top | item 25517868

How bad is your Spotify?

974 points| feross | 5 years ago |pudding.cool

607 comments

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[+] etherio|5 years ago|reply
This is hilarious...

> You are 26% basic. You're trying to be cool with Kapitan Korsakov, but your favorites are the same as everybody else's..

> Your spotify was please-read-my-manuscript-walmart-hawaiian-shirt-sitting-alone-in-the-cafeteria bad.

Ouch.

Really interesting project by all means. I hope they release the source - I'm curious about how it was built.

Edit: This same link was posted 11 hours ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25513886 here and is not at all getting the same popularity. Anyone got ideas?

[+] blhack|5 years ago|reply
Huh, I wonder if this is just a mad lib that is being used to gather information about people?

It's sayin stuff like "You know music existed before 2019, right?", but also criticizing me for liking Stan Rogers, who died in 1983, Jay Z, and Trevor Hall, who seemed to peak in the early 2000s.

Maybe I just haven't finished my coffee yet, but I was kindof hoping that this would actually use AI to figure out the musical variety of my listening history and suggest more people to listen to or something like that. Seems like it was just a bunch of mad libbed insults though.

[+] nwsm|5 years ago|reply
Yeah some of it seemed tailored and accurate, specifically the insults at the end (They pegged my music perfectly with "stoner-frat-bro bad"), but most of it was just pulling most played artists and songs and making vague jokes.
[+] Agentlien|5 years ago|reply
I had the same feeling. It made a spot on joke about how much AC/DC I listen to followed by a funny and relevant comment about too much Slipknot. But then it followed it up by calling me obsessed with two bands I can't even remember listening to in recent years. One of which I never really listened much to.
[+] mot0rola|5 years ago|reply
i did not understand the need for the hostile language.

i regret letting this access my account. i would recommend others to not give this tool access, it is not worth it.

[+] nilram|5 years ago|reply
> You know music existed before 2019, right?

It gave me the line about being stuck in 2010. Just an insult machine. It would actually be useful if it gave me songs it thought were more "cool" based on my current lists. Still, I'm getting a perspective by reading other people's amusement with the comments here on HN.

[+] Peskier|5 years ago|reply
Anyone that wants to revoke the access this (or any previously used) app had to your spotify account, you can revoke access here: https://www.spotify.com/uk/account/apps/
[+] humanistbot|5 years ago|reply
Yeah, the absolute lack of any privacy statements makes me wary. They get access to my entire music history and personal info, and just say that they won't post anything? Pass.
[+] t0mbstone|5 years ago|reply
As someone who listens to spotify all day while programming, here's my secret to success:

I create a playlist to fit a mood (for example, ambient electronic music with a good beat and no words), and I seed it with at least 10 songs.

Then, I go down to the "Recommended Songs" section and I just play whatever it recommends.

If I don't like a song, I hit the skip button on my keyboard. The vast majority of what it recommends and plays is tolerable but not great.

Every now and then (maybe one out of every 20-30 songs) I will discover a shiny new gem of a song that really resonates with me. So I drag that song up and add it to my slowly growing playlist.

This has the effect of subtly changing the recommendation algorithm for that playlist over time.

Eventually I end up with a playlist with about 100 songs on it, and recommendations that at least roughly align with the mood.

I tend to get bored of songs pretty quickly though, so when a playlist gets too stale, I will prune the old and tired songs from it.

This approach has worked pretty well for me so far, but I really wish that there was a way to explicitly tell Spotify that I "dislike" a song and to never recommend it to me again.

[+] Alupis|5 years ago|reply
I'm dumbfounded people still put up with this mess on Spotify. Pandora's discovery, recommendations, and shuffle algorithms are objectively superior to Spotify - yet, everyone still seems to use Spotify none-the-less.

Discovery, recommendations and shuffle are at the heart of what made Pandora a thing... it's literally what Pandora was built on back when it was purely a seeded radio of sorts. Whereas Spotify more-or-less bolted on these features later in the product life... and it shows.

The "shuffle" alone on Spotify was enough to send me running. Have a playlist with 200 songs from 80 different artists? Well, we'll just play this one artist - the same album even! - back to back to back until you're annoyed enough to manually select the next song!

I understood people flocking to Spotify back when it was the only game in town that allowed you to play specific songs, make playlists, and "download" songs for offline (airplane) playback. But now Pandora does all this too - and has for the past several years. The two services are even priced about the same...

So, if Spotify is so bad, as would seem evidenced by all these HN threads that pop up from time-to-time, why do people continue to use it?

[+] randomstring|5 years ago|reply
Pandora's suggestion algorithm is much better than Spotify's. What you describe is what I used to do with Pandora. I migrated to Spotify several years ago.

