Yet another example of how Barcelona feels societally futuristic in some ways. For a couple more - they were way ahead of the curve (at least from an American perceptive) on superblocks[1] and they have centralized vacuum municipal trash collection[2]
Lots of opinions about Barcelona, I see.
Somehow I feel I know the city quite well. I moved here more than 20 years ago and I can compare it to others cities I live in or visited.
Barcelona is relatively safe, although, as it's been mentioned, it had several hot spots (I used to live in some of these, actually).
Crime is in most of the cases about pickpocketing or, sadly but infrequently, with assault. Still, believe me, it's a relatively safe city.
Anyhow, it's not a city to grow your children. Traffic is high, bike lanes are not safe and there are very few parks.
This is the reason people try to move to nearby cities whenever they have kids (my case also).
I have been in Paris two weeks ago and I am surprised how much Paris changed in the last years. Bike lanes and people who ride bikes and scooters everywhere.
I hope that this is THE change in most European metropolises for the future. Not only in Barcelona.
Been in Paris two weeks ago as well to visit my girlfriend who's been living there for 11 years.
Scooters are in the process of being banned in Paris because they are too dangerous and in Rome, where I come from, they are going yo be heavily regulated (mandatory helmet, reduced speed, designated pick up and drop locations, etc. ) because they caused a +35% increase of brain traumas to teenagers
Not everything that looks cool on first sight it's an actual improvement.
I honestly can't wait for electric vehicles to become common. No more getting gas attacked when waiting at a traffic stop.
Air pollution is a big deal in my country.
In most of European cities the use of electric scooters have skyrocketed, both private bought and as a service (like Lime).
I don't know how is in France, but in Spain there are new regulation, and new ones halfway, to have a regulation where these vehicles are registered, users have to use helmet, and in a near future, even have civil liability/accident insurance to prevent some kind of problem.
At first, there wasn't nay kind of problem, but more and more people keep buying this scooters, they were driving at high speed in the pavement, there was some accidents with scooters involved, and even there was a couple of pedestrian deaths due to misuse, so the government got serious about that.
It is my experience that two things correlate positively with widespread adoption of biking:
a. Relatively flat city terrain. (Not the case in Prague, for example; a lot of the residential areas are at much higher elevation than the city centre.)
b. Moderate temperatures at both ends of the summer-winter scale. Most people won't bike to work at -20 or +35 Celsius.
For point a, the growing democratization of ebikes really help flatten the terrain.
For point b, the cold in itself is not really a huge deal, if you're dressed appropriately. As for the heat, it really depends on the amount of efforts you have to do.
I see the lack of adequate infrastructure as a much bigger impediment. If you risk getting hurt, you won't cycle, even in the most perfect weather.
Ebikes are more and more common, they already make up half the sales of new bikes in many markets. That's the hills dealt with.
And in regards to cold temperatures, if the only time you daily spend in the cold is the few meters from your house's door to your car's door and then to your work's door, then you just think it is cold because you aren't living it like someone who's active and raises their body temperature in the cold.
Currently I cycle 10km to work and arrive before the sun is barely up, I enjoy those rides, I have good lights on the bike and can use cycling paths on 2/3 of the way. The thing I'm really looking forward to is the snowy days when the world is silenced and cycling though a few centimeters of snow becomes magical.
In my experience the number one thing that is positively correlated with biking adoption is infrastructure. If the population can safely use bicycles and they can be easily accessed/stored/rented then they are more willing to work around other inconveniences.
I agree with other replies: infrastructure is the deciding factor (not climate or terrain).
The way to see and understand "infrastructure" is: what if gov't was cycling-centric instead of car-centric. All the "infrastructure" you see around cars? Do that for cycles. There would be safe, separate, well-maintained, direct routes to all points, all year long, 24-7.
My own belief is that this is not possible in the U.S. without a change of culture. We can't even get respect for pedestrians... in winter here, plows will dump snow right over sidewalks (it will take days for them to be cleared if at all in some places). my 2 cents.
I've been in Barcelona during a summer month during a heat wave. People still biked and walked, many of the streets and paths will be shaded at least on one side by the three to five story buildings on most streets except when the sun is directly overhead, and down the middle of some boulevards there are some very generously wide paths and trees providing shade. It's a very different experience from Houston which is pancake flat by comparison to Barcelona, Barcelona actually has hills.
