[KoenDG]

>To those that say, "Hey, it's just time for white males to find out what it has been like for women and ethnic minorities"

The only people saying that are bitter idiots.

Reading all these anecdotes of disinterested people of color just confirms to me people want to strawman this issue, as they always do.

Nobody is talking about forced hiring of disinterested people. The problematic situation is when several candidates who are perfectly confident, able and willing are not hired, because the hiring manager for some reason just liked that white person better. Every single time. Just... a gut feeling, since they were all pretty much equal.

That practice, where the person hiring always defaults to the white person, even in a mixed group of people with equal skill, is what's problematic, and what needs to be tackled.

Yet people have already begun imagining the most extreme fantasy scenario possible... bad thing is that when you start imagining that, some people actually start doing it because they think they have to. Repeat a lie enough, and people will start thinking it's the truth.

From a more long term point of view, it's also important to increase diversity. Simple from the argument that the more groups you get interested and comfortable with joining a certain industry, the more skill and competition will eventually come around.

Giving more people starter positions and the chance to learn, is exactly how you robustly increase a workforce. But more importantly: having strict rules against abuse.

Here's my time for anecdotal evidence: known several people, perfectly skilled, who just left tech companies because of the casual racism and sexism that HR just decided to ignore.

And when only 1 or 2 people are involved, you can keep the larger workforce thinking there's nothing bad going on. And so when people see a thread like that, they go "I've never seen that". Well yeah, it's being kept out of sight...

[throwaway120398]

> That practice, where the person hiring always defaults to the white person, even in a mixed group of people with equal skill, is what's problematic, and what needs to be tackled.

Yes, I agree this needs to be tackled (an understatement I know). We need to stamp out the racism that non-white people routinely face. As far as hiring goes, I feel a lot of progress has been made on this front, but I don't have any idea if that feeling is correct.

> Yet people have already begun imagining the most extreme fantasy scenario possible... bad thing is that when you start imagining that, some people actually start doing it because they think they have to. Repeat a lie enough, and people will start thinking it's the truth.

I'm not certain exactly what you are referring to here. I was going to comment on it but then realised maybe I have completely misunderstood. What fantasy scenario and lie are you referring to here? And what is it that people start actually doing?

[KoenDG]

By fantasy scenario I refer to those people who comment one thing and one thing only: the idea that the government wants to force bad hires, as some kind of attack against white people.

While in reality, all that's being asked is to recognize that there's something systemic going on here.

But enough people comment this, some people pick it up and actually start doing it...