Considering that Taiwan is already independent and would need to be persuaded to join the PRC, these kinds of threats seem counterproductive to China's goals of "peaceful reunification".
This is the golden rule of nations - no nation “owns” anything. It’s only what you can defend and get other nations to recognize.
Remember there are pro-China factions in Taiwan. All China needs to do is invade, suppress dissent and elevate the views of those few who are happy with the outcome.
And with that ‘A “rogue” state of China lead by “seditionists, Western mercenaries and reactionaries” will then have been “rightfully pacified and reunified” with China in accordance with the “will of the people”’.
And just like that…an independent country ceases to exist.
From your perspective, maybe. But not from China's perspective.
> these kinds of threats seem counterproductive to China's goals of "peaceful reunification"
Imposing economic sanctions until the country has to oblige to China's request I'm sure is seen as "peaceful" from China's perspective. I think the only thing that is far away is outright war, but everything else would be considered "peaceful".
Typical HN relativism and intellectualization. In its current state, Taiwan is independent, and it will require either:
a) Taiwanese consensus to officially rejoin China.
b) An act of war.
We can discuss China's perspective all day, but it does not change the status quo. What about the perspective of Russia? Australia? South Africa? Which one is true? Is anything true?
The US has imposed similar "peaceful" economic sanctions on a few countries until they obliged to requests too. This move is hardly specific to Chinese diplomacy.
> Considering that Taiwan is already independent and would need to be persuaded to join the PRC, these kinds of threats seem counterproductive to China's goals of "peaceful reunification".
--flurben
so flurben will now be criminally responsible for life (in China)?
Correct. If flurben ever wants to go to China incl Hong Kong and Macau, and the officials there google a bit, that might be a problem. Probably not jailed, but no visa either.
It will also be a problem for companies who deal with Chinese companies. If e.g. Tim Cook started talking about the nation of Taiwan, he would probably get an email from somebody with a .gov.cn address reminding him "Nice Foxconn supplier you got there, would be a shame if something happened to your contracts... wanna revise your recent statements?"
Well, that even was a problem before this announcement, but this announcement certainly will make it worse.
At this point I'm not sure what will happen when China eventually attacks Taiwan. It is a vital resource for the USA in terms of their sheer semiconductor industrial output. It doesn't really seem that the USA would get involved in such a fight though, or make more than a token effort. I think Taiwan missed their chance in the 80s to become a nuclear power when China was busy with other stuff, now it's too late and they are all but doomed to eventual takeover by China.
US terminated Taiwan's nuclear program in 1988. They confiscated fuel rod, data, research paper, poured cement into the labs and dismantled the heavy water reactor that was worth around 2 billion USD.
Not according to the PRC, and a lot of countries and international institutions either. Some (usually with close ties to China, but now always, e.g. Spain[1], probably because they do not want to give their own separatist movements any political ammunition) consider the ROC part of the PRC, others are deliberately vague on whether they consider Taiwan independent or even a nation, like e.g. the US[0].
The WHO for example is very adept at avoiding any position on Taiwan[2].
And then of course, there is this guy... [3]. (Just if you like some cringe about a serious topic)
>China's goals of "peaceful reunification".
(PR) China doesn't really talk about peaceful reunification. They officially consider Taiwan part of the country already, a part that is just a little rebellious at the moment. They are more talking about a peaceful end of the conflict, but recently use the word "peaceful" a lot less.
Taiwan is considered independent by the vast majority of countries, who are doing business with it and having totally normally diplomatic relationships with it. The only caveat is Taiwan embassies are called bullshit and those countries will pretend not having diplomatic with it. But this is theater only and for 99% of things that matter Taiwan is considered a country.
Let's take an example: passports. France is one of the country pretending Taiwan isn't independent while letting Taiwanese people enter its borders with a Taiwanese passport. Since when people can move around with passports from an not independent country? Other example: academic scholarships for foreigners in Japan. China and Taiwan are separated and treated vastly different things. Also money changing: I didn't had any issue changing from and to NTD the last I went to a change bureau in KIX airport. How all of this is this possible if Taiwan is not, in fact, recognized as a country?
