[lfam]

It's possible to maintain software quality (or quality of any endeavour) without being rude or making people feel bad.

On the other hand, there doesn't seem to be any correlation between rude behaviour and high levels of technical quality, nor is there any plausible explanation for such a correlation.

My hunch is that any successful project with a rude atmosphere succeeds in spite of the rudeness.

[zozbot234]

See the Rust project (the programming language, not the game) for one example of a community which manages to retain a huge focus on software quality while staying professional and inclusive, and not being rude to outsiders. We might even see a development where people will choose to "rewrite their software in Rust" purely as a ploy to attract nice and professional contributors!

[centimeter]

Rust is extremely exclusionary (to non-progressives). The "niceness" is mostly a facade - a lot of the people in the Rust community are extremely passive-aggressive and back-stabby. OTOH, I've contributed to a lot of "rude" projects where they'll treat you with respect and won't try to pull weird bullshit if you actually come in to make a contribution rather than to do political activism or something.

Even if you've never had to interact with them, it's easy to see that social signaling is more important to the rust community than doing good work. Last time I was in the Rust discord, their channel logo was literally the rust logo over a the gay flag with lines for black and brown people added. Wtf?

I've submitted probably >100kloc to various open source projects over my career, and the weird politicking and immature behavior of the Rust community soured me on contributing to the Rust ecosystem almost immediately.

[rectang]

Software is a second career for me, and the pervasive hostility of the tech industry has never stopped shocking me. I dream of communities where differences are celebrated, enhancing creative ferment; the tech industry as a whole won't be that way within the foreseeable future, but there can be pockets where tolerance and constructive interaction are norms.

The Rust community is one of them. Regardless of whether it is successful as a recruitment tool, regardless of the effect on productivity, building a kind community is worthwhile just for the sake of its members.

Because life is short, and every hour that we spend enjoying ourselves rather than enveloped by hostility is a treasure.

[dalbasal]

Reminds me of the "steve jobs effect" at certain points. CEOs and execs purposely being arseholes because greatness. Newton was a bastard. Steve was an ass. Prince was unbearable. If I act like a bastard...

[mastrsushi]

You're really going to group Prince with Newton and Jobs though? lol

[bfgh]

What you describe is very possible with a group of like minded developers; I think everyone, including those who are perceived as rude on the Internet, prefers that atmosphere.

In practice, however, many open source projects have socially dominant developers who incessantly rewrite everything and introduce bugs until some introvert correctness advocate explodes.

There is no way of dealing nicely with passive aggressive socially dominant people. They just continue their game until someone calls them out directly.

These days, of course, the introvert is canceled and they can carry on.