I also still use my ThinkPad X220 happily with Archlinux. Contrary to the author I've built in immediately an OEM IPS-Panel and a Bluetooth 4.0 chip from the next generation. I bought it very late in production cycle because I prefer to keep the classic keyboard with the blue enter-button. The only nasty thing is the USB 3.0 Port which immediately went into sleep states, workarounds are either to connect a device at boot-up or use powertop to wake it up. It is even possible to attach HiDPI displays via DisplayPort (always better than HDMI) but you will fallback to 30 Hz and the tiny GPU will have a hard time.
Pros:
* Mobile with A4/Letter form factor
* Powerful, with a dock it replaces a desktop computer
* Standard size keyboard
* IPS screen is still state-of-the art
* Replaceable battery
* Works very well with Linux
* With a i7 CPU even provides USB 3.0
Cons:
* Modern ThinkPads provide a tighter case, especially the palm rest
I don't want to start a religious keyboard war but does anybody know the actual rationale for the Ctrl Fn swap in ThinkPads?
I agree that it is more ergonomic, but I am just curious if that is the actual reason for the swap? Or if there is some older legacy aspect or story behind it in the ThinkPads?
A couple of months ago, I bought a used Thinkpad X200t in excellent condition. I knew about the popularity of the older Thinkpads and libreboot, and I was interested in a tablet pc because I wanted to use it to read and make notes, so when I came across that X200t (in excellent condition and good price) it was an easy decision to buy it.
Its specs are low (256GB SSD, Core 2 duo, 4GB RAM, 1280x1024 screen), but I find it very usable for browsing, reading and annotating pdfs. It runs Debian stable with KDE Plasma (the pen works well with krita, okular, xournal). The battery is old but is still holding a charge for several hours. I thought the screen would be annoyingly small, but I noticed that it is actually just fine for most web pages. I like the old 1280x1024 a lot more than the nowadays popular 1366x768. I really like it, it's also small and easy to travel with.
What you can do with it, is however limited by the Core 2 Duo chip, and the amount of ram. It's not gonna run a heavy IDE, and as a developer that's a bit of a pity, but was also completely expected.
I just checked how much people ask for old Thinkpads X200 and X200t and they really ask a lot for them, especially for ones that are already librebooted. That's amazing if you realize that those came out in 2008.
You can (could ?) buy these refurbished dirt cheap when big companies update their fleet.
There is a huge modding community, but you don't really need to go that route if all you want is a reliable laptop. Although you might need to change the battery and fan, they're after all 8-10 year old by now.
Where do you find well-made batteries? OEM batteries for my X230 are no longer available, and I've had a hard time understanding which third party batteries are safe.
Micro Center often has off-lease ThinkPads at very attractive prices. They may have scuffs and scratches, but they've always been solid performers. The TrackPoint seals the deal for me.
I do have a recent Dell Inspiron, but I find I'm mostly using it like a desktop, with an external keyboard and trackball, and a second monitor or TV set plugged in. I just can't stand trackpads.
> You can (could ?) buy these refurbished dirt cheap when big companies update their fleet.
At least for me, this is half the appeal of thinkpads. They cost so little for their performance, I have a mate that even got a couple for free.
Most of mine I didn't even need to change anything. The fans still work nicely (sometimes given them a clean of course) and no real battery problems to speak of. Probably a good idea to anyway, but yeh, they're solid laptops even after all these years
I bought a top-end T460s for $220 a few years ago. Insane price for the specs, I went ahead and maxed out the memory and ran all sorts of crazy stuff on it. It was a champion Hackintosh for a few months, but I decided to leave it on Linux like the rest of my devices after a while. Really solid machine for the price.
My girlfriend runs her pet behavior business from a Thinkpad X230, it have taken a lot of drops so the next upgrade is to replace the shell, but I've kept it clean, tightened the screws a couple of times and replaced the keyboard when some keys fell off.
It's a workhorse and it just keeps going, she really likes the form factor. In the beginning she didn't like the trackpoint, but now it's the only thing she uses.
I first thought it would feel cramped but it turns out its work out better than full size keyboard if you are switching back and forth between laptop and desktop.
Mine seems to have just bit the dust. It boots to grub but then whenever some OS or bootable media tries going up the whole system resets. Memtest runs just fine though. Would love to have some system utility that boots and indexes the HW and tells me what is wrong, or some way to step through the Linux init process. Would be a fun way to learn about the underlying bring up process and also diagnose the issue.
Probably not worth the effort considering how little monetary value my x230 has.