"Oulu is notable for its transportation network dedicated to non-motor vehicular traffic, including pedestrians and bicycles (termed "light" traffic in Finland). In 2010, the city contained more than 600 kilometres (370 mi) of pathways and more than 100 underpasses and bridges devoted exclusively to light traffic. The network is used year-round. The ratio of light traffic pathways to residents is the highest in Finland and the cycling mode share is 20 percent.[40][41] Oulu is often touted as an excellent city for bicycling."
And the most difficult, practically impossible weather to cycle in, is winter rain. 0-5 degrees celcius and rain, good luck riding your bike. You literally can't dress for it, it's better to even walk because then you can use an umbrella. You have to cover your whole body in specialised clothing that's both warm insulating, and fully waterproof. Your feet, your hands, and even then, your head, your face...
I think you'd be a little surprised. I have a friend in Chicago who's bike commuted year round now for decades.
That's anecdotal for sure but once you are acclimatized to winter I think the gating criteria is more around a secure place to park your bike during the day.
I have another work buddy in Minneapolis who sends me pictures of the temp guage on his Fat-Bike of like -20F training rides in Jan and Feb... yikes!!!!
The truth is that cycling infrastructure is an unnecessary luxury. It's a "good thing" in principle because it's a way of transportation that's good for the environment and gives people exercise, but it's redundant and expensive, you still need full capacity in public transport, because almost no one cycles when the weather is bad. It would only makes sense really if you could dynamically allocate space between cars/bikes basically on a day-by-day basis, and/or convert bike lanes to bus lanes, but I guess you'd need a full fleet of only self driving cars for that to be feasible. Then you could have the luxury of using a bike on days with nice weather, just because it's fun. Until then, it's at the expense of general mobility which is a really big downside in cities that are already crowded and transport is slow. Why should we cycle more? Only one reason is really valid: save the environment. But then again, we have a million comforts and luxuries at the expense of the environment, and people can generally choose, as long as they're not using absurd amount of energy. Why force cycling specifically, I don't understand, just take the bus if you don't want to drive.
> the ride from start to finish lasts about 25 minutes.
That's about 50 minutes to and fro. That's all the exercise a child needs in a day. Wish they'll succeed in making it every day, instead of just on Fridays.
I used to overstate my commuting, as well, but when I compare it to running, you need to at least double the duration for equivalency. Both in numbers and feelz. And you really need to push it (lol) to get your heart working. Not a complete replacement for exercise, otherwise. Luckily, I start hunting on a bike naturally, but lots of people seem to not even break a sweat, or really enjoy sitting on their saddle. Exhaust pollution wise, bike commuting seems to be still beneficial, but it’s definitely putting a counterweight in the bowl, too. Tho, that’s supposed to get better, with fewer (my city started converting whole car lanes into bike lanes <3 ) and electric cars.
Anyway, those children grow up riding bikes will likely continue as adults where getting any exercise is better than nothing. And if you’re used to taking your bike everywhere, you may easily make 20-50km/d, which is something. Biking can be more than a mode of transportation. I often get overwhelmingly happy flowing through the city with a breeze on my skin and people in the same room. I wish that bliss onto everyone.
I’ve noticed there are frequent reposts of the same story or very similar stories when it comes to pro-bike/anti-car/urbanist content. I’ve seen several such posts in the last 24 hours, all on the front page. Reposts are supposed to be buried per the HN FAQ but there isn’t a way to report things as dupes seemingly. @dang is flagging the right approach for handling this?
I don't know how a bike-first city would feel, but biking is a serious bonus in one's life (granted you have safe space or a herd around you). So the more the merrier.
My brother has been living in Barcelona for one year and visiting yearly for over a decade. He tells me he can feel the city change and become more and more of a bike city. As a dutchie this makes him very happy
This is wonderful to see. It’s sad how such an old technology, that can fix so many urban problems, is overlooked in most of the developed world.
- Childhood obesity (around 30% in some areas of developed nations)
- Independence for children (meet friends, get to school, etc.)
- Time poor “taxi service” parents might save 1hr+ / day
- Congestion (bikes can be even more space efficient than buses)
- Air quality (many developed cities exceed WHO guidelines
- Money saved on car payments for the poorest in society. This is a huge burden.
- Independence for those too old, with a disability or medical condition that prevents driving. Did you know many epileptics are not legally allowed to drive?
- City saves money on road repair etc. Road damage is a power of vehicle weight.
- Local shops favoured over out of town, big box etc.
