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After roasting Apple about headphone jacks, Google dumps it from Pixel 6A

225 points| lxm | 3 years ago |theverge.com | reply

305 comments

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[+] blacklight|3 years ago|reply
Good, and I'll keep avoiding phones that ditch the audio jack.

And let me be clear - the 3.5mm jack is far from being the perfect way of transmitting and sending audio. It's a vestige from an analog world where you have to take impedence and resistance of the load into account, and I don't use it much myself.

But the use-case where you have to stream music from your phone and you have just a humble set of speakers, an amplifier or some old headphones isn't that uncommon - especially for musicians like me: what happens when you're in a studio with your band, you want to play an mp3 on your phone, but you have no way of plugging your phone to the mixer or the amp?

Pretending that such use-cases don't exist, and force all the users to figure out an alternative, is an act of sheer arrogance on the producers' side. And such arrogance isn't even justified by the claim of water resistance: it's technically possible today to have an audio jack port AND be waterproof.

[+] oftenwrong|3 years ago|reply
This does not seem to make sense given the sentiments I've seen from reviewers and consumers.

Pixel 3A: widely praised for having a headphone jack

Pixel 4A: widely praised for still having a headphone jack

Pixel 5A: widely praised for still having a headphone jack

Pixel 6A: no headphone jack

Personally, I am not ready to give up the headphone jack. I wish I could go fully wireless, but bluetooth audio is too frustrating to use in many cases.

For example, my family has a bluetooth speaker. Managing and switching whose phone was paired via bluetooth was so annoying. There was frequently a mismatch between the device we wanted to be connected, and the device that was actually connected. We eventually reverted to just plugging our phones into the audio-in port of the speaker. Unplugging and plugging is quick, simple, and doesn't require fiddling with device menus. Guests don't have to endure the tedious "pairing" ritual. Of course, we have to have dongles anyway...

Another example is in rental cars. For one, pairing and switching devices with car media systems is dreadful. I've also had frequent problems, with multiple different phones and multiple different cars, where audio media and satnav announcements would not switch properly over bluetooth, such that the satnav announcements would get cut off. On the other hand, the "aux" port works flawlessly 100% of the time with no fiddling. Never travel without at 3.5mm audio cable.

If the wireless audio implementations were more user friendly, I think many current headphone jack holdouts would happily cut the cord.

[+] neilsense|3 years ago|reply
It makes perfect sense. Reviewers want something to differentiate it from the iPhone and to rave about, so they choose the headphone jack.

Whereas users, and Google absolutely has the data for this, are probably mostly using bluetooh ear pods or headphones and so Google knows real users don't care.

[+] CosmicShadow|3 years ago|reply
I feel like I'll be stuck never being able to buy a new phone. Everyone is removing basic features like headphone jacks and sd card slots.
[+] tonmoy|3 years ago|reply
Having worked on Audio Codecs and even though my livelihood depends on it, I would like to say 3.5mm jacks suck! You need to figure out how much resistive and how much capacitive load any headphone has. You need to detect if it has mic, if it does is it US or China standard. Need to make sure that the DAC and amplifier don’t consume too much power yet have a good dynamic range for arbitrary cable length. Let the phone send digital audio data along with power using USB-C and have the earpieces play the audio, it’d be much simpler IMO
[+] sgtnoodle|3 years ago|reply
Those all sound like good things to optimize to make a really good headphone driver, but they aren't strictly necessary are they? "Standard" line level analog audio has been a thing for what, 90 years? I could explain to an 8 year old how it works. It's very simple.

Embedding an IC into a cable that talks USB 2.0 doesn't seem like a simplification to me. I'm a staff level embedded engineer, and I wish an 8 year old could explain to me how that all works.

Any DAC still ideally does all the things you listed optimally, so you're just externalizing the same complexity by leveraging the marvels of modern technology. It's a pain to have to carry another dongle. They feel like they're going to damage my USB-C port when plugged in inside my pocket. Do buttons even work at all with those adapters?

I'd rather the smartphone engineers build an awesome DAC and charge me an extra $15 for the phone, rather than have to buy a $15 dongle of questionable quality on Amazon, or a $50 dongle of even worse quality from Best Buy or something.

[+] programmer_dude|3 years ago|reply
Lol bluetooth sucks a 1000x more. The protocol stack is itself a nightmare.
[+] endgame|3 years ago|reply
That's a shame, but at least you can't run DRM over a 3.5mm cable.
[+] thefz|3 years ago|reply
Yeah let's dump decades of electronics relying on different sized Jacks to the landfill for your convenience. And let's not forget that you can upsell the mini usb-c dongle for a decent margin!

There's a middle ground working for everybody without going into audiophile territory.

