I was at the Rose Bowl this year and something I noticed was how much of the game was spent staring at the jumbotron rather than watching the game live.
Sitting in the stands no longer feels like you're watching an incredible game. Instead it feels like you're watching the game live on ESPN(given the level of advertisements) but sitting in the stands.
I'm certainly not the first to point out how commercialized sports have become, but it's disconcerting seeing stadiums try to hook you into staring at an ad for four hours instead of enjoying a once-in-a-lifetime experience.
Another example was the flyover: A B2 flew over just before kickoff[0] and I, along with almost everyone else, had never seen one before. An announcement over the loudspeakers asked that everyone hold up a small sign so that the stadium looked like the American flag from above. This was great for viewers at home and horrible for anyone in the stands because all you could see was the back of the sign you and everyone else were holding up.
We seem to have gotten so far away from what sports are about(two teams competing to see who's best) that we've landed on milking as much money out of the fans as they possibly can.
Facial recognition, in this context, seems to be doing the same. Rather than giving fans a fantastic experience, the folks running these games are trying to monetize them instead.
>that we've landed on milking as much money out of
I take issues with your use of the word "we". If you asked them, 95% of people would say this should stop. In the past, economic and political leaders were drawn from the nation as a whole, and had a sense of loyalty and social obligation to their fellow countrymen, even if it meant leaving a few dollars on the table. Globalization and the increasing cultural and ethnic divide between the upper and lower classes in western countries has ended that fealty. May it soon return.
I've stopped putting any money/attention in organized sports quite some time ago, I was disgusted my money-first orientation of basically all of them and how everything was focused on sponsorships, promotions etc rather than actual effort. Morals often go down the toilet, like in cycling.
Anyway its infinitely better to focus on actually doing the sports rather than just watching them passively.
I make exceptions from time to time, but only for more or less marginal sports without big bucks. If folks do it mainly because they love it, then count me in. Climbing seemed for a long time doing just fine, but its also changing, and with introduction on olympics I may start skipping that one too.
All those that spend money on this are partially guilty... vote with your wallet and your time (which for ad business is money at the end).
> We seem to have gotten so far away from what sports are about(two teams competing to see who's best) that we've landed on milking as much money out of the fans as they possibly can.
It isn't just sports. It's everything. I've read several articles posted here on HN where someone makes a cool piece of hardware and they can't get funding until they come up with a subscription model to charge customers every 30 days. Look at app stores, Apple had meetings with devs a few years ago to get them on board with a subscription model for apps. Now it is the developer preferred model. Even (chain) restaurant food has been optimized for cost and not flavor.
Facial recognition tech should really have more regulations in place. What if this was done at the recent protests and there's now a database full of facial data that associates those people with likely political affiliations, etc.
Imagine in hitler had access to this tech and simply purchased a database of "Likely Jewish" facial data?
The database you described has existed for a while. It's called social media.
People voluntarily post their minute-frequency gps location, workplace, political and religious leanings, sexual preferences, views on current events, and an exhaustive list of friends, family, coworkers, and other associates. Not to mention hundreds, if not thousands, of geo-tagged pictures of themselves over the years, along with a list of the other people in the frame, as well as a written discussion of the events photographed.
> Imagine in hitler had access to this tech and simply purchased a database of "Likely Jewish" facial data?
This basically happened with lower-tech stuff; one of the ways that the Holocaust was facilitated was by conducting detailed censuses of the population, courtesy of IBM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and_the_Holocaust
Sports attendance is way down, I don't care what the sports themselves say.
During the NFL Playoffs they couldn't show crowd shots because there were enough empty seats that it was noticeable. I saw empty seats at the super bowl.
I saw highlight on ESPN of an NBA game before the lock down, and it looked like a high School basketball game because of the number of empty seats.
Considering every player in the NBA, MLB, NFL, and NHL are all part of the 1% I'm done contributing to the rich.
I'll go see minor league baseball games, they are much more fun anyway.
> During the NFL Playoffs they couldn't show crowd shots because there were enough empty seats that it was noticeable. I saw empty seats at the super bowl.
I am pretty sure the Superbowl was sold out. People just didn't show up or were stuck in traffic. I believe this will be true for any NFL playoff games.
> Sports attendance is way down
Citations needed. Other than baseball, I highly doubt this is true for any sports in the US. Unless it's a team like Phoenix Suns.
Might depend on the team. Even the Lakers vs. Clipper on March 8 2020 (days before lockdown in California), was packed at Staples Center.
No idea if after COVID there would be the same attendance...
Various research institutions have internal rules concerning ethics of experimentation on humans (e.g. process of institutional review boards), and various research grants have stipulations that research funded by those grants must follow such ethics rules, and various research publication venues have rules that they will only publish research that followed the rules.