Spotify generates some decent genre based playlists based on my listening history. Not as good as Pandora was.

Lately with the pandemic, I've created a super-chill, ambient play list (I started with Moby's Long Ambients and expanded from there) to relax before bedtime. This has been really helpful for unwinding in these stressful times.

However, an unintended consequence is that Spotify now thinks I listen to soothing ambient more than 50% of the time. My year in music is all ambient and my suggested play lists are all wishy-washy now. Apparently there is no "ignore this playlist when tracking usage." You can only manually disable tracking under "Settings > Social" and it times out after every session.

[+] ugh123|5 years ago|reply
My "philosophy" with listening to music while programming has been that if I can tell I like the song, then i'm probably focusing too much on it rather than the task at hand.
[+] jnurmine|5 years ago|reply
I do this too. It works well.

In addition I have several playlists, as a song might suit the current playlist, and another song might fit playlist B instead. So any playlist might be seeding several other playlists at a time.

Sometimes I go through many, many recommendations, listen to a song in short pieces quickly by skipping most of it. It sounds weird but that way I can pretty accurately tell if the song is shit or not (read: if I end up liking it). If the song passes my filter, I put it to some playlist. I just do this quickly and finally go back and listen to the new ones.

As for "dislike", there isn't one per song but there is a "Don't play this" per artist. I sometimes play children's songs or pop as requested, and after some time the recommendations include music I truly never want to hear again in any recommendations (Marcus & Martinus I'm looking at you).

Also, it feels like only the first songs in a playlist actually matter for the recommendations. I don't know if this is really the case. I'd hope the recommendation engine took a random sampling of the entire playlist and recommended based on those.

Edit: there's a "hide" for a track.

[+] smcnally|5 years ago|reply
> I create a playlist to fit a mood (for example, ambient electronic music with a good beat and no words) ... what it recommends and plays is tolerable but not great. ... (maybe one out of every 20-30 songs) I will discover a shiny new gem of a song that really resonates with me.

SoundCloud Weekly[0] recommendations have been solid for months specifically with ambient: ~85% Good tracks with ~30% Resonating enough to Favorite. My other contexts / use cases include listening by Album and Artist, Genre, Mood- and Mind-Setting, and Discovery.

Spotify works well for Albums and Artists. HypeMachine is my go-to for Discovery and Genre. SoundCloud and BandCamp work well for diving into artists and labels discovered. Playlists and Favorites across these are best for Mood- and Mind-Setting, as are "special purpose" options like Brain.fm and Ragya.

[0]https://soundcloud.com/discover/sets/weekly::[username] [1]https://www.ragya.com/

[+] mercer|5 years ago|reply
> Every now and then (maybe one out of every 20-30 songs) I will discover a shiny new gem of a song that really resonates with me. So I drag that song up and add it to my slowly growing playlist.

I take a similar approach, but I've found that the recommendation algorithm is pretty bad, so as an extra step I click on the artist and spend a bit of time listening to their other songs (and add those too, in the hopes it'll affect the algorithm).

> This approach has worked pretty well for me so far, but I really wish that there was a way to explicitly tell Spotify that I "dislike" a song and to never recommend it to me again.

That's one of my main issues with the 'recommended' algorithm. 90% of it is stuff I already have in other playlists, or stuff I keep skipping. I really wish the algorithm did a bit more with all the data it has, but I imagine they optimize for sales (to us or promoting artists/labels) over our actual desires.

[+] lazyant|5 years ago|reply
This is what I do, except using a general playlist. At ~ 300 songs almost all recommendations I didn't like. At current ~ 400 songs all recommendations I don't like and Spotify gave up with a passive-aggressive message sort of "I give up, add more songs if you want better recommendations". (Note that I have a wide variety of styles in the playlist; too lazy to break up in genres and also I kind of like the "surprise" factor)
[+] klmadfejno|5 years ago|reply
The secret to my success to spotify is be a free user with adblock. On desktop browsers, there's no forced shuffle / variance. It just plays the album from start to finish, and, of course, no ads. Pick something manually you like. When you're done, pick a an artist from their list of similar artists. Play entire albums at a time. If you're not immediately dissatisfied, you'll probably feel good about the next half hour of music.
[+] ckosidows|5 years ago|reply
I do the same thing now, but the recommended section leaves a lot to be desired on mobile.

There's no way to prevent songs from getting suggested (other than maybe blocking a song entirely?). My recommendeds don't seem to get updated until the playlist has changed dramatically. And repeat songs get added to the section even if I haven't added it the umpteen times it was suggested prior.

Is the experience different on desktop or am I doing something wrong?

