I hear, anecdotally(n<10) that things are very bad at analyst/associate levels at BB banks right now. They send surveys around about how much people are working(what they are actually writing down and reporting, though hours aren't actually billed anymore) and people are averaging 90-95 with >100 spike bad weeks.
What I hear is that revenue is at record levels, deal flow is so high they can't keep things staffed and are pulling in junior bankers from lower tier shops. Bonuses were reportedly bad(in spite of record revenue) because of the 'optics of bankers getting big bonuses during covid' which sort of breaks the bargain of working 90-100 hours a week.
I'm shocked at the attrition I've heard of. For being such a high barrier to entry club(MBA, lots of 'networking', a hazing summer analyst/associateism, etc) people are bailing in crazy numbers. I am aware of a group(an incredibly high performing group, tons of deals, tons of S-1s that hit HN this year) where 80% of 2nd year associates have already left(since the cohort started).
Everyone knows that "bankers work a lot" but even among a friend group of MBB consultants, medical residents, buy side folks, etc -- the bankers have it the worst, and the comp is not really better unless you stick it out a long time.
Are they actually doing quality work in that time? What would happen if they just plain stopped after, say, 60 hours? Would the banks actually lose money?
I suppose they'll always find a new batch of people willing to imagine that they're getting a taste of billion-dollar deals and retire early. People undergo hazing because there are lots of people who want to be in the club. You may not be able to profit off the numbers, but you can at least have a perverse fun, if that's your thing.
But somehow, I'd have thought that a bank with "Come work 45 hour weeks with us for the same amount of money" would attract smart people and use their brain power to make more money.
What I don't get is if they need 80 man hours of work per worker unit at current staffing levels why don't they just employ more workers? Seems more like culture and hazing than actual productivity. And no, I don't believe that banking is so complicated that supply of qualified labour is the limiting factor.
That said what is it that these entry level bankers actually do for 100 hours a week?
They are also earning 300k for first year analyst (it goes up more every year). 100 hours is pretty normal for what they are getting paid. Sustainable? Not for many but still a lot more of money for a 21 year old at the end of the day.
Not that I would ever want to do it, but I alway wonder how the outcomes would be if engineering teams worked as hard as IB/HF folks. I've produced some of my best code on the weeks where I manage to code 70+ hours, but its very unsustainable.
The obvious answer is that it wouldn't work, but some of these organizations with long hours are some of the best performing organizations, so there is definitely more to the story.
waterfowl|5 years ago
What I hear is that revenue is at record levels, deal flow is so high they can't keep things staffed and are pulling in junior bankers from lower tier shops. Bonuses were reportedly bad(in spite of record revenue) because of the 'optics of bankers getting big bonuses during covid' which sort of breaks the bargain of working 90-100 hours a week.
I'm shocked at the attrition I've heard of. For being such a high barrier to entry club(MBA, lots of 'networking', a hazing summer analyst/associateism, etc) people are bailing in crazy numbers. I am aware of a group(an incredibly high performing group, tons of deals, tons of S-1s that hit HN this year) where 80% of 2nd year associates have already left(since the cohort started).
Everyone knows that "bankers work a lot" but even among a friend group of MBB consultants, medical residents, buy side folks, etc -- the bankers have it the worst, and the comp is not really better unless you stick it out a long time.
jfengel|5 years ago
I suppose they'll always find a new batch of people willing to imagine that they're getting a taste of billion-dollar deals and retire early. People undergo hazing because there are lots of people who want to be in the club. You may not be able to profit off the numbers, but you can at least have a perverse fun, if that's your thing.
But somehow, I'd have thought that a bank with "Come work 45 hour weeks with us for the same amount of money" would attract smart people and use their brain power to make more money.
morpheos137|5 years ago
That said what is it that these entry level bankers actually do for 100 hours a week?
tidepod12|5 years ago
Some very serious survey results in there. It's apparently a very small sample size (13 first years), but life sounds like absolute hell for those 13.
nowherebeen|5 years ago
parhamn|5 years ago
The obvious answer is that it wouldn't work, but some of these organizations with long hours are some of the best performing organizations, so there is definitely more to the story.
qazxcvbnmlp|5 years ago
cwwc|5 years ago
Here’s the original post/actual deck.