[charlchi]

> with Kremlin propaganda portraying Ukraine as a proto-fascist, neo-Nazi state

Kremlin propaganda... I mean the US did (publicly at least)suspend military aid to Ukranian militias over their overt neonazi and white supremacist ties¹(these militias were then simply subsumed into the National Guard). Furthermore, the American military has even published a publicly available analysis of such forces in Ukraine², confirming their existence.

[1] wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion

[2] ctc.usma.edu/the-nexus-between-far-right-extremists-in-the-united-states-and-ukraine/

Furthermore, see jacobinmags article for more comprehensive analysis of these sources³.

[3] jacobinmag.com/2022/01/cia-neo-nazi-training-ukraine-russia-putin-biden-nato

None of the sources I've used here are in any way "Russian", they are all by Western sources. If quoting the American military's own reports is spreading "Kremlin propaganda", well then I can't help you.

If you think there is no weight to the neonazi presence in Ukraine, you've clearly fell for western propaganda, which the linked article gives itself away as being.

[boardwaalk]

Are you implying that having a neo-nazi problems justifies the invasion? Because that’s what it sounds like.

There’s also some irony in dismissing this article as propaganda when all you’ve pointed out is that it, offhandedly I might say, called the situation Kremlin propaganda. Especially it since consists mostly predictions, an enormous amount of which have become true.

[charlchi]

> Are you implying that having a neo-nazi problems justifies the invasion? Because that’s what it sounds like.

Not that I condone war, or the invasion, but going off the cuff here: If we take the context of what Russia has said, and to facts on the ground, the 2 largest Russian military operations are currently surrounding Kharkiv and Mariupol, which have shown to be 2 of the largest bases for the neo-nazi and far-right militia recruitment in Ukraine.

> There’s also some irony in dismissing this article as propaganda when all you’ve pointed out is that it, offhandedly I might say, called the situation Kremlin propaganda. Especially it since consists mostly predictions, an enormous amount of which have become true.

I don't doubt the validity of the article's predictions. I doubted the articles dismissal of the neo-nazi and far right presence as being "Kremlin propaganda". When I hear this line, it automatically makes me believe the writer is either ignorant, or intentionally spreading propaganda, as this kind of dismissal does not coincide with reality. I'm just trying to inform people, because I see this narrative constantly, and it's worth fighting back against.

[mojzu]

You can find some white supremacist/neo-nazi fuckwits pretty much wherever you go, there are probably more then a few in most western militaries (and I wonder how many you could find in the Russian military). It's not grounds for overthrowing a democracy and murdering innocent civilians in the process, particularly when according to your sources:

  However, the mobilization of far-right groups in Ukraine does not extend to political success;

[Semaphor]

As your [2] says

> However, the mobilization of far-right groups in Ukraine does not extend to political success; in the 2019 parliamentary elections, they received little over two percent of the vote.

[charlchi]

These groups don't need political success when they are already subsumed into the apparatus of the military, as the sources I have linked to also point out.

[csee]

Ukraine are supporting the Azov Battalion out of sheer desperation due to constant Russian aggression. They can't afford to pick and choose who will help them in their defence. The presence of neo-nazis in the general population is actually much lower in Ukraine than it is in Russia according to polling. And there's no evidence of a neo-nazi presence in Ukrainian leadership.

[risyachka]

There is is nazi presence in EVERY country in the world. Also in US and EU. And no, Ukraine doesn't have the biggest one.

So what is your point?

[jskrablin]

Ukraine has a neonazi problem that has been thoroughly analyzed and presented in the West. That's not exactly news.

However (and that's a big however) majority of Ukranians are not neonazis. And their political leadership is certainly not neonazis with Zelensky being a Jew. That kinda puts the 'ol Soviet playbook about "liberating people from neonazis" that's being used by Putin in a weird light. Maybe he's going to liberate USA next, because you know, KKK?

[ranger207]

Yes, there are neo-Nazis in the Ukrainian military. There's neo-Nazis in the American military too, and the German military despite their extensive anti-Nazi efforts, along with neo-Nazis in the Russian military such as the Wagner group. Turns out militaristic authoritarians are attracted to military service wherever they are. I'm not saying that neo-Nazis in the military aren't a problem, but it's a problem like covid in the military is: something that's nigh inevitable as long as it exists, and something to be stamped out when evidence of its existence is found, regardless of which military it's in.

[cjrp]

There's a difference between neo-Nazis existing in a country (even being part of the army) and the country being a neo-Nazi state.

[rvz]

Well, you are not wrong to some extent. Even the mainstream media's 'blue eyes and blond hair' bias are playing into Putin's weak excuse to invade - making the media look like white supremacists. [0]

Just how they think wars cannot happen anywhere in the world and now they have been revealed to be and admitted white supremacists themselves on TV is just beyond me.

I'd say they are competing to be a true neo-Nazi.

[0] https://twitter.com/AlanRMacLeod/status/1497974245737050120

[kspacewalk2]

Azov is a single militia unit with plenty of non-neo-Nazi members, who joined because it's well equipped and has high morale rather than to advance some far-right cause.

[hef19898]

Funny, how the German Armed Forces can still buy weapons from the US then...

[pjc50]

The (present day) German Armed Forces have nothing to do with the Nazis?