[+] ginko|3 years ago|reply
>You need to figure out how much resistive and how much capacitive load any headphone has.

Why would you? That's part of the headphone's characteristics. People who buy high impedance headphones should know when to use an amplifier. That's not the DAC's job.

[+] guelo|3 years ago|reply
So hard yet millions of devices, cheap and expensive, had no problem providing it for decades.
[+] dhosek|3 years ago|reply
I remember being a little shocked to discover that I had better battery life on my phone with Bluetooth than I did with a wired connection.
[+] CameronNemo|3 years ago|reply
You really want to take up your only usb-c port for headphones? Would be nice if they gave an extra USB port to compensate for the loss.

Also USB can do analog audio supposedly...

[+] kalleboo|3 years ago|reply
USB-C is also a minefield - there are multiple incompatible ways to do audio over USB-C (including outputting it in analog for cheap adapters!)
[+] raverbashing|3 years ago|reply
> figure out how much resistive and how much capacitive load any headphone has

This is not and has never been a problem for consumer based devices. All headphones are made +/- with the same impedance.

> Need to make sure that the DAC and amplifier don’t consume too much power yet have a good dynamic range for arbitrary cable length

If cable length is an issue for you then you're using a really bad cable. I mean, really bad. Or have a severely underpowered output amplifier.

Analog is simpler than digital. And if you think your cheap headphone will do sound better than the phone manufacturers I have a bridge to sell to you

[+] shepardrtc|3 years ago|reply
For years I swore I would never get wireless headphones. I always made this mental mockery of running out of battery and not being able to use them. But now that I have a pair - and ones that have noise cancellation, at that - I can't imagine not using them. I plugged in headphones to my laptop once and it felt so clunky. Never thought I would say that.
[+] ben-schaaf|3 years ago|reply
I'm in the same position but have the opposite conclusion. They cut out when using the microwave or in busy areas of the city. The fact that they're not attached means I forget my phone on occasion and have to go back. Pairing with new devices is much more hassle than using the cable, so I only use bluetooth with my phone and cable otherwise. Even then it sometimes just doesn't connect. The battery life is amazing, but I have on many occasions just used the cable or my backup wired earphones instead because it was flat.

In conclusion the noise cancelling is awesome, but the wireless for me is at best a very situational improvement and I wouldn't be less happy without it. I certainly will continue to use wired earphones and avoid products without an aux port.

[+] snvzz|3 years ago|reply
Get Sennheiser HD600 (cabled!) and you'll recover your wired sanity.
[+] aasasd|3 years ago|reply
I can only guess that no one at Google ever tried to use bluetooth headphones for anything serious. Or they would know that thanks to the gigantic latency, particularly on Android, with anything more demanding than videos those headphones are absolute trash, total garbage, useless junk and utter shit. But of course, Google never gave a flying fuck about audio on Android, so they didn't bother to check if it works reasonably. Bluetooth headphones make some noises when connected, so it must be fine.
[+] Moto7451|3 years ago|reply
I’m pretty sure it’s a move connected to both the industry trajectory and the Pixel Buds.

https://store.google.com/us/magazine/pixel_buds_compare

I’m an iPhone user so I can’t comment on the Android audio stack in day to day use. Apple’s magic Bluetooth chips in the AirPods seem to work really well for me. I imagine the Google equivalent would work well with Google phones

[+] izacus|3 years ago|reply
I know it's popular to screech and yell and rage on the internets but... you people do know that USB-C to jack adapters are a thing you just throw next to your headphone cable?

They work fine with my iPad, Huawei Android tablet and S22 phone. I'd guess they'll work well with Pixels too? You're not forced to use bluetooth/wireless headphones.

[+] bootlooped|3 years ago|reply
What do normal users do where audio latency would be absolute trash, total garbage, useless junk and utter shit?
[+] mym1990|3 years ago|reply
I'm on my third pair of airpods, and have no plans to get another eventually. The first pair I misplaced(later to be found)...obviously my fault. But the second pair, the firmware is stuck in limbo where both buds have a different firmware version, both old. I took it to Apple and hilariously enough they have no process for forcing a firmware update. They literally said 'go home, try some stuff, hope it works, if it doesn't, come back and buy another pair'. The third pair the left bud has 50% audio. I still use it daily, but its ironic that a product that was supposed to be seamless is consistently operating at subpar level.
[+] guelo|3 years ago|reply
I've blown close to a thousand dollars on lost and damaged earbuds. No wonder these anti consumer companies love them. But I'm not spending more, I've basically lost the functionality from my phone.
[+] google234123|3 years ago|reply
Try using some rubbing alcohol and a brush on the airpod mesh speaker area . Also make sure your volume balance isn’t off in your settings
[+] hajile|3 years ago|reply
Buy a decent Bluetooth DAC and plug in your favorite IEMs then never worry about that stuff again.

