi is not it, the iPad isn’t it, and neither is any Android. The remakes/revivals of the C64 etc. are not it either.
Something like a laptop that boots into a friendly GUI/CLI hybrid within 1 second, and doesn’t require the internet or signing-up or any other bullshit. Just a big fat blinking cursor.
[+] [-] Angostura|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thought_alarm|6 years ago|reply
Your computer wasn't free, and you still had to buy disks if you wanted to save your work or trade with friends.
[+] [-] znpy|6 years ago|reply
Well you can still do all fo that. Get your friends to send you their BASIC code and type that yourself into the console.
Even as a kid, you weren't paying somebody to host your code.
[+] [-] grawprog|6 years ago|reply
>or unlimited downloading of the published works,
Even if you don't intend to write any of your own code, a server ticket seems to be required to even download code.
[+] [-] bitwize|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jchw|6 years ago|reply
I can’t find much information about the software online but I think it was developed for one of the competitions and I’d highly recommend checking it out if you decide to purchase SmileBASIC 4.
[+] [-] qilo|6 years ago|reply
From the book (page 3):
> The book is specially written for computers with a Z80 or 6502 microprocessor.
[0] https://usborne.com/browse-books/features/computer-and-codin...
[+] [-] tabs_masterrace|6 years ago|reply
Sometimes I worry about the new generation though, despite the prevalence of technology and information, most grow up on locked down mobile systems, which are made for consumption and don't promote creating very well. They are also very opaque to what's actually happening under the hood. Mobile UI is an godsend for user experience, but it's also one heck of an abstraction layer.
Maybe that's why so many people are trying their luck with becoming influencers, streamers or youtubers, because that's seems like the kind of content creation these devices promote.
Anyway, on the same vein, I was positively surprised when Overwatch added some kind of visual coding environment for custom games a year or so ago. Seemed a bit silly, but give kids the tools, and they'll create. I'm sure that alone will have a real positive impact for many young adults.
[+] [-] thedevelopnik|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dukoid|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] blondin|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] niconii|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] kennydude|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gabrielsroka|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] fuzzball_b|6 years ago|reply
I believe Fuze doesn’t have a server for sharing your work, but they do have a moderated forum where you can share your Nintendo friend code, and this way you can share your project.
[+] [-] dukoid|6 years ago|reply
[+] [-] strategarius|6 years ago|reply
However, 2020 is not 1998, and I personally consider Basic a bit outdated even for education purposes. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool to introduce world of programming to kids, but Python would have been much more practical and extremely simple to learn.
[0] https://youtu.be/O_QU8eaMymo