The price has been a solid $0.00 for over six years. 100% worthless
Then a few days ago it suddenly jumps to $0.0013
Sounds like the SEC have found a bunch of social media accounts in the early stage of doing a classic Pump & Dump on worthless penny stocks. Nothing at all to do with WSB
I am a mod on r/WallStreetBets and wanted to share with you that our bots haven't seen any of the tickers mentioned in the SEC press release.
We filter tickers based on a number of factors, but low market cap (below $1B), is the most common reason for content being removed.
One of our biggest issues is data reliability. If you know of an API that can provide accurate data and an exhaustive list of tickers (especially on non-US exchanges), please reach out to our modmail. [0]
Can someone explain to me why this dedicated but unpaid volunteer is trying to keep Reddit compliant with SEC regulations? What other company on the planet would shift that burden to its own users???
Happy to discover I’m not understanding the situation, but that seems absolutely bonkers to me. Does Reddit not have any lawyers?
I'm actually writing an app that extracts company names or stock symbols from reddit posts. I'm using iexcloud.io to get a list of companies and their symbols. I haven't got the part of also adding financial information for those companies/stocks, but I'm sure it's not complicated.
I'm only fetching US and Canadian stocks from iexcloud and I've got around 24k of those. It's possible to fetch stocks from other countries but it seems most companies mentioned on Reddit are listed in a US exchange anyway.
People could also agree on a language to use in Reddit that uses a ticker to get through the approval system (e.g. AAPL) but then in the content of the message, indicate the ticker actually being discussed by look at the first letter of each of the first few words of the post.
For example
Subject: AAPL is awesome
Message: Generalizing My Equations in a very interesting way ...
When the mods catch on this and write bots to deal with it, we invent a new language. It's faster to invent codes than for mods to write bots so they can never keep up.
Hiya mate, nice of you to pop on by here. I'm a passable Redditor but I only sport concrete hands (ex Civ Eng nerd), certainly not diamond, but I will never despoil myself with paper hands!
What is the next step in cases like these? Let's say social media activity led someone to making an unwise trade. Suspending trading doesn't fix the problem for that person, now they're just stuck in a bad position. Does the SEC ever "fix it" for that person, or is it all damage control now to reduce the extent of the problem, and those that are already in are kind of screwed?
The SEC can order trades to be reversed but the broker is then on the hook to make good on any shortfalls. Long ago I had a federal judge appoint me as the CEO of a small-cap company whose prior CEO (who I then gathered evidence on to send him to federal prison) had improperly created and sold significantly more shares than they were reporting. I asked for all shares sold and not reported to be reversed. The SEC declined. The system as we have (well, had, as I hope it's changed some) makes this not very hard to do. In fact, I found out some years later that one of the SEC attorneys I'd worked with went private and then aided a different small cap to pull the same scam. He got some quality Club Fed time out of the deal.
If it's an unwise but innocent lead - like your friend who is dumb telling you what stocks to buy - then nothing because nothing criminal has happened.
If it's illegal, say a company or investor in that company created a bunch of social media bots to convince others to buy into the companies stock - then they'll get to hire a lawyer and go to court, get fined, etc.
Algorithmic amplification of content is half baked. Outcomes will be random.
Algo amplification of content needs a timeout and a redesign.
Just look at HN. No one knows what will show up tomorrow morning. No one knows whether it will waste their time or be useful. Yet everyone shows up to consume the stream. And Like the SEC the mods have to react and counter react to what ever the hell happens.
If a simple HN algo amplification model has no roadmap to improvement cause no one really knows what to do about it, then to expect a roadmap to emerge in much more complex environments like Reddit, YouTube, Twitter, FB etc is delusional.
Therefore to prevent the constant periodic randomness injection into society that algo amplification of content produces, all algo amplification of all type of content should be put on hold.
Someone losing money on an unwise trade is more of a rhetorical instrument than an actual rationale. I don't think the SEC ever "fixes" it for an individual, but their investigations can open the door to fraud litigation (often class action) of some sort.
The SEC and the regulatory complex as a whole is more generally concerned with market integrity.
Statements like "social media attempts to artificially inflate their stock price" sound quite solid but is actually a nightmare to define directly. But, working definitions and action-inducers are usually related to market integrity issues.
The main goal isn't to undue harm done, it's to prevent further harm. Halting trading both draws attention to the fact that there's an anomaly, and gives everyone time to research what is really going on. Getting compensation for the harm done is done through the courts.