That being said, that's essentially a "voluntary initiative" by these organizations implemented because they choose to follow these ethics guidelines. These ethics rules aren't universal or legally mandated for everyone so if a private company wants to do some unethical research with its own funds, if they don't want to publish the research but just use and sell it, then that company is not legally required or forced to follow any ethical restrictions. Within the limits of law, they can be as unethical as their owners are.
The solution to lack of ethics is legal restrictions and enforcement of them. A few USA states have limitations on facial recognition. In EU, GDPR would apply for a situation like this.
Inevitably when GDPR comes up, there are always HN commenters talking disparagingly about the "nanny state" in Europe. However, I'll take some annoying cookie banners over an ad tech company scanning my face any day of the week. If this was in Europe, they would've gotten hit with a fine of 4% of their revenue.
Issue with the banners is that my answer is always, "no". Yet, I have to do a lot of work to say, "no" on every single website.
This makes it inconvenient to explore the web at large.
The banners should be opt-in not opt-out, but this is against many of the website owner's current interests - including many news sites. So, I've stopped visiting them.
I think people might be freaked out if they learned just how many stores/attractions already have similar tech implemented. Ah who am I kidding, the average person doesn’t seem to care all that much - quite unfortunate.
It seems a bit weird to say that something hasn't been reported in the mainstream media, and then link to a Rolling Stone article on it from two years ago...
This can't be stopped. Better to stop resisting tech advancements and instead learn to adapt. Airports are starting to do this scanning as well, and they won't go away; travellers don't know they exist and have few rights when in secure environments.
There has been at least a temporarily reprieve; thanks to Covid-19 in the summer, it's now socially acceptable to walk around town wearing a mask and sunglasses.
The "right to not be observed" is not a natural right, nor should it be. The "right to absolute privacy in all places at all times" is also not a natural right, nor should it be.
People should only be entitled to privacy in their own homes/current dwelling. That's it (with a few exceptions). People should not be entitled to privacy in public.
I get that privacy zealots have to take extreme stances in order to counter-balance anti-privacy trends, but in real life, a world where absolute perfect privacy is the 24/7 default (public and private), is a world devoid of meaningful interactions between humans and also a world where criminals flourish.
1) They didn't know about the surveillance. To quote from the article:
> “I actually had no idea they were using that type of tech at the game nor was I informed that I would be recorded or analyzed by such tech,” said California resident Benjamin Mercke. “Actually, that’s incredibly concerning to me.”
2) Any entertainment can be reduced to being considered pointless. I don't think it's a big stretch to accept that people are entertained by different things. I personally find concerts / music festivals unbelievably boring, but it's obvious that people love them, so I have no opinion on whether it's "worth it" to them.
[+] [-] kyle_morris_|5 years ago|reply
Sitting in the stands no longer feels like you're watching an incredible game. Instead it feels like you're watching the game live on ESPN(given the level of advertisements) but sitting in the stands.
I'm certainly not the first to point out how commercialized sports have become, but it's disconcerting seeing stadiums try to hook you into staring at an ad for four hours instead of enjoying a once-in-a-lifetime experience.
Another example was the flyover: A B2 flew over just before kickoff[0] and I, along with almost everyone else, had never seen one before. An announcement over the loudspeakers asked that everyone hold up a small sign so that the stadium looked like the American flag from above. This was great for viewers at home and horrible for anyone in the stands because all you could see was the back of the sign you and everyone else were holding up.
We seem to have gotten so far away from what sports are about(two teams competing to see who's best) that we've landed on milking as much money out of the fans as they possibly can.
Facial recognition, in this context, seems to be doing the same. Rather than giving fans a fantastic experience, the folks running these games are trying to monetize them instead.
[0] - https://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/2020/01/check-out-this-aeri...
[+] [-] etrabroline|5 years ago|reply
I take issues with your use of the word "we". If you asked them, 95% of people would say this should stop. In the past, economic and political leaders were drawn from the nation as a whole, and had a sense of loyalty and social obligation to their fellow countrymen, even if it meant leaving a few dollars on the table. Globalization and the increasing cultural and ethnic divide between the upper and lower classes in western countries has ended that fealty. May it soon return.
[+] [-] saiya-jin|5 years ago|reply
Anyway its infinitely better to focus on actually doing the sports rather than just watching them passively.
I make exceptions from time to time, but only for more or less marginal sports without big bucks. If folks do it mainly because they love it, then count me in. Climbing seemed for a long time doing just fine, but its also changing, and with introduction on olympics I may start skipping that one too.
All those that spend money on this are partially guilty... vote with your wallet and your time (which for ad business is money at the end).
[+] [-] theklub|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chooseaname|5 years ago|reply
It isn't just sports. It's everything. I've read several articles posted here on HN where someone makes a cool piece of hardware and they can't get funding until they come up with a subscription model to charge customers every 30 days. Look at app stores, Apple had meetings with devs a few years ago to get them on board with a subscription model for apps. Now it is the developer preferred model. Even (chain) restaurant food has been optimized for cost and not flavor.
