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timothycrosley | 4 years ago

While we are sharing meaningless anecdotes, almost everyone I know (since I live in Seattle) has been vaccinated. No one has reported any issues, a couple have since successfully had a child. None have even gotten a breakthrough infection of covid. Among friends I know from back east, who haven't gotten vaccinated, one had just turned 30, only health issue was obesity. He died. One was 35, best shape of any of my friends, was in ICU for 7 days with double pneumonia. And one miscarriage.

But hey, the good thing is, we also have data. And the data, shows no correlation between vaccination and these problems you're referring to, and yet a VERY HIGH correlation (and some good reasons to say causation) between getting covid and having these issues.

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justsee|4 years ago

It's not as settled as you seem to think.

Leading vaccine developer Nikolai Petrovsky (who's working on a traditional, protein-based vaccine) recently mentioned in an interview that if he had a pregnant wife he'd advise her to avoid both the virus and the vaccine (something only the privileged could attempt, so not a one-size-fits-all recommendation) [1]

(In a more technical interview aimed at a scientific audience, he outlines a number of issues he has with the current options. [2])

One of Petrovsky's key issues is that on pregnancy and children, the sensitivity is so high and risks so great that there is usually a much, much higher bar before vaccines are authorised for use: that's been the history of traditional, protein-based vaccines where it can take decades before they're authorised for use in pregnant women, babies, children.

Pfizer only began their pregnancy and safety trials in February this year - so only a little over 7 months ago. It is designed to observe pregnancy through to newborns reaching 6 months of age, and will complete in a year.

So we currently have no safety data in pregnancies from pre-conception via all-important and sensitive first trimester, through to full term + 6 months.

Keep in mind the WHO changed position on safety and aligned with the CDC on recommending the vaccine 3 weeks before Pfizer even started its safety trials.

None of this is to say that getting Covid isn't currently provably worse than getting a current vaccine.

It's just to say the safety data is incomplete, there are still unknowns which could change the calculation significantly considering the nature of the technology used, and we just won't fully understand the issues for some time to come.

(Also keep in mind that with mandates, the proposal is for all to receive the current options, but the alternative is not for all pregnant women to become infected. The risk calculation generally assumes wrongly here.)

[1] https://www.doctorlewis.com.au/podcast-1/2021/7/19/episode-2...

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL_2Rq1zoRg&t=3063s

timothycrosley|4 years ago

I personally think avoiding getting infected ever, just is so impractical as to not lay out as an option. As evidence more and more is showing both infected and vaccinated people are likely to spread the infection (even if they don't get symptoms) as soon as 3 months after the acquired "immunity". Combined with how infectious delta is, this third choice of never getting infected just feels disingenuous.

iratewizard|4 years ago

What's the hospitalization rate for 20s - 40s for getting the vaccine? What's the hospitalization rate for covid?

pyronik19|4 years ago

Do we even know the real number? VAERS is highly underreported and how many vaccine cases are just getting labeled as "covid cases"... I love the southpark skit about this "covid related"... worth a watch.