Surely this can be a business: A laptop that has the characteristics many of us value in an X220, but without violating Lenovo’s IP. My priorities are the keyboard, reliability, legacy ports, replaceable/upgradable parts. I don’t need the latest CPU nor the highest res screen, but these would be nice, and I appreciate they are of high importance to many.
I’m a non-tech software exec and can have pretty much any laptop I want, but have been exclusively on one X220 after another since they came out. They kept getting cheaper and cheaper! I’m afraid to look now.
At this point, it has been so long that I don’t want to deal with the learning curve or annoyances of anything else, and would probably pay whatever it took for that privilege. At one point, my tech team talked me into a top-of-the line MacBook Pro with every option and dual boot, but I was fed up relearning every little shortcut and shuffled it along after two weeks.
Not quite the same but the most comparable product I'm aware of is the Panasonic "Let's Note" line, which intend to be durable business ultraportables with lots of ports and replaceable (if not hot-swappable) batteries
Though I haven't used one; they'd be difficult to acquire in the West
Well, going from a thinkpad x220 -> mbp is a big change. But I found that the dell xps 13" was very easy to migrate to, and wasn't agonizingly slow for compilation like the older thinkpads.
I still like my x201 and x220's, but I relegate those to less intensive tasks. I have openbsd on one that I pretty much just use for writing articles or emails, which is nice.
However for travel, the older thinkpads are just so incredibly bulky compared to the xps models or the new framework laptop.
I bought a modified X230 on eBay several years ago, then upgraded the RAM to the maximum it would support and installed a 1TB SSD. It’s been going strong for years only needing battery replacement and is my “car laptop” I use for running diagnostics, tuning, and in car data logging in my race cars. It’s taken a SERIOUS beating and still performs.
I wish I could buy another more modern variant, but the original seller is no longer on eBay. Anyone have a link to reliable sellers of retromodded X series?
I got a long way upgrading an old X220 but recently purchased a 51nb X210 (modified X201 with a new mobo) and it's excellent. USB 3, heaps of RAM and a 3k x 2k display
Heraclitus, a Greek philosopher, is quoted as saying "change is the only constant in life."
Cutting my teeth with computers from the 80s through to the 00s, it's bemusing to see people resorting to hotrodding ancient shells of computers that in times previous would have been replaced every two years.
Maybe this slower rate of change is more sustainable, or maybe it is a temporary blip. At least the new Apple chips were good, but I'd rather wait for everybody else to catch up, however long it takes.
I am increasingly uncomfortable with how slowly things are moving. I don't remember generations past complaining about decceleration, rather the opposite.
Love my Thinkpad X220. I changed already keyboard, screen, some parts of its case.. It runs on SSD and it has 16GB RAM. I love it. The only issue is with CPU. Mine still running on a i5 and I would love to update it, to at least an i7.. is that possible?
I love the form-factor of my X230 (which is my most-used personal computer), and I do wish I could have the X220 keyboard and a 1080p display. But there is nothing that could convince me to undertake a project like this.
(My offspring has an X240, and it's terrible. And I hear that newer ThinkPads even have soldered-in RAM and glued-in batteries. I don't know what I'll do when my X230 wears out. Maybe bite the bullet and buy a Framework.)
For me, the entire 40 series was a disaster, especially with the removal of all physical trackpad/trackpoint buttons. I've actually seen a security architect repeatedly slam the client-provided T540 onto a desk in rage. Lenovo apparently saw the error of their ways with the 50 series and they had dedicated buttons back ever since.
X250 was my favourite of that form-factor, as it still had external and internal battery replaceable easily by user. I seem to recall even upgrading the RAM. They can be found for $250ish CAD if you wait/bargain a little.
I too however could never commit to a project like that; just don't have the time/energy/priority. I believe it's the type of thing you undertake for the process, not results :). I ended up being one of those fools who paid for a T470-but-with-good-keyboard, the T25 Anniversary model, and 3 years later I'm still a very happy fool :).
Most of them have one soldered and one replaceable ram module. And so far (t440s, t450s, t470s) I could always easily replace the battery. No glue, just with a screwdriver and a prying tool to open the case.
I’ve done most of these upgrades minus the screen. The keyboard swap wasn’t too bad. Coreboot was a little more scary because of flashing rom and things. The 220 keyboard is pretty nice, although I had to buy two because the first one I bought had a dead key :(
My franken230 is my “thinking machine”… it’s what I use any time I want to write something out because the experience of typing on it is so nice.
I have an X230 that I've done a bunch of upgrades to. It's got CoreBoot, an FHD IPS screen, a quad core i7-3612QE, plus the usual memory and SSD upgrades. It's pretty neat, but I've been growing tired. I haven't refurbished the battery so its life off charger is abysmal, it's really chunky, the trackpad is awful, and every year or so I need to reflow the Nitrocaster mod solder joints because the display starts to go snowy.
