[ordinaryperson]

Without specifics this article is not helpful.

I've had 5 orthopedic surgeries and they were transformative -- and this article is written by an orthopedist!

There's some data [1] against these operations:

- Arthoscopic knee surgery

- Subacromial shoulder decompression

- Acromioplasty for rotator cuffs

- Vertebroplasty for the spine

That's 4 techniques out of...how many exactly?

It's just an n=1 anecdote but my surgeries absolutely changed my life for the better. I don't want to get into the gory details but I feel incredibly grateful to have had such talented surgeons.

You can argue placebo but my years of ineffective physical therapy suggest otherwise.

Instead of saying "Surgery, the Ultimate Placebo" this article should say "A handful of specific surgeries shown to be no better than a placebo" -- generically describing all surgeries as a placebo is clickbait, in my non-medical-professional opinion.

[1] https://www.realclearscience.com/blog/2020/11/07/some_surger...

[OJFord]

> It's just an n=1 anecdote but my surgeries absolutely changed my life for the better. [...] You can argue placebo but my years of ineffective physical therapy suggest otherwise.

They don't though, do they. You can't disprove placebo with N=1.

If the placebo is the act of surgery then anything not surgery not working doesn't mean that the surgery worked by not placebo means.

But who cares how, it worked!

[ordinaryperson]

So cynical. I hope you're never in debilitating physical pain, only to have other people dismiss the effect of surgical intervention as a figment of your imagination.

It's not just about the sample size, I could get into the anatomy of my injuries but I don't want to divulge more of my medical privacy than I already have.

Suffice to say that when certain things are torn or detached surgical intervention is often the only way to re-attach or restore function to the affected joints. No mount of wishing it way mentally is going to change that.

[hef19898]

Orthopedic surgery is, IMHO, one the most "controversial" medical fields. Ask an orthopedic surgeon, and the answer will be in most cases surgery. Ask a non-surgeon orthopedic, and the answer will be therapy. Source: Having gone through some consultations, and having family that spent their professional career in orthopedic rehab.

Thing is, for every case one of the above might wrong there are two cases they might be right. Sometimes both are right.

Personally, I choose to forgo surgery. I have no intention to become a professional athlete or compete again, so I stick with my original parts, so to say. I did stop snowboarding and kickboxing, so. My knees really don't like these sports anymore. And I don't like them enough to go through surgery. I switched to boxing and skiing. I am rather sure that I would chosen surgery like 10 years or so ago.

[grumple]

If a surgery’s effectiveness has not been evaluated vs a placebo, you cannot assume it to be effective based on anecdotes. Obviously there are many surgeries that are effective (repeating broken limbs, emergency surgeries, etc). Those surgeries having to do with pain relief are more nebulous.

My partner is a physical therapist, and in cases where it’s ineffective, it’s often because the patient is noncompliant or is doing it just to check off that “attempt” prior to surgery. A relative, as an example, goes to PT for all sorts of issues, but her real problems are psychological/neurological (due to brain damage); no amount of PT will ever heal her mind or change her excessive perception of pain.

[rozab]

It's really interesting how people with theoretical knowledge of what the placebo effect is can still refuse to believe in it in practice. From my experience, I think a lot of doctors don't really believe in these effects.

[appleflaxen]

You and Sam's mum have the best health care ever.

[voxl]

So the surgeon found water for you. Good for you, I'd rather listen to the data.