Honest question: How often does the SEC do something like this? More specifically: How often does volatility caused by hedge funds result in suspended trading of certain stocks?
Also check the previous years, they appear to be archived static pages as opposed to say a database query populating a template - really makes me wonder how this site is built.
To clarify, the issue here isn't just volatility. The companies in question haven't made any SEC filings in over a year, which generally means they're not really doing business anymore and certainly means it's hard to imagine a value-based case for trading them. The SEC often suspends trading after a few years of no filings (random example from 2020: https://www.sec.gov/litigation/suspensions/2020/34-89717-o.p...), and it's reasonable that a pumping scheme might push them to act faster.
I think you are onto something. The most privileged class of "person" in the united states is corporations that get slaps on the wrist for breaking laws.
Now I understand why Dr evil from Austin powers ran a corporation.
I’m confused at the end goal here. Is this for “protection” or for “fraud” concerns? Stock manipulation isn’t legal, but banding together to pump and dump and things like that... if they’re not part of the company where insider trading or anything could be a reason, how is that really anything that should be regulated? Sounds like free market to me.
This just seems like worries that the villagers are figuring out ways to band together and the rulers are scared.
I disagree with classism take on GME and other meme stocks. If anything else, it’s the opposite. The common person is being manipulated and the hedge funds and major personalities on these social media are raking in.
It’s the biggest misconception of this entire meme stock phenomenon.
If you look at the list of stocks you can all see they are super super tiny companies so likely it is fraud schemes aka pump and dump. That's when a small group of people (typically) organize an effort to pump a stock using false information. Since these stocks are so small, even getting a few amount of small investors to buy in could result in significant profits for the fraudsters. Doing a pump and dump on a stock like GME would be extremely difficult to pull off.
The end goal here is to stop suspected illegal pump & dump activity.
The definition of "pump & dump" is to make false or misleading statements in order to get the price to go up, so that you can sell. It is not free market activity; it is fraud.
> if they’re not part of the company where insider trading or anything could be a reason, how is that really anything that should be regulated? Sounds like free market to me.
The “pump” is the action of fraudulently inducing someone to buy the security which is against the law.
Still, the consequence may be that the social media activity moves to venues that the SEC can't observe as easily.
In that case... good! The whole point of a pump & dump is that you get other people to bump the price for you, then you sell, and leave everyone else holding the bag. If they can't do it on social media, then they can't do it at all. It's not like selling drugs where people are going to move to some kind of black market for stock tips. It's just not going to be out there, so people won't fall for it because it won't exist anymore. Mission accomplished in my opinion.
Unless you plan to run a pump & dump scheme through Twitter/Facebook DMs?
Unfortunately they’ll never keep up with the ‘demand’ for market manipulation unless they fix the ‘supply’ of scared people that have no stable store of value. What you’re witnessing, is a vote of no confidence in monetary policy, and a scared populace, unfortunate breeding grounds for small time scammers as in these stonks. I’m sure there’s more; people don’t know anything about what they’re investing in. That includes top investors and analysts. It’s all pump and dump, just more elaborate as it gets bigger.
I don’t know what the fed’s objective is anymore (actually ever), but a successful nation is one in which people are not concerned with finances at all, except that they put their minds and hands to socially-positive activity. Now our savings account is an endless gamble on stocks. Might as well be sports betting; that’s at least a lot more transparent.
I don’t want to put 10 seconds a year into thoughts about finances, taxes, housing costs, inflation, deflation, interest rates, stocks, bonds, Bitcoin, or whatever. But their policies are forcing me and so many other people to put our whole lives into it. It’s probably 80% of the economy right now, totally wasted on a few people’s failed theories about macroeconomics, the same people over and over again, covering for their mistakes with new failing theories and policies. Unfortunately we can’t just write it down mathematically, program it into a computer, release source, and be done with it. No; it’s based on their personal feelings at any given moment. Oh and by the way, it all just so happens to make them and their families and friends and business and religious associates impossibly wealthy. Must be because they “understand” more than we do. Sure.
I wonder if they ever think, “hey, maybe if we want less financial manipulation, we should stop doing it ourselves.” (Not the SEC; they just react.)
You should not be an investor. You should save until you have everything you’ll ever need, and then invest in things you know about, and only because the money is going toward something productive and socially-valuable, as in the society that you, individually, want to live in. This is the most powerful form of voting. Index funds don’t solve the problem. That’s just paying someone else to steal your vote.