Even a $30-50 DAC with good IEM will sound so much better and if you have Bluetooth issues, it’s not a huge replacement cost.

[+] jfengel|3 years ago|reply
I spent a lot of time with a Pixel 3, and I'm happy with my Pixel 5A. The latter has a headphone jack; the former doesn't.

With my Pixel 3, I replaced the fancy headphones several times, at a cost of about $30. I really did like the Google-brand headphones (they stay in very well while running), and I didn't find it inconvenient to be unable to charge while listening.

But I really like being able to use very cheap earbuds. They break or get lost, I buy more. And they're available anywhere, while the USB-C ones are a specialty item.

I also use the USB-C port a lot, when I'm driving, and that works really well. I never did find a set of bluetooth earbuds that worked well enough when I was running.

[+] bryanrasmussen|3 years ago|reply
Isn't that normal though, Apple makes some design decision, everyone talks smack, a few years later everyone follows.

And I hate the lack of headphone jacks on things.

[+] thefz|3 years ago|reply
What is good for a business does not necessarily mean it is for the customer too.
[+] gfrff|3 years ago|reply
I feel like there's an adequate market for a phone case with a high quality headphone jack, extended battery, sd slot, etc. It shouldn't more than double the thickness
[+] throw7|3 years ago|reply
If at all, the "-a" pixel phones should have traditional/stable features like headphone jacks, fingerprint sensors on the back (no experimental/slow in back of glass sensor) , and the "smaller" form factor. It's really disappointing that this "high/low" market is not exploited.
[+] JuanSucks|3 years ago|reply
I've read through so many comments on the headphone jack debate throughout the years since they started removing them from phones, and I've still yet to see a fair justification for their removal. You can still use wireless earbuds perfectly fine on phones that include a headphone jack, so the argument that wireless earbuds are more convenient is moot. Arguing over the benefits and downsides of bluetooth do nothing to address the subject at hand, which is the removal of a feature that used to come standard on any phone on the market.
[+] musicale|3 years ago|reply
For better or for worse, Apple is often ahead of the curve.

They love to get rid of ports, but years after going all-in on USB C/Thunderbolt for 2016 MacBook Pro models they actually backtracked and added some of the missing ports back (though I wish they'd kept 4 - or more! - USB C/Thunderbolt ports!)

[+] NoPicklez|3 years ago|reply
I never understood why they removed MagSafe, fair enough it meant you should use USB-C which is more standardised. But it was an excellent feature, which kept my charger working for 10+ years.
[+] fuzzythinker|3 years ago|reply
Getting rid of floppy drive was probably their first "get rid of ports" move.
[+] taejavu|3 years ago|reply
Yes but they influence the curve too. I don't think the phasing out of 3.5mm jacks was inevitable - if Apple kept them so would have every other company!
[+] robgibbons|3 years ago|reply
Comparing the specs between the 5a vs the 6a right now, there don't seem to be any compelling reasons to wait. Other than the different placement of the fingerprint sensor, the only major difference seems to be the processor (Tensor vs Snapdragon). In fact, the battery in the 6a is a downgrade from the 5a (by sheer mAh if not by actual life), and you lose the headphone port.

https://www.tomsguide.com/face-off/google-pixel-6a-vs-pixel-...

[+] hindsightbias|3 years ago|reply
Always copying, never leading.
[+] rantallion|3 years ago|reply
You're talking about Apple, right?

First smartphone, produced by IBM. First portable media player, produced by Archos. First tablet computer, produced by Cambridge Media.

Apple are infamous for taking someone else's idea, giving it a bit more polish, than marketing it as though they came up with it in the first place.

[+] Mehringotio|3 years ago|reply
Make sure to watch the Google Io from yesterday to see what Google actually is about.

Apple makes high quality luxury hardware and that's it.

Google tries to save the world (android, maps, secure by default, 24x7 renewable...). Of course overstating a little bit as google is still just a company who earns money

[+] Shorel|3 years ago|reply
My Xiaomi phone still has them. It is one of the reasons I bought it.
[+] stodor89|3 years ago|reply
Apple is the only company with some sort of vision for the smartphone. My issue is, I find their vision disgusting.
[+] yc-kraln|3 years ago|reply
Somehow, my Zenfone 8 has a headphone jack and nevertheless is IP68 and thin.

These days, I buy phones based on whether or not they're suppored by Lineage, and if they have a headphone jack or not. That's it; that's the criteria.

[+] rajnathani|3 years ago|reply
It's interesting that marketing teams at large companies sort of inherently lack long-term marketing consistency. Or at least, had the product team been in sync with the marketing team about their long-term vision of removing the headphone jack, then maybe they wouldn't have marketed the "roast".