It was a fun project to put it all together but I find myself using it less and less as days go by.
What are the aspects that are considered superior for the older 7-row keyboards compared to the newer 6-row keyboards? I have always seen a lot of praise for the older 7-row keyboards but it is not clear to me what makes them superior and too much time has passed since I used one to remember the feel. Is it the feel of the membrane that has changed? Is it the layout itself that is missed? The shape of the keys? Is it key travel? They do indeed have a very iconic look.
Personally I enjoy the clear and sharp separation of keys I can feel on so called chicklet keys. I never liked the keys with lean sloping edges. For the same reason I prefer XDA keycaps for mechanical kkeyboards. And I think the 6-row arrangement alows for a larger touchpad.
I keep trying to get my 'ultimate' thinkpad but there has been a 4+ month wait on shipping for the last year on the customization options I want.
I guess I should have just ordered and waited, but at this point I worry they'll announce the next gen before they even get this one shipped.
Also, it truly irritates me how the price for the same exact configuration can vary drastically from week to week, ranging from $2500 to $4500. I'd be pissed if I paid $4500 and then they offered it for $2500 while I was still waiting for mine to arrive.
I'd love to see what one of these would be like with a modern AMD APU or a modern arm chip. I'd love to have a laptop with days of battery life and decent performance
I'm very happy with my old t440 bought for cheap on ebay, just replaced the screen with an IPS
I highly recommend this blog, same kind of information than on the link given today, but focused on T440
https://octoperf.com/blog/2018/11/07/thinkpad-t440p-buyers-g...
An impressive display of not just the right to repair, but rather the will to improve!
Reminded me of the time when I needed to restore network adapter's firmware in T43 after the eeprom apparently got reset by a minor spill around the touchpad. Luckily it was just water, but still the restoration was almost like a neurosurgery.
Still hoping to find replacement batteries for the T43 and T430.
[+] [-] ho_schi|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pengaru|4 years ago|reply
If you move up to the X230, which your X220 keyboard can bolt right onto, you'll get a Vulkan-capable HD4000 iGPU.
[+] [-] culopatin|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] formerly_proven|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DoingIsLearning|4 years ago|reply
I agree that it is more ergonomic, but I am just curious if that is the actual reason for the swap? Or if there is some older legacy aspect or story behind it in the ThinkPads?
[+] [-] rvdginste|4 years ago|reply
Its specs are low (256GB SSD, Core 2 duo, 4GB RAM, 1280x1024 screen), but I find it very usable for browsing, reading and annotating pdfs. It runs Debian stable with KDE Plasma (the pen works well with krita, okular, xournal). The battery is old but is still holding a charge for several hours. I thought the screen would be annoyingly small, but I noticed that it is actually just fine for most web pages. I like the old 1280x1024 a lot more than the nowadays popular 1366x768. I really like it, it's also small and easy to travel with.
What you can do with it, is however limited by the Core 2 Duo chip, and the amount of ram. It's not gonna run a heavy IDE, and as a developer that's a bit of a pity, but was also completely expected.
I just checked how much people ask for old Thinkpads X200 and X200t and they really ask a lot for them, especially for ones that are already librebooted. That's amazing if you realize that those came out in 2008.
[+] [-] fouc|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zibzab|4 years ago|reply
There is a huge modding community, but you don't really need to go that route if all you want is a reliable laptop. Although you might need to change the battery and fan, they're after all 8-10 year old by now.
[+] [-] xenocyon|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] flyinghamster|4 years ago|reply
I do have a recent Dell Inspiron, but I find I'm mostly using it like a desktop, with an external keyboard and trackball, and a second monitor or TV set plugged in. I just can't stand trackpads.
[+] [-] formerly_proven|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bodge5000|4 years ago|reply
At least for me, this is half the appeal of thinkpads. They cost so little for their performance, I have a mate that even got a couple for free.
Most of mine I didn't even need to change anything. The fans still work nicely (sometimes given them a clean of course) and no real battery problems to speak of. Probably a good idea to anyway, but yeh, they're solid laptops even after all these years
[+] [-] tonyedgecombe|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] smoldesu|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] john61|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] kawsper|4 years ago|reply
It's a workhorse and it just keeps going, she really likes the form factor. In the beginning she didn't like the trackpoint, but now it's the only thing she uses.
[+] [-] zibzab|4 years ago|reply
https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/p/accessories-and-software/keyb...
I first thought it would feel cramped but it turns out its work out better than full size keyboard if you are switching back and forth between laptop and desktop.