[+] johnwyles|5 years ago|reply
Anyone here remember turntable.fm? I do. Sad. JQBX.fm isn't the same either. That was a great way to get a higher "hit" ratio though.
[+] nijaru|5 years ago|reply
>I really wish that there was a way to explicitly tell Spotify that I "dislike" a song and to never recommend it to me again.

You can at least for radio playlists. You can specifically say to never play this song or artist again. They used to let you thumb up or down on tracks which I think was a much easier UI.

Skipping songs doesn't seem to do enough for songs in your playlists so you have to go through the whole right click -> never play again workflow. I really wish I could just downvote individual songs as they play and tailor it that way since sometimes I'm just tired of a particular song, but maybe I like the song or the artist and don't want to click on 'never hear this again'. It just seems to repeat certain songs way too much based on your listening history.

[+] CoryAlexMartin|5 years ago|reply
My solution to me getting tired of tracks in my work playlist was to keep adding more. It's currently at 2885 songs, or 5.2 days of music. It's mostly video game music, since a lot of video game music is written to not be too distracting.

Though maybe I should say the majority of the playlist consists of songs I've imported into iTunes. Apple does a decent job at letting you seamlessly integrate your personal library with stuff from their streaming catalog.

[+] sli|5 years ago|reply
I mostly use this approach as well but my experience with multiple services is that I eventually (and sooner, rather than later) end up hearing same 100 or so recommended songs. Maybe I'm too picky, but I just don't have great luck with recommendation engines anywhere I go.
[+] everdrive|5 years ago|reply
> here's my secret to success:

> effectively, I manually make my own playlist.

[+] sentinel|5 years ago|reply
I recommend the app Mick Tagger for the drag process. Makes it easier and keeps you in the zone with programming instead of having to fiddle with a song and playlist.
[+] royaltjames|5 years ago|reply
Thank you for saying this. I've been trying to use Spotify for a year now and it leaves so much to be desired on process. You're doing gods work
[+] artursapek|5 years ago|reply
I've had trouble with this. It seems no matter what I play, Spotify just wants to recommend three songs by Pavement on repeat.
[+] amelius|5 years ago|reply
> If I don't like a song, I hit the skip button on my keyboard.

Which button is that?

[+] pgt|5 years ago|reply
Share an electronica playlist and prove it ;).
[+] linux_devil|5 years ago|reply
Do share your playlist , if its public
[+] madamelic|5 years ago|reply
I have to give huge applause for the quality of writing. I genuinely can't tell how expansive the responses are, which is huge for AI.

It definitely has the UX feel of being a bit creepy on how well it responds.

[+] corytheboyd|5 years ago|reply
My friends and I all did it, the punchlines all seem to be the same. I think it feels “creepy” if you attach emotion to songs (I certainly do!) and then listen to them often, but it’s really not all that hard to pick out your top tracks/artists to do that with. Anyway it’s still fun, I liked it
[+] anupamchugh|5 years ago|reply
Exactly, I love the wittiness in writing. But wonder if the AI responds similarly to other users.
[+] guidovranken|5 years ago|reply
It looks like the API is overloaded.

With regards to taste, you usually need to find a suitable gateway into an unpopular genre to begin appreciating it. I always hated jazz until I turned 30, when I heard the melodic jazz of Avishai Cohen [1] and Phronesis [2], which led me to Eric Dolphy [3] and ultimately to free jazz outfits like Alexander von Schlippenbach and Peter Brotzmann. Having grown bored of everything else also helps.

I recently cancelled my paid subscription to Spotify after 10 years and I use Youtube a lot now. The Spotify web app is not great and Youtube recommendations are a lot better in my opinion.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6KYbpDditU

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEw0swsmqYk

[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln8naZpOJ0o

[+] fbelzile|5 years ago|reply
The problem with this service is that most times, I don't chose what I listen to. Spotify does.

I play music all day while working and I'd love to listen to more artists but most times, I'm stuck in the routine between my Release Radar on Fridays, Discovery Weekly on Monday, and Daily Mixes during the rest of the week. I add songs I like to a variety of personal playlists and sometimes I start a "Song Radio" for a song I like. But even then, I just end up getting the same songs Spotify seems to think I liked only because they've already played them to me over and over. Part of me wonders if their algorithm favours songs that costs them less in royalties...

Playlists made by real people seem way better than any Spotify playlist, but they are difficult to discover. I'd love a feature that recommends me playlists from people that share my music tastes. One example, is a playlist called "Sexy Bath" by Nicoleta Tataru.

[+] tossthere|5 years ago|reply
Funny, but I was hoping this might provide some insight into why my Spotify is so bad, even by my own tastes.