> Not according to the PRC, and a lot of countries and international institutions either.
funny last time I remember going to Taiwan I was not subject to mainland China visa rules.
silly comment. you can deny facts all day long and pretend the sky is red instead of blue. Taiwan is in control of the territory and thats legitimacy enough.
Remove the "probably" for Spain, it's totally for that reason. They also have the same stance on the Republic of Kosovo with some "hilarious" moment when there was the footbal World Cup qualification match between Kosovo and Spain, with TV in Spain forces to use lower case for Kosovo, commentarists avoiding to say the K-word etc.
refurb|4 years ago
Remember there are pro-China factions in Taiwan. All China needs to do is invade, suppress dissent and elevate the views of those few who are happy with the outcome.
And with that ‘A “rogue” state of China lead by “seditionists, Western mercenaries and reactionaries” will then have been “rightfully pacified and reunified” with China in accordance with the “will of the people”’.
And just like that…an independent country ceases to exist.
capableweb|4 years ago
From your perspective, maybe. But not from China's perspective.
> these kinds of threats seem counterproductive to China's goals of "peaceful reunification"
Imposing economic sanctions until the country has to oblige to China's request I'm sure is seen as "peaceful" from China's perspective. I think the only thing that is far away is outright war, but everything else would be considered "peaceful".
papito|4 years ago
a) Taiwanese consensus to officially rejoin China. b) An act of war.
We can discuss China's perspective all day, but it does not change the status quo. What about the perspective of Russia? Australia? South Africa? Which one is true? Is anything true?
athenot|4 years ago
bsedlm|4 years ago
--flurben
so flurben will now be criminally responsible for life (in China)?
rndgermandude|4 years ago
It will also be a problem for companies who deal with Chinese companies. If e.g. Tim Cook started talking about the nation of Taiwan, he would probably get an email from somebody with a .gov.cn address reminding him "Nice Foxconn supplier you got there, would be a shame if something happened to your contracts... wanna revise your recent statements?"
Well, that even was a problem before this announcement, but this announcement certainly will make it worse.
stjohnswarts|4 years ago
davidjytang|4 years ago
unknown|4 years ago
[deleted]
redis_mlc|4 years ago
[deleted]
rndgermandude|4 years ago
Not according to the PRC, and a lot of countries and international institutions either. Some (usually with close ties to China, but now always, e.g. Spain[1], probably because they do not want to give their own separatist movements any political ammunition) consider the ROC part of the PRC, others are deliberately vague on whether they consider Taiwan independent or even a nation, like e.g. the US[0].
The WHO for example is very adept at avoiding any position on Taiwan[2].
And then of course, there is this guy... [3]. (Just if you like some cringe about a serious topic)
>China's goals of "peaceful reunification".
(PR) China doesn't really talk about peaceful reunification. They officially consider Taiwan part of the country already, a part that is just a little rebellious at the moment. They are more talking about a peaceful end of the conflict, but recently use the word "peaceful" a lot less.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Policy_of_deliberate_ambiguity
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain%E2%80%93Taiwan_relations
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlCYFh8U2xM
[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z88zeQ25pjQ
tasogare|4 years ago
Let's take an example: passports. France is one of the country pretending Taiwan isn't independent while letting Taiwanese people enter its borders with a Taiwanese passport. Since when people can move around with passports from an not independent country? Other example: academic scholarships for foreigners in Japan. China and Taiwan are separated and treated vastly different things. Also money changing: I didn't had any issue changing from and to NTD the last I went to a change bureau in KIX airport. How all of this is this possible if Taiwan is not, in fact, recognized as a country?
ekianjo|4 years ago
funny last time I remember going to Taiwan I was not subject to mainland China visa rules.
silly comment. you can deny facts all day long and pretend the sky is red instead of blue. Taiwan is in control of the territory and thats legitimacy enough.
flurben|4 years ago
Taiwan is functionally independent, currently, no matter what China, or John Cena or the Government of Djibouti says.
In fact there is no need for Taiwan to 'declare independence' because it has never been part of the PRC.
darkwater|4 years ago