[+] [-] jb775|5 years ago|reply
Imagine in hitler had access to this tech and simply purchased a database of "Likely Jewish" facial data?
[+] [-] gdhbcc|5 years ago|reply
Do you genuinely believe those drones flying over every major city taking high resolution photos of everyone within 30 miles are there for fun?
[+] [-] fludlight|5 years ago|reply
People voluntarily post their minute-frequency gps location, workplace, political and religious leanings, sexual preferences, views on current events, and an exhaustive list of friends, family, coworkers, and other associates. Not to mention hundreds, if not thousands, of geo-tagged pictures of themselves over the years, along with a list of the other people in the frame, as well as a written discussion of the events photographed.
[+] [-] 1over137|5 years ago|reply
Seems more likely than not that it was done at recent protests, no?
[+] [-] bobthepanda|5 years ago|reply
This basically happened with lower-tech stuff; one of the ways that the Holocaust was facilitated was by conducting detailed censuses of the population, courtesy of IBM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and_the_Holocaust
[+] [-] unknown|5 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] watertom|5 years ago|reply
During the NFL Playoffs they couldn't show crowd shots because there were enough empty seats that it was noticeable. I saw empty seats at the super bowl.
I saw highlight on ESPN of an NBA game before the lock down, and it looked like a high School basketball game because of the number of empty seats.
Considering every player in the NBA, MLB, NFL, and NHL are all part of the 1% I'm done contributing to the rich.
I'll go see minor league baseball games, they are much more fun anyway.
[+] [-] what_ever|5 years ago|reply
I am pretty sure the Superbowl was sold out. People just didn't show up or were stuck in traffic. I believe this will be true for any NFL playoff games.
> Sports attendance is way down
Citations needed. Other than baseball, I highly doubt this is true for any sports in the US. Unless it's a team like Phoenix Suns.
[+] [-] llsf|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] colinmhayes|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rst|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cardiffspaceman|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gruez|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] PeterisP|5 years ago|reply
That being said, that's essentially a "voluntary initiative" by these organizations implemented because they choose to follow these ethics guidelines. These ethics rules aren't universal or legally mandated for everyone so if a private company wants to do some unethical research with its own funds, if they don't want to publish the research but just use and sell it, then that company is not legally required or forced to follow any ethical restrictions. Within the limits of law, they can be as unethical as their owners are.
The solution to lack of ethics is legal restrictions and enforcement of them. A few USA states have limitations on facial recognition. In EU, GDPR would apply for a situation like this.
[+] [-] unknown|5 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] freeone3000|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jeffbee|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] kevsim|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] youeseh|5 years ago|reply
This makes it inconvenient to explore the web at large.
The banners should be opt-in not opt-out, but this is against many of the website owner's current interests - including many news sites. So, I've stopped visiting them.
[+] [-] nwsm|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dawnerd|5 years ago|reply
https://www.aclu.org/blog/privacy-technology/surveillance-te...
[+] [-] cbsmith|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] vincentmarle|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] canyon289|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] arpinum|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] catalogia|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] umvi|5 years ago|reply
People should only be entitled to privacy in their own homes/current dwelling. That's it (with a few exceptions). People should not be entitled to privacy in public.
I get that privacy zealots have to take extreme stances in order to counter-balance anti-privacy trends, but in real life, a world where absolute perfect privacy is the 24/7 default (public and private), is a world devoid of meaningful interactions between humans and also a world where criminals flourish.
[+] [-] rootsudo|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] throwjulyjuly|5 years ago|reply
1) They didn't know about the surveillance. To quote from the article:
> “I actually had no idea they were using that type of tech at the game nor was I informed that I would be recorded or analyzed by such tech,” said California resident Benjamin Mercke. “Actually, that’s incredibly concerning to me.”
2) Any entertainment can be reduced to being considered pointless. I don't think it's a big stretch to accept that people are entertained by different things. I personally find concerts / music festivals unbelievably boring, but it's obvious that people love them, so I have no opinion on whether it's "worth it" to them.
[+] [-] wyldfire|5 years ago|reply
From the article:
>Three fans who attended the Rose Bowl game and spoke to OneZero said they didn’t remember seeing any notice that they were being surveilled.
It's unlikely that anyone knew enough to be able to make an informed decision.
Sadly, legally, "privacy" is something you're not generally entitled to when outside in public (in the US AFAIK).
[+] [-] s_y_n_t_a_x|5 years ago|reply
Entertainment is subjective and I doubt you stare a blank wall all day so we could make fun of how you spend your time.
The football stadium is like the colosseum down here. It brings a lot of revenue to the towns and something to do.
Sports helps keeps kids out of trouble as well.