Spotify constantly queues and recommends songs to me that are so bad, I can’t even imagine how there could possibly exist any data indicating that any significant sample of listeners has ever enjoyed hearing them. Spotify has 5+ years of my listening history, and orders of magnitude more data from listeners all over the world, and yet every time I set it to recommend anything to me I just sit there pressing “skip” repeatedly until I give up.

I always blamed myself, thought I was just becoming old and curmudgeonly in my 30s. But yesterday I finally discovered the problem isn’t with me. I switched to Apple Music, and it queued up 50 songs I’d never heard, and I enjoyed almost all of them.

I can use my HomePod now, too. I’m really loving Apple Music so far, highly recommend it to anyone who thinks their Spotify account is permanently broken like mine was.

[+] cgriswald|5 years ago|reply
I see a lot of comments here (and some in the YouTube recommendation thread currently on the front page) suggesting sometimes a Rube Goldberg-esque series of behaviors to trick the algorithm into performing properly. I see this mentioned as "easy" and "trivial". I consider it "abrasive" and "tedious." The algorithms should work through normal use of the app. I shouldn't have to tell an app "Ignore this one-off piece of content I reached through an external link that is different from all the other content I've enjoyed and especially different than what I've searched." If I get to the point where I have to curate at that level of detail, what's the point?

It's less work to do what I've been doing all along: get recommendations from friends, family, articles, collabs, biographies, etc. (And it's a lot more fun.)

[+] dbrgn|5 years ago|reply
I'm a bit wary of logging in. Does Spotify provide OAuth with fine-grained control, i.e. will the page only get access to the music history or could it in theory change playlists and billing information?
[+] as-j|5 years ago|reply
Yes. When you click auth you can see the permissive it asks for. Which is profile and history.
[+] xav_authentique|5 years ago|reply
It looks like they request these permissions: user-top-read, playlist-read-private, playlist-read-collaborative and they also gets your your name, username and profile picture.
[+] frakt0x90|5 years ago|reply
I see a lot of comments about how bad spotify recommendations are. I have had great experience but I follow a methodology to keep the recommendations curated. I'll also note that I listen to a wide variety of music ranging from EDM to metal to high enery jpop to classical. What I have found is:

- Adding things to playlists makes a big difference. If you really love a song, hit it with a heart, if you want to hear more but don't love it, add it to a relevant playlist

- skip mildly bad songs

- actively dislike terrible songs (hide it on mobile, hit the no smoking sign on desktop)

I got into a chill beats phase and it took a couple months for me to eradicate it from my discover weekly but now it's pretty on point. Just my 2 cents.

[+] MikeWazowski|5 years ago|reply
> Spotify limiting how many people can use this app at once, so you'll need to wait or try again later.

Patiently anticipating how bad my taste is

[+] thankfullyfired|5 years ago|reply
A lot of people in this thread have no sense of humor and need to seriously lighten up.
[+] pmlnr|5 years ago|reply
> You are 0% basic. Oh wow Menschdefekt and Culture Kultur! Your taste is so obscure that's so cool I bet you're super interesting..

(In Bender's voice) You think you're all high and mighty, just because you're an AI? Well, I guessed so.

EDIT On a real note, how do you feel about doing the same for my last.fm that has data since 2007?

[+] hans1729|5 years ago|reply
Love how polarizing this is on HN. Half the comments are afraid of their precious data being leeched, other half is divided into "eww" and "this is amazing" :-)

I'm stuck in "Loading your music library...Spotify limiting how many people can use this app at once [...] I'll try again in n seconds" limbo :(

[+] bartread|5 years ago|reply
Appears to be dead (likely hugged). Getting an application error from Heroku.
[+] pbronez|5 years ago|reply
So fun! My score plummeted when I answered the interactive questions.

Hit a bug where it asked me “do you recognize this song?” And tried to play some audio, but nothing actually played. (Safari on iOS; could have been caused by an ad blocker)

[+] m000|5 years ago|reply
> You are 6% basic. Acrimonious and Inherit Disease? Where do you even find this shit?.

Yup. That's me.

[+] martin_a|5 years ago|reply
This obviously isn't a real AI.

My results and text pieces are pretty much the same as everyone else's here in the comments.

It just fetches some playlists, fills the blanks in its text pieces and that's it.

[+] Strom|5 years ago|reply
Sounds like any other AI. Surely you weren't expecting some sort of scientific breakthrough with this gag site?
[+] mhh__|5 years ago|reply
> Oh wow Taim and Viper! Your taste is so obscure that's so cool I bet you're super interesting..

It's vaguely sentient.

It has some really bizarre opinions about certain songs - Guthrie Govan is basically a god amongst men for guitar players but it absolutely hates his work.

A final note: I assume this is a joke, but please don't try to objectively rank music.