There's also that rubbish app (forgot its name) for parent control in phones is not in the list. Only 1 employee (founder) and in daylight using twitter to cash out, manipulate the price, issue more shares, etc..
What's next? Allowing only profitable trades? This is a worrying trend when SEC thinks they know better and usurp the right to tell people what to do with their own money. They should look at banning sales of borrowed shares, but that would upset their rich mates?
Sure. Try it with something worth more than zero and see if you can grab a significant position in order to make the scam worthwhile. Consider what the margins to make a killing on a pump and dump look like on a stock that sells for $100/ share.
Yes, ok, different agencies, different laws, different domains, different impact, but same brave new world and the divergent responses seemed moderately interesting.
kristopolous|5 years ago
Bebida Beverage Co. (BBDA);
Blue Sphere Corporation (BLSP);
Ehouse Global Inc. (EHOS);
Eventure Interactive Inc. (EVTI);
Eyes on the Go Inc. (AXCG);
Green Energy Enterprises Inc. (GYOG);
Helix Wind Corp. (HLXW);
International Power Group Ltd. (IPWG);
Marani Brands Inc. (MRIB);
MediaTechnics Corp. (MEDT);
Net Talk.com Inc. (NTLK);
Patten Energy Solutions Group Inc. (PTTN);
PTA Holdings Inc. (PTAH);
Universal Apparel & Textile Company (DKGR);
Wisdom Homes of America Inc. (WOFA).
The SEC also recently issued orders temporarily suspending trading in:
Bangi Inc. (BNGI);
Sylios Corp. (UNGS);
Marathon Group Corp. (PDPR);
Affinity Beverage Group Inc. (ABVG);
All Grade Mining Inc. (HYII);
SpectraScience Inc. (SCIE).
phire|5 years ago
The price has been a solid $0.00 for over six years. 100% worthless
Then a few days ago it suddenly jumps to $0.0013
Sounds like the SEC have found a bunch of social media accounts in the early stage of doing a classic Pump & Dump on worthless penny stocks. Nothing at all to do with WSB
dj_mc_merlin|5 years ago
kaminar|5 years ago
xyst|5 years ago
very easy to do a "pump and dump" scheme especially in the digital or social media age
vmception|5 years ago
oip|5 years ago
I am a mod on r/WallStreetBets and wanted to share with you that our bots haven't seen any of the tickers mentioned in the SEC press release.
We filter tickers based on a number of factors, but low market cap (below $1B), is the most common reason for content being removed.
One of our biggest issues is data reliability. If you know of an API that can provide accurate data and an exhaustive list of tickers (especially on non-US exchanges), please reach out to our modmail. [0]
Best,
OIP
[0] https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fwallstreetb...
TameAntelope|5 years ago
Happy to discover I’m not understanding the situation, but that seems absolutely bonkers to me. Does Reddit not have any lawyers?
jordinl|5 years ago
I'm only fetching US and Canadian stocks from iexcloud and I've got around 24k of those. It's possible to fetch stocks from other countries but it seems most companies mentioned on Reddit are listed in a US exchange anyway.
scoopertrooper|5 years ago
[deleted]
dheera|5 years ago
For example
Subject: AAPL is awesome
Message: Generalizing My Equations in a very interesting way ...
When the mods catch on this and write bots to deal with it, we invent a new language. It's faster to invent codes than for mods to write bots so they can never keep up.
gerdesj|5 years ago
jrockway|5 years ago
thrill|5 years ago
vorpalhex|5 years ago
If it's illegal, say a company or investor in that company created a bunch of social media bots to convince others to buy into the companies stock - then they'll get to hire a lawyer and go to court, get fined, etc.
op03|5 years ago
Algo amplification of content needs a timeout and a redesign.
Just look at HN. No one knows what will show up tomorrow morning. No one knows whether it will waste their time or be useful. Yet everyone shows up to consume the stream. And Like the SEC the mods have to react and counter react to what ever the hell happens.
If a simple HN algo amplification model has no roadmap to improvement cause no one really knows what to do about it, then to expect a roadmap to emerge in much more complex environments like Reddit, YouTube, Twitter, FB etc is delusional.
Therefore to prevent the constant periodic randomness injection into society that algo amplification of content produces, all algo amplification of all type of content should be put on hold.
dalbasal|5 years ago
The SEC and the regulatory complex as a whole is more generally concerned with market integrity.