[+] [-] CTOSian|4 years ago|reply
you may use a thread lock adhesive, make sure is the "blue" type ( can be easily removed) not the "red" one.
[+] [-] RealityVoid|4 years ago|reply
Probably not worth the effort considering how little monetary value my x230 has.
[+] [-] unknown|4 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] crowbahr|4 years ago|reply
Link is dead and 404s. The file directory 403s.
Always frustrating to see people not mirror.
[+] [-] ognyankulev|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Kaibeezy|4 years ago|reply
I’m a non-tech software exec and can have pretty much any laptop I want, but have been exclusively on one X220 after another since they came out. They kept getting cheaper and cheaper! I’m afraid to look now.
At this point, it has been so long that I don’t want to deal with the learning curve or annoyances of anything else, and would probably pay whatever it took for that privilege. At one point, my tech team talked me into a top-of-the line MacBook Pro with every option and dual boot, but I was fed up relearning every little shortcut and shuffled it along after two weeks.
[+] [-] nfoz|4 years ago|reply
Though I haven't used one; they'd be difficult to acquire in the West
https://panasonic.jp/cns/pc/products/fv1j/
[+] [-] andrewzah|4 years ago|reply
I still like my x201 and x220's, but I relegate those to less intensive tasks. I have openbsd on one that I pretty much just use for writing articles or emails, which is nice.
However for travel, the older thinkpads are just so incredibly bulky compared to the xps models or the new framework laptop.
[+] [-] Fnoord|4 years ago|reply
[1] https://minifree.org/
[+] [-] tristor|4 years ago|reply
I wish I could buy another more modern variant, but the original seller is no longer on eBay. Anyone have a link to reliable sellers of retromodded X series?
[+] [-] nix23|4 years ago|reply
or
https://minifree.org/
[+] [-] 24t|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] eliasmacpherson|4 years ago|reply
Cutting my teeth with computers from the 80s through to the 00s, it's bemusing to see people resorting to hotrodding ancient shells of computers that in times previous would have been replaced every two years.
Maybe this slower rate of change is more sustainable, or maybe it is a temporary blip. At least the new Apple chips were good, but I'd rather wait for everybody else to catch up, however long it takes.
I am increasingly uncomfortable with how slowly things are moving. I don't remember generations past complaining about decceleration, rather the opposite.
[+] [-] pelasaco|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] NoGravitas|4 years ago|reply
(My offspring has an X240, and it's terrible. And I hear that newer ThinkPads even have soldered-in RAM and glued-in batteries. I don't know what I'll do when my X230 wears out. Maybe bite the bullet and buy a Framework.)
[+] [-] NikolaNovak|4 years ago|reply
X250 was my favourite of that form-factor, as it still had external and internal battery replaceable easily by user. I seem to recall even upgrading the RAM. They can be found for $250ish CAD if you wait/bargain a little.
I too however could never commit to a project like that; just don't have the time/energy/priority. I believe it's the type of thing you undertake for the process, not results :). I ended up being one of those fools who paid for a T470-but-with-good-keyboard, the T25 Anniversary model, and 3 years later I'm still a very happy fool :).
[+] [-] nh2|4 years ago|reply
https://community.frame.work/t/what-keyboard-options-will-be...
[+] [-] andix|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] icey|4 years ago|reply
My franken230 is my “thinking machine”… it’s what I use any time I want to write something out because the experience of typing on it is so nice.
[+] [-] formerly_proven|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] amarshall|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] maximilianburke|4 years ago|reply
It was a fun project to put it all together but I find myself using it less and less as days go by.
[+] [-] unknown|4 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] jacknews|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] alexvoda|4 years ago|reply
Personally I enjoy the clear and sharp separation of keys I can feel on so called chicklet keys. I never liked the keys with lean sloping edges. For the same reason I prefer XDA keycaps for mechanical kkeyboards. And I think the 6-row arrangement alows for a larger touchpad.
[+] [-] heroprotagonist|4 years ago|reply
I guess I should have just ordered and waited, but at this point I worry they'll announce the next gen before they even get this one shipped.
Also, it truly irritates me how the price for the same exact configuration can vary drastically from week to week, ranging from $2500 to $4500. I'd be pissed if I paid $4500 and then they offered it for $2500 while I was still waiting for mine to arrive.
[+] [-] gravypod|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] eurusd|4 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zoomablemind|4 years ago|reply
Reminded me of the time when I needed to restore network adapter's firmware in T43 after the eeprom apparently got reset by a minor spill around the touchpad. Luckily it was just water, but still the restoration was almost like a neurosurgery.
Still hoping to find replacement batteries for the T43 and T430.