[roganartu]

I’m sorry but this is a dangerously inaccurate summary of Australia’s gun laws and how they are perceived socially. For starters, private gun owners are not actually allowed to use their firearms in self defence. There have been some cases previously where people have and have been acquitted on grounds of self-defence, but if you use a gun on a person you are 100% going to be arrested, jailed, and charged, at which point you better hope you have a good lawyer.

It’s also extremely uncommon for even farmers to have shotguns. They fall under a different, much much more restrictive category (similar to pistols) and are generally not used by farmers who instead opt for bolt action rifles for pest control.

Additionally, it’s worth pointing out that the idea that a country needs a “well armed militia” is very American (or at least, not at all Australian). None of my Australian friends or family want this, and everyone I know is very happy with our gun laws and the social safety they afford us. I’m sure there are some Australians that disagree, but the widespread sentiment is overwhelmingly that Howard did the right thing in rapidly enacting sweeping gun reform after the Port Arthur massacre.

Your assertion that a non-primary-producer can only own a bolt action rifle is also incorrect. Anyone with the appropriate license can own a pistol or a shotgun, the requirements around frequency of sporting event participation are just much greater for these categories of firearm as we consider them much more dangerous to society and so (reasonably, imo) dramatically limit their ownership to only those who actively and responsibly use them for sport.

Finally, the scrutiny a person comes under for owning a bolt (or lever) action rifle is fairly minor. You need a safe place to store it (the state provides requirements, and the police will inspect it before granting the license, and also perform occasional spot checks), you need to be a member of a sport shooting association, and you need to participate in one shooting competition that is certified by that association per year. This is easy to do for someone who wants to own a gun in the city, as the only legitimate reason to own a gun for a non-primary-producer is sport shooting at a shooting range anyway. The most valid complaint I can think of is regarding this is that the storage requirements make it practically impossible for a renter to own a gun, as the safe must be either really heavy (making it very expensive) or permanently affixed to the building (a modification most Australian rental agreements forbid).

[halffaday]

The Australian government also put its citizens in concentration camps with total impunity last year. That sort of outrageous mistreatment of lower and middle class people is not feasible outside of a few cities in the United States. Cheran in Mexico is also a good example of how resisting state-mandated civilian disarmament can discourage the abuse of citizens by powerful organizations.

[roganartu]

There are plenty of ways to describe the Australian federal government’s handling of Covid, but to use the term “concentration camps” is unnecessarily inflammatory and not a sentiment that is shared by Australians.

The problems were not in the overall handling in general (in fact, everyone I know is ok with the way they locked down, at least the first 12-18 months or so anyway), but in the lack of a coherent plan for how to exit that situation. The federal government abdicated it’s responsibility, relying heavily on states to handle things that require more scale and coordination than they are capable of.

These discussions would be more productive if you didn’t project your country’s desire for “freedom” at all costs onto those that make different social trade offs. We are not oppressed by a nation state and we don’t need you to liberate us, thanks.

[pmalynin]

My friend, we in America have the most incarcerated individuals let’s not talk about outrages mistreatment of the lower classes.

[kelnos]

Not sure what this has to do with Australia's gun laws. Talk about whataboutism. A country can have sensible laws in one sphere, but do awful things in another.

And as the sibling points out, the US's track record for incarceration (and concentration camps) isn't exactly great either.