Cesare Emiliani and Kurzegesagt make the case that we think of world civilization as much newer than it is, because our year count is now only to 2021. They argue for instead bumping our year by 10,000 to more truly reflect the age of our civilization, to 12,021, and (arbitrarily) commemorating Göbleki Tepe as its foundation
There are beautiful ruins all throughout Turkey, completely out in the open. You can walk through a park and find yourself stepping over ancient mosaics and columns, the kinds you'd find behind velvet ropes and glass partitions in Italy or Greece.
One of my dreams is to walk the Lycean Way [0] where I’ve read that the remote trails have you camping among ruins. It seems amazing that there’s still so many ancient ruins just laying about and accessible to humans.
Termessos is one. An ancient Greek city up a mountain. Imagine an amphitheatre with a view in every direction. The burial site is open for you to climb around and over. It's near Antalya. Check it out: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Termessos
I follow the work of Graham Hancock quite closely but how did the artwork appear to you? The need for the specialized tools to bore the holes or mae those 3d outward busts on stone are incredibly advanced and the accuracy of these depictions of animals and peoples seen on stone predates what most archaeologists place Agriculture at ~10,000 years ago, which coincidentally is also in this part of Turkey. Most tools from nomadic people before the advent of Agriculture were likely for hunting, and cutting meat or building fires and clothes, not precision based specialized tools so this site opens the door to the notion that very specialized tools being used prior to this period for ornamental or sacred purposes in Human History was already common practice.
Personally speaking, after having done agriculture myself, I think agriculture its closer to 20-30,000 years old and sites like this and the one in Indonesia re-enforce my hypothesis as you cannot make these monoliths without several generations of a very well refined work force that requires specialization and surpluses of food and water only possible due to a systematic application of horticulture and domestication of livestock.
What were your biggest takeaways, and how much would you say is still left to unearth?
It is my understanding most of it is still underground and other sites have yet to be even approved or greenlit for excavation due to political and warfare issues, was that still the case when you were there?
You have not noticed yet that a good fraction of posts on HN are just things someone saw in another HN or Reddit discussion, that they then reposted as a separate submission?
Graham Hancock is brilliant at muddying the waters (saying this as someone who used to read everything he put out - i was enthralled at the mystery of an ancient civilisation that gave birth to all the rest, but nothing over the last 30 years has been substantiated and he loves working the underdog/anti-consensus angle so in my opinion that’s his entire bent, he revels in casting aspersions on well established archeological convention) so I’m not too sure about that, this post suggests it’s still being excavated [0]
Interestingly, there have been some recent excavations that suggest there are some sites that may be even older [1]
I have no connection to this, but if I was in charge of a site like Gobekli Tepe I would absolutely shut down all work until I was absolutely sure that the people who were going to work on it were a) funded out of the kazzzoo, b) the best people in the world to do it, c) using methods that would not do damage and stop subsequent generations from squeezing more knoweldge than I could imagine from the site. I would want to know exactly what was being looked for and why before I allowed the smallest trowel to scoop the smallest bit of earth off it.
Why? Because if in three years someone popped up and told me that there were a slew of important questions that were now off the agenda because I permitted a world heritage site to be trashed I'd be quite upset frankly.
[+] [-] proce55ing|5 years ago|reply
https://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674019997
[+] [-] mkl|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rendall|5 years ago|reply
https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1029/94EO...
https://youtu.be/czgOWmtGVGs (2016 or 12016)
[+] [-] gk1|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] prepend|5 years ago|reply
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycian_Way
[+] [-] jpcooper|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] starik36|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bwanab|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pieteradejong|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] phreeza|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] m00dy|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Melting_Harps|5 years ago|reply
I follow the work of Graham Hancock quite closely but how did the artwork appear to you? The need for the specialized tools to bore the holes or mae those 3d outward busts on stone are incredibly advanced and the accuracy of these depictions of animals and peoples seen on stone predates what most archaeologists place Agriculture at ~10,000 years ago, which coincidentally is also in this part of Turkey. Most tools from nomadic people before the advent of Agriculture were likely for hunting, and cutting meat or building fires and clothes, not precision based specialized tools so this site opens the door to the notion that very specialized tools being used prior to this period for ornamental or sacred purposes in Human History was already common practice.
Personally speaking, after having done agriculture myself, I think agriculture its closer to 20-30,000 years old and sites like this and the one in Indonesia re-enforce my hypothesis as you cannot make these monoliths without several generations of a very well refined work force that requires specialization and surpluses of food and water only possible due to a systematic application of horticulture and domestication of livestock.
What were your biggest takeaways, and how much would you say is still left to unearth?
It is my understanding most of it is still underground and other sites have yet to be even approved or greenlit for excavation due to political and warfare issues, was that still the case when you were there?
[+] [-] naringas|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] fireattack|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] user-the-name|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] JeanMeche|5 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nelsonmandela|5 years ago|reply
Edit: This is a claim by Graham Hancock which I was just reminded of
[+] [-] robbiep|5 years ago|reply
Interestingly, there have been some recent excavations that suggest there are some sites that may be even older [1]
[0] https://www.thetravel.com/gobekli-tepe-still-being-excavated... [1] https://www.aa.com.tr/en/culture/ancient-site-older-than-gob...
[+] [-] sgt101|5 years ago|reply
I have no connection to this, but if I was in charge of a site like Gobekli Tepe I would absolutely shut down all work until I was absolutely sure that the people who were going to work on it were a) funded out of the kazzzoo, b) the best people in the world to do it, c) using methods that would not do damage and stop subsequent generations from squeezing more knoweldge than I could imagine from the site. I would want to know exactly what was being looked for and why before I allowed the smallest trowel to scoop the smallest bit of earth off it.
Why? Because if in three years someone popped up and told me that there were a slew of important questions that were now off the agenda because I permitted a world heritage site to be trashed I'd be quite upset frankly.
[+] [-] momo93|5 years ago|reply