Similar, in Switzerland they have a "Pedibus", mostly for small kids, but they walk a route accompanied by a few adults, picking up kids on the way till you get these long lines of kids walking to school>
Link (In french) https://pedibus.ch/fr/
This happening organically is way better than any state-sponsored policy down the throats of everyone (which includes policies that end up making most traffic to become by cars instead of smaller vehicles or public transit, of course).
organic is great, now we need more of that for all aspects of life, and hopefully some simple large integration of efforts to keep them stable and efficient (after all we have near free computing to communicate, analyse and organize, so why not)
You just uncovered one of the issues in Barcelona: getting a public school place near where you are living, especially in the Eixample district (the one where this initiative is being done) which is super crowded and with very few real estate available for public buildings.
Makes me think of the Critical Mass movement [1], except that this has more impact because they are kids and is actually serving a purpose of going to school.
I live in Barcelona. We have most of the streets with a proper bicycle lane. Too many people using the lines everyday and I believe the best system is Madrid, when you can go directly on the street on one of the lanes, instead of a small lane.
By choice I use a bicycle exclusively for all my transport needs (with the obvious exceptions like furniture etc.), and I'd like to see more people get up on a bike regularly to help promote the people's collective health, but I can see a problem with how this particular practice is executed. How high is the risk that these children might grow into the reckless assumption that the entire road (especially the middle of the road) is theirs for the taking as soon as they get up on their bikes?
Seemingly low I’d think. On the bike bus they’ve got hundreds of kids and parents around them and a police escort, so it’s not a normal biking situation. Plus parents likely are teaching kids bike safety.
Biking in this bus formation and biking normally are separate enough that it doesn’t seem to be a concern. IMO that’s like asking if kids don’t where seat belts on a normal bus, are they then at risk of not wearing seat belts in normal cars?
doctorhandshake|4 years ago
[1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/may/17/superblocks-r...
[2] https://enviropaul.wordpress.com/2016/03/22/all-the-garbage-...
pachico|4 years ago
Barcelona is relatively safe, although, as it's been mentioned, it had several hot spots (I used to live in some of these, actually). Crime is in most of the cases about pickpocketing or, sadly but infrequently, with assault. Still, believe me, it's a relatively safe city.
Anyhow, it's not a city to grow your children. Traffic is high, bike lanes are not safe and there are very few parks. This is the reason people try to move to nearby cities whenever they have kids (my case also).
mlok|4 years ago
ResearchCode|4 years ago
_nalply|4 years ago
I hope that this is THE change in most European metropolises for the future. Not only in Barcelona.
peoplefromibiza|4 years ago
Scooters are in the process of being banned in Paris because they are too dangerous and in Rome, where I come from, they are going yo be heavily regulated (mandatory helmet, reduced speed, designated pick up and drop locations, etc. ) because they caused a +35% increase of brain traumas to teenagers
Not everything that looks cool on first sight it's an actual improvement.
MomoXenosaga|4 years ago
jmrm|4 years ago
I don't know how is in France, but in Spain there are new regulation, and new ones halfway, to have a regulation where these vehicles are registered, users have to use helmet, and in a near future, even have civil liability/accident insurance to prevent some kind of problem.
At first, there wasn't nay kind of problem, but more and more people keep buying this scooters, they were driving at high speed in the pavement, there was some accidents with scooters involved, and even there was a couple of pedestrian deaths due to misuse, so the government got serious about that.
inglor_cz|4 years ago
a. Relatively flat city terrain. (Not the case in Prague, for example; a lot of the residential areas are at much higher elevation than the city centre.)
b. Moderate temperatures at both ends of the summer-winter scale. Most people won't bike to work at -20 or +35 Celsius.
lonelyasacloud|4 years ago
lbreakjai|4 years ago
For point b, the cold in itself is not really a huge deal, if you're dressed appropriately. As for the heat, it really depends on the amount of efforts you have to do.
I see the lack of adequate infrastructure as a much bigger impediment. If you risk getting hurt, you won't cycle, even in the most perfect weather.
TomK32|4 years ago
And in regards to cold temperatures, if the only time you daily spend in the cold is the few meters from your house's door to your car's door and then to your work's door, then you just think it is cold because you aren't living it like someone who's active and raises their body temperature in the cold.
