FTA:It's not clear why people with high childhood IQs are more likely to use illegal drugs. "We suspect they may be more open to new experiences and are more sensation seeking," says White.
The articles shy away from the elephant in the room which is that the UK and US gvts have a massive legal and propaganda effort to prevent drug use. Indeed the idea that only stupid people do drugs is part of this propaganda.
So maybe its because a higher IQ allows one to realize that the War on Drugs is fucking irrational bullshit and magical thinking and act accordingly (i.e. to choose for oneself).
In a world where broccoli is illegal because its "evil", the headline could have been "High IQ linked to broccoli eating".
Here's a question: is a high IQ linked to smoking? How about alcohol?
Update: So alcohol is also correlated with iq too.
> The lead researcher says he isn't surprised by the findings. "Previous research found for the most part people with high IQs lead a healthy life, but that they are more likely to drink to excess as adults," says James White a psychologist at Cardiff University in the United Kingdom.
What the article doesn't explore is the fact that drugs are expensive; isn't it possible that drug use is correlated with revenue?
The study apparently didn't make a difference between addicts and occasional users.
IQ is also correlated with revenue (probably because that's what it actually measures: socio-economic class), and so that may be a part of the explanation, at least for "recreational" drugs.
"So maybe its because a higher IQ allows one to realize that the War on Drugs is fucking irrational bullshit and magical thinking and act accordingly (i.e. to choose for oneself)."
I think it has more to do with the fact that people with higher IQs don't feel like they are a part of regular society and it's a way to cope with it.
Many people that are depressed use illegal and legal drugs to make themselves feel better. I have a feeling there is also a higher level of depression in people with high IQs as well.
I would be interested to see if the same holds true with people that have lower than average IQs.
"The articles shy away from the elephant in the room which is that the UK and US gvts have a massive legal and propaganda effort to prevent drug use"
Illegal drugs aren't good or healthy for you. I feel like you will most likely spread propaganda in the opposite direction and it's just as bad.
I think it might be because, as Wil Shipley pointed out
http://blog.wilshipley.com/2007/12/on-saying-goodbye.html
(some) smart people tend to be miserable because their wits let them skip the mechanisms put in place in human mind to prevent it from feeling miserable despite actually being so.
As someone who suffers from ADHD-PI, I can't help but wonder a possible co-relation here. Before my occasional marijuana use a few years ago, I wasn't aware of my concentration issues. Like many others, I thought I was just lazy or unmotivated. When smoking marijuana for the first time, my friends lay around unmotivated and relaxed while I couldn't stop thinking about working on one of my many "one day" projects. This eventually lead me to getting tested for ADHD. Now I am on pharma, but the benefits appear the same.
I feel like drugs helped me realize a lot about myself. While I am not so sure IQ is a reliable measurement, I can definitely say I can handle a lot more information and make good use of that information much better than I had ever before.
I've done some research on brain wave activity and dopamine receptors/activity. It seems that people with ADHD tend to have misaligned brain wave activity and stimulants manage to align this activity up to a point. My theory, from my own experiences, is that there is an optimal brain wave frequency and people with ADHD are suffering from dopamine deficiency that skews below optimal frequency, and too much dopamine activity skews above optimal frequency. Further, I've noted that those who experience drugs as a depressant tend to have normal dopamine activity whereas those who experience drugs as a stimulant appear to have low dopamine activity. It's just a wild theory with no medical evidence - I'm just trying to understand the pattern. I would love to hear others chime in here and adjust my theory as necessary.
I've been told that alcohol or marijuana makes one drowsy or lazy. For me, it stimulates - until a point - then I also become drowsy and lazy. This is where I believe I've gone past optimal dopamine activity. For the average person with normal dopamine activity, passing this threshold seems to happen much sooner.
I've noted that those who experience drugs as a depressant tend to have normal dopamine activity whereas those who experience drugs as a stimulant appear to have low dopamine activity
I think in general you are going to find depressants will act like depressants, and stimulants will act as stimulants. In your theory, focus on the inflection point where (e.g. alcohol) a depressant acts as a stimulant. It is a stimulant for all people when consumed in the right amount, though it also depends on other factors. Some days alcohol will make me stay up all night, some days it will put me to sleep in 15 minutes.
I can't take a newsflash seriously if they don't even link to the original study.
