For those that haven’t checked it out the ideas behind urbit are really interesting, it’s the first attempt I’ve seen to get us out of the local maximum of centralized web services we’re trapped in where success is among the potential outcomes (most attempts are destined to fail because they don’t tackle the underlying issues from first principles). I think it could really work and I’m convinced urbit or something like it eventually will - the ideas are correct.
Jack Dorsey’s “web5”, Dan Romero’s Farcaster all touch on a lot of these concepts - people are starting to come around to the same conclusions (which is good!) - urbit had just taken a boil the ocean approach on a bet that we need to rethink the stack from first principles so we can control certain assumptions to reduce complexity and make some of the problems in modern computing easier to handle.
Finding it really felt like the first time I started playing with Linux for me. It revived a lot of the dreams of the 90s web and what it could be, people being able to run their own nodes in a way that could actually work.
To do that you have to solve the identity problem, you have to reduce the complexity of running the system, and you have to have the internet front and center when building the OS.
The dream of a truly decentralized web from the 90s failed and it failed for reasons that make sense given the constraints of the technology we use. I think urbit is a way out.
I've looked into it and it sounds like a ton of pretentious crap. How is this any better than IPFS, I2P, tor onion services, or Gnunet?
It's nice that it helped introduce you to linux though.
You make a few good points about usability, but I don't think the internet was designed to be a distributed network from the get-go. https://secushare.org/broken-internet
It's in no way interesting. It's a bunch of old, bad ideas duct taped together and renamed with nonsense words to both obfuscate what they're doing and establish an in-group language just as cults do.
> We’re running a cohort class of App School to teach you how to terraform Mars
Why is the Urbit project completely unable to produce anything approachable, set any practical goals, or explain anything in terms of existing approaches?
It seems like an extreme level of hubris to think that Urbit is so far beyond the current level of technology that everything must be started from scratch. I've bounced off Urbit because of the tech and documentation a number of times now, and I would like to think I'm capable of understanding and appreciating the need for this sort of thing.
Urbit docs and app dev has come an amazing long way in the last 10 years. You don't see many projects with the staying power of urbit, despite being constantly called a cult poo-poo'd every time it comes up on HN.
Feature not a bug. They day HN gives any positive feedback on it, I'll have to re-assess.
This looks like an announcement for an event that hasn't happened yet and those are generally off topic on HN, since they aren't interesting in their own right.
Just in case you're wondering whether Urbit is worth looking into, let me save you the trouble: no. Just, no. Urbit is a cult. All of its artifacts are deliberately obfuscated in order to instill a sense of community into those who climb the learning curve. It has no actual technical merit whatsoever.
Here is a clue:
> We’re running a cohort class of App School to teach you how to terraform Mars.
No, you are not going to terraform Mars by writing apps. No one is going to terraform Mars. Terraforming Mars is a pipe dream. We humans can't even get our act together enough to stop ourselves from de-terraforming earth. [UPDATE: turns out they are not actually talking about teraforming Mars. But the invention of a private language to identify the in-group is one the hallmarks of a cult.]
Sorry if this is rant-y but I've been watching Urbit since its inception and I am absolutely dismayed at how many otherwise smart people are wasting their time on it.
Who's wasting time? I've memorized a number of text passages using one user's app for cloze completion. I've kept track of names and faces of users I've met IRL using the pals app. I've had an uncountable number of awesome and fulfilling conversations with other users of the platform, and no, I don't feel like I am in a cult because I can leave for weeks at a time and return at my leisure.
It's called "calm computing" for a reason - the technology serves your peace of mind, not some corporation's ad revenue.
Maybe so, but could you please stop posting unsubstantive and/or flamebait comments to HN? It looks like you've been doing it repeatedly and that's definitely not what this site is for.
Fortunately you've also posted substantive comments, so this should be easy to fix. If you'd stick to the latter and drop the former, we'd be grateful.
gonehome|3 years ago
Jack Dorsey’s “web5”, Dan Romero’s Farcaster all touch on a lot of these concepts - people are starting to come around to the same conclusions (which is good!) - urbit had just taken a boil the ocean approach on a bet that we need to rethink the stack from first principles so we can control certain assumptions to reduce complexity and make some of the problems in modern computing easier to handle.
Finding it really felt like the first time I started playing with Linux for me. It revived a lot of the dreams of the 90s web and what it could be, people being able to run their own nodes in a way that could actually work.
To do that you have to solve the identity problem, you have to reduce the complexity of running the system, and you have to have the internet front and center when building the OS.
The dream of a truly decentralized web from the 90s failed and it failed for reasons that make sense given the constraints of the technology we use. I think urbit is a way out.
An old blog post (from 2010!) that really digs into the details: https://moronlab.blogspot.com/2010/01/urbit-functional-progr...
cowtools|3 years ago
It's nice that it helped introduce you to linux though.
You make a few good points about usability, but I don't think the internet was designed to be a distributed network from the get-go. https://secushare.org/broken-internet
gaze|3 years ago
vorpalhex|3 years ago
danpalmer|3 years ago
Why is the Urbit project completely unable to produce anything approachable, set any practical goals, or explain anything in terms of existing approaches?
It seems like an extreme level of hubris to think that Urbit is so far beyond the current level of technology that everything must be started from scratch. I've bounced off Urbit because of the tech and documentation a number of times now, and I would like to think I'm capable of understanding and appreciating the need for this sort of thing.
lukestiles|3 years ago
jiscariot|3 years ago
Feature not a bug. They day HN gives any positive feedback on it, I'll have to re-assess.
dang|3 years ago
lisper|3 years ago
Here is a clue:
> We’re running a cohort class of App School to teach you how to terraform Mars.
No, you are not going to terraform Mars by writing apps. No one is going to terraform Mars. Terraforming Mars is a pipe dream. We humans can't even get our act together enough to stop ourselves from de-terraforming earth. [UPDATE: turns out they are not actually talking about teraforming Mars. But the invention of a private language to identify the in-group is one the hallmarks of a cult.]
Sorry if this is rant-y but I've been watching Urbit since its inception and I am absolutely dismayed at how many otherwise smart people are wasting their time on it.
0x732202|3 years ago
It's called "calm computing" for a reason - the technology serves your peace of mind, not some corporation's ad revenue.
julianeon|3 years ago
To people who disagree and think it’s useful: I’m willing to listen - in fact I came here looking for your comments.
Please post a link to a useful service of app that Urbit provides now, that’s what many of us are waiting to see.
NealEDavis|3 years ago
vorpalhex|3 years ago
A sceptical followers perspective on Urbit would be interesting to read and probably something worth archiving.
gaze|3 years ago
dang|3 years ago
Fortunately you've also posted substantive comments, so this should be easy to fix. If you'd stick to the latter and drop the former, we'd be grateful.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
UmbertoNoEco|3 years ago