Currently I cycle 10km to work and arrive before the sun is barely up, I enjoy those rides, I have good lights on the bike and can use cycling paths on 2/3 of the way. The thing I'm really looking forward to is the snowy days when the world is silenced and cycling though a few centimeters of snow becomes magical.
mchaver|4 years ago
throw7|4 years ago
The way to see and understand "infrastructure" is: what if gov't was cycling-centric instead of car-centric. All the "infrastructure" you see around cars? Do that for cycles. There would be safe, separate, well-maintained, direct routes to all points, all year long, 24-7.
My own belief is that this is not possible in the U.S. without a change of culture. We can't even get respect for pedestrians... in winter here, plows will dump snow right over sidewalks (it will take days for them to be cleared if at all in some places). my 2 cents.
stevenwoo|4 years ago
mucholove|4 years ago
On the other end of the spectrum, and unanserwed in the article here—Sevilla might be a great place to study the effect of heat.
https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/10/13/best-practices-how-se...
kohlerm|4 years ago
branko_d|4 years ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oulu
"Oulu is notable for its transportation network dedicated to non-motor vehicular traffic, including pedestrians and bicycles (termed "light" traffic in Finland). In 2010, the city contained more than 600 kilometres (370 mi) of pathways and more than 100 underpasses and bridges devoted exclusively to light traffic. The network is used year-round. The ratio of light traffic pathways to residents is the highest in Finland and the cycling mode share is 20 percent.[40][41] Oulu is often touted as an excellent city for bicycling."
namdnay|4 years ago
jseban|4 years ago
Kafkish|4 years ago
rdxm|4 years ago
That's anecdotal for sure but once you are acclimatized to winter I think the gating criteria is more around a secure place to park your bike during the day.
I have another work buddy in Minneapolis who sends me pictures of the temp guage on his Fat-Bike of like -20F training rides in Jan and Feb... yikes!!!!
jseban|4 years ago
[deleted]
jseban|4 years ago
Kafkish|4 years ago
That's about 50 minutes to and fro. That's all the exercise a child needs in a day. Wish they'll succeed in making it every day, instead of just on Fridays.
lm28469|4 years ago
More like the minimum recommended amount, but it's a good start
monopoledance|4 years ago
I used to overstate my commuting, as well, but when I compare it to running, you need to at least double the duration for equivalency. Both in numbers and feelz. And you really need to push it (lol) to get your heart working. Not a complete replacement for exercise, otherwise. Luckily, I start hunting on a bike naturally, but lots of people seem to not even break a sweat, or really enjoy sitting on their saddle. Exhaust pollution wise, bike commuting seems to be still beneficial, but it’s definitely putting a counterweight in the bowl, too. Tho, that’s supposed to get better, with fewer (my city started converting whole car lanes into bike lanes <3 ) and electric cars.
Anyway, those children grow up riding bikes will likely continue as adults where getting any exercise is better than nothing. And if you’re used to taking your bike everywhere, you may easily make 20-50km/d, which is something. Biking can be more than a mode of transportation. I often get overwhelmingly happy flowing through the city with a breeze on my skin and people in the same room. I wish that bliss onto everyone.
gadrev|4 years ago
throwawaysea|4 years ago
agumonkey|4 years ago
I don't know how a bike-first city would feel, but biking is a serious bonus in one's life (granted you have safe space or a herd around you). So the more the merrier.
namenotrequired|4 years ago
pharmakom|4 years ago
- Childhood obesity (around 30% in some areas of developed nations)
- Independence for children (meet friends, get to school, etc.)
- Time poor “taxi service” parents might save 1hr+ / day
- Congestion (bikes can be even more space efficient than buses)
- Air quality (many developed cities exceed WHO guidelines
- Money saved on car payments for the poorest in society. This is a huge burden.
- Independence for those too old, with a disability or medical condition that prevents driving. Did you know many epileptics are not legally allowed to drive?
- City saves money on road repair etc. Road damage is a power of vehicle weight.
- Local shops favoured over out of town, big box etc.
secretsatan|4 years ago
henvic|4 years ago
agumonkey|4 years ago
thriftwy|4 years ago
darkwater|4 years ago
unknown|4 years ago
[deleted]
stabbles|4 years ago
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_Mass_(cycling)
meerita|4 years ago
gnabgib|4 years ago
daneel_w|4 years ago
soared|4 years ago
Biking in this bus formation and biking normally are separate enough that it doesn’t seem to be a concern. IMO that’s like asking if kids don’t where seat belts on a normal bus, are they then at risk of not wearing seat belts in normal cars?