Statements like "social media attempts to artificially inflate their stock price" sound quite solid but is actually a nightmare to define directly. But, working definitions and action-inducers are usually related to market integrity issues.
gmiller123456|5 years ago
mrtksn|5 years ago
After that you should be able to buy a lootbox of stocks and receive fragments of penny stocks for watching videos.
Do we really need the extra steps?
joshstrange|5 years ago
kristopolous|5 years ago
Also check the previous years, they appear to be archived static pages as opposed to say a database query populating a template - really makes me wonder how this site is built.
SpicyLemonZest|5 years ago
ldbooth|5 years ago
pylua|5 years ago
Now I understand why Dr evil from Austin powers ran a corporation.
mike503|5 years ago
This just seems like worries that the villagers are figuring out ways to band together and the rulers are scared.
systemvoltage|5 years ago
It’s the biggest misconception of this entire meme stock phenomenon.
HNfriend234|5 years ago
nerdponx|5 years ago
The definition of "pump & dump" is to make false or misleading statements in order to get the price to go up, so that you can sell. It is not free market activity; it is fraud.
elliekelly|5 years ago
The “pump” is the action of fraudulently inducing someone to buy the security which is against the law.
morelisp|5 years ago
computronus|5 years ago
Still, the consequence may be that the social media activity moves to venues that the SEC can't observe as easily.
nerdponx|5 years ago
In that case... good! The whole point of a pump & dump is that you get other people to bump the price for you, then you sell, and leave everyone else holding the bag. If they can't do it on social media, then they can't do it at all. It's not like selling drugs where people are going to move to some kind of black market for stock tips. It's just not going to be out there, so people won't fall for it because it won't exist anymore. Mission accomplished in my opinion.
Unless you plan to run a pump & dump scheme through Twitter/Facebook DMs?
unknown|5 years ago
[deleted]
jl2718|5 years ago
I don’t know what the fed’s objective is anymore (actually ever), but a successful nation is one in which people are not concerned with finances at all, except that they put their minds and hands to socially-positive activity. Now our savings account is an endless gamble on stocks. Might as well be sports betting; that’s at least a lot more transparent.
I don’t want to put 10 seconds a year into thoughts about finances, taxes, housing costs, inflation, deflation, interest rates, stocks, bonds, Bitcoin, or whatever. But their policies are forcing me and so many other people to put our whole lives into it. It’s probably 80% of the economy right now, totally wasted on a few people’s failed theories about macroeconomics, the same people over and over again, covering for their mistakes with new failing theories and policies. Unfortunately we can’t just write it down mathematically, program it into a computer, release source, and be done with it. No; it’s based on their personal feelings at any given moment. Oh and by the way, it all just so happens to make them and their families and friends and business and religious associates impossibly wealthy. Must be because they “understand” more than we do. Sure.
I wonder if they ever think, “hey, maybe if we want less financial manipulation, we should stop doing it ourselves.” (Not the SEC; they just react.)
You should not be an investor. You should save until you have everything you’ll ever need, and then invest in things you know about, and only because the money is going toward something productive and socially-valuable, as in the society that you, individually, want to live in. This is the most powerful form of voting. Index funds don’t solve the problem. That’s just paying someone else to steal your vote.
gorgoiler|5 years ago
If you denounce the stock at the same time as you sell it, you are also fine.
If you promote-and-sell* or denounce-and-buy, the SEC will be contacting you for assistance in their ongoing investigation.
*pump-and-dump
abarrak|5 years ago
abarrak|5 years ago
intricatedetail|5 years ago
ketanmaheshwari|5 years ago
edoceo|5 years ago
modeless|5 years ago
runawaybottle|5 years ago
I’m long AMC sub $10 :p
mtnGoat|5 years ago
Every investor Should be aware of the risk that they could lose everything and that markets, whether we like it or not, are manipulateable.
Let them run wild.
airhead969|5 years ago
tclancy|5 years ago
Every generation thinks they invented scams.
liquidify|5 years ago
chovybizzass|5 years ago
Ecstatify|5 years ago
dang|5 years ago
Proven|5 years ago
[deleted]
williesleg|5 years ago
[deleted]
hikerclimber|5 years ago
[deleted]
ffhhj|5 years ago
[deleted]
blobbers|5 years ago
[deleted]
paulie_a|5 years ago
techbio|5 years ago
"FEC suspends [nothing] due to questionable social media activity"
techbio|5 years ago
somerandomboi|5 years ago
Simulacra|5 years ago
phone8675309|5 years ago
nojito|5 years ago
emteycz|5 years ago