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okal | 4 years ago

An interesting Romance counter-example is "Obrigado" vs "Obrigada" ("thank you", in Portuguese). I'm not even remotely fluent, but if I recall correctly, the gender is dependent on the speaker, not the person being addressed.

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n4r9|4 years ago

I've heard of this example before, and this is speculative but I wonder if it's because the speaker is counter-intuitively also the object of the phrase.

The root "obrigad" sounds a lot like the English word "obligate". If this is more than just a coincidence, then a more direct translation is "I am obliged" rather than "thank you". Said this way it makes a lot of sense why the verb is determined by the speaker.

telmo|4 years ago

Yes, this is exactly the reason. (I am a native speaker)

codethief|4 years ago

Well, practically all adjectives in Spanish/Portuguese/French/Italian change depending on the grammatical gender of the noun they refer to. And, of course, if the noun in question is "I" (as in your case), then they reveal the (physical) gender of the speaker because usually

    grammatical gender of a person == physical gender of that person
But compared to the differences in, e.g., Japanese that some people here are discussing, this seems rather minor.

ggrrhh_ta|4 years ago

The most obvious English case would be "beautiful/handsome".

I am handsome.

I am beautiful.

WillPostForFood|4 years ago

Those words are differentiated on the object, not the gender of the speaker.

the_af|4 years ago

Oh, yes, but those aren't nouns. I didn't mean Spanish isn't gendered -- it obviously is -- but that gendered nouns aren't indicative of the gender of the speaker, so that particular observation was unrelated to the topic under discussion. Your example is indeed an example of gendered language depending on the speaker, and has similar examples in Spanish (e.g. "contento" / "contenta" for "happy").

forinti|4 years ago

There are other little things in Portuguese:

I did it myself: Eu fiz eu mesmo/Eu fiz eu mesma.

And most adjectives. Actually, "obrigado" is "obliged" so the phrase "much obliged" is equivalent to the Portuguese "muito obrigado".

pvaldes|4 years ago

"Obrigado" is a contraction for "I am" obrigado. ("I'm indebted to you"), so you need to use the gender appropriate for the speaker