San Francisco faces fiscal chaos

[mc32]

CA has always been about boom and busts. Governor Brown knew this and kept a tight fist on the purse strings... to the chagrin and annoyance of the “we’re rich, let’s spend” crowd. If it were not for his fiscal conservatism it’s be even worse. Of course SF is the poster child for spending copious amounts of money on pet projects while ignoring the big issues.

[mylons]

CA’s booms and busts now, for the state and city governments, is almost purely centered around Prop 13. The NIMBYs won. Unless you have owned a home for decades and have insanely low property taxes it’s extremely hard to weather these cycles. NIMBYs gain from the booms, and relax during the busts.

And as a result of Prop 13 the state relies heavily on income taxes, when people leave or lose their jobs there goes the state income.

[tarr11]

Every major city seems to have its own flavor of this. See also:

New York budget crisis [0], Chicago [1], Dallas [2], etc

[0] https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/05/31/new-york-budget...

[1] https://www.wbez.org/amp/stories/how-covid-19-could-hit-chic...

[2] https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/dallas-budget-crisis-prese...

[baskire]

Don’t forget the pension issue

https://www.sfexaminer.com/news/genuine-solutions-for-san-fr...

[jlewis_st]

This article appears to be mostly cribbed from SF Chronicle's coverage, which has additional context and some discussion of pension obligations [0]

[0] https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/SF...

[thoughtstheseus]

Curious how local and state governments can face “fiscal chaos” while debt issues by the federal govt. is highly desirable. People say governments run deficits during economic downturns (which is true) but in the US local and state spending is more pro-cyclical.

[mylons]

Cities can’t print money

[dmode]

Here’s the thing - I have been hearing doom and gloom about SF for 20 years. It will do fine

[ipnon]

Bust is an overloaded term. The proposition here is that San Francisco is entering a multi year recession.

[hiram112]

The problem has always been the pension obligations, specifically the medical costs. The math cannot be disputed. The reason why it really is different this time is because the Boomers will reach end of life, whether they like it or not, and medical costs rise exponentially in the last few years.

States and localities who were in decent shape until now will be able to weather this storm by raising taxes (even more) on the younger generations. In California, there isn't anymore left to squeeze due to Prop 13.

[BenjiWiebe]

They missed a great headline opportunity: 'Frisco faces fiscal fiasco.

[Wolfenstein98k]

San Fran is a bizarre place. I'm an Aussie, an Americanophile, and I was in the States for months last year. San Fran was simply unpleasant - the people were rude (young and old) and everything cost too much. The taxes were insane too.

I couldn't bear to live there - Salt Lake City seemed to have the most similar upsides with next to none of the downsides.

[programmertote]

> San Fran was simply unpleasant - the people were rude (young and old) and everything cost too much. The taxes were insane too.

Tangential, but I feel the same way about NYC. I have lived in SF for ~3 years and have now been in NYC for ~4 years. I guess cities, that are HCOL, tend to exacerbate the (low and high income) class disparities, and maybe also heighten residents' stress and reduce their patience levels?

[Hongwei]

Canuck here who spends a lot of time in the States (or used to). SLC also has some of the most underrated and inexpensive skiing just 30 minutes out from the airport.

[aphextron]

>"I couldn't bear to live there - Salt Lake City seemed to have the most similar upsides with next to none of the downsides."

SLC seems nice in theory, until you realize Utah is a theocracy. Not a great place to live for anyone outside the LDS church.

[mint2]

There’s actually people who will be rude or give worse service if they hear it referred to as “San Fran” rather than sf or the full name. I hope that didn’t happen to you.

[mseidl]

There they have the sexy underwear in Utah.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_garment

I used to live in the US, but I'm back home in Germany. I have 0 interest in going back.

[diogenescynic]

I think a more accurate description would be that San Francisco chooses chaos. I've never lived anywhere more unreasonably governed. It's like the government is actively sabotaging quality of life and squandering its budget. One example--the city spent $15.5m to tear down a McDonalds in the Haight and turn it into a homeless tent camp.

[drfuchs]

Hmmm. There was a lot of local support for the city to get rid of that very-problematic McDonalds, as the police were being called there on an average of once per day over drug dealing, shootings, etc. And the lot is slated to be developed into high-density housing, which is typically a popular notion in the HN crowd.

https://sf.curbed.com/2018/4/2/17188892/haight-steet-mcdonal...

[dzlobin]

While I don’t disagree that SF is a mess, your example is completely wrong. That lot will become low-income housing and is temporarily being used as that.

https://sfmohcd.org/730-stanyan

[m0llusk]

SF problems come from its people and wild economic and cultural swings. Government would love to have more influence, but it really doesn't.

The McDonalds you refer to was a huge problem for a long time and right now the only argument is about exactly how big an apartment building to put there.

[bambam24]

This article is totally lives in SF. Author should know that this story is same in every city in the world. Not just SF. He might hate SF or whatever but what happens in SF is happening in every city in the world. Good Morning