Are the socioeconomic levels of these higher IQ individuals controlled? How exactly did they select their sample for the study? And they mentioned marijuana, cocaine, heroine in one breath, as though those are the same drug. Surely different population groups use those drugs to different extents.
EDIT: The abstract is available from the publishing journal in the following link. The full text was unfortunately not available without a subscription of some form.
It’s a shame the article itself is not freely available, but even the published abstract gives some interesting details that the CNN report didn’t mention.
In particular the abstract makes it clear that the measured associated is independent of life-course socioeconomic position.
Actually a quick search of Google Scholar throws up a number of papers on this topic, most of which seem to confirm the association reported here.
This one http://personal.lse.ac.uk/KANAZAWA/pdfs/RGP2010.pdf looks quite interesting: “The Savanna-IQ Interaction Hypothesis suggests that more intelligent individuals may be more likely to acquire and espouse evolutionarily novel values than less intelligent individuals. Consumption of alcohol, tobacco, and drugs is evolutionarily novel, so the Savanna-IQ Interaction Hypothesis would predict that more intelligent individuals are more likely to consume these substances.”
My guess is that this phenomenon has something to do with boredom (as mentioned in the article). I have never studied IQ, but when I reflect on the IQ tests that I take I realize that a big part of my problem solving process involves rapidly imagining potential solutions and mentally "testing" them to see if they make sense.
Does anyone know what this type of thinking is called?
Anyways, that's how I think when I'm trying to solve a puzzle. I notice that the hard part is not in testing my imagined hypotheses, but in hypothesis generation. Where am I going with this? Imagination. I've noticed that my ability to rapidly imagine different scenarios is a key part of my ability to solve difficult problems. There are other components, like working memory, logic, etc, but imagination plays a big role. At least for me.
If what is true for me is true in general it could mean that people who are more inclined to imagine complex alternative worlds in their heads are also more likely to enjoy the "out of the ordinary" mental states provided by drugs and alcohol.
It’s kind of odd that the article doesn’t look at the social aspects. Different social groups have different patterns in and attitudes towards drug consumption. These patterns change over time. Note, research is based on findings from 1970. In 1970, drugs might still be tied to counterculture, and thus to people with on avarage higher education (and on avarage higher iq), while in 2011 drug use seems to appear in much more diverse layers of society…
Could it be that the smarter/brighter individuals are bored (not stimulated/challenged enough) by the average education system and so they find a release elsewhere with drugs, as something that will make the boredom less painful?
high IQ is defined as a score between 107 and 158.
That means around 70% of the high IQ people in this study had an IQ between 107 and 120. Over 90% had an IQ less than 130. Don't go out and assume that smoking a joint will help you get into Mensa.
Nothing is said about adult IQ. It only says that kids with higher IQ end up using drugs (I can see that, it's depressing being intelligent). But somehow I doubt that adult drug users have higher IQ as well.
Interesting, but this part is pretty weasily: "...told by parents and teachers that intelligent people didn't use drugs. Turns out, the adults _may_ have been wrong." As an unqualified statement, it is definitely wrong, and was demonstrably wrong at the time: Carl Sagan, Richard Feynman, Paul Erdos...
I don't think anyone here is arguing that smoking pot (or in general "doing drugs") raises IQ scores... Nor do I see arguing that high IQ scores cause pot use, just that the presence of a high IQ seems to, if the study is to be believed, increase the probability of pot use. Correlations and probabilities are interesting for themselves, and can in fact be used to imply causation. http://www.amazon.com/Causality-Reasoning-Inference-Judea-Pe...
> What's the next study? People with brown eyes do more drugs?
Actually, that needs to be studied! Mutations in the melanocortin-1 receptor (the "red head" gene) affect eye color and also affect sensitivity to opioids (painkillers).
That was my first thought when reading the article. There's probably a correlation between high IQ and college attendance, just as there's probably a correlation between college attendance and drug use.
If you have a high IQ then it is that much easy for you,
1)to find what you want (age<20), like drugs
2)and be richer(age>30) than many folks , so you can drink a lot.
Dunno about finding what you want. I have a reasonably high IQ, but I couldn't tell you the first thing about where to find a dealer. I didn't even drink before I turned 21, not for lack of wanting.
Despite the UK being very similar to the US, on a global scale, the relationship between IQ and drug use is not the same across the herring pond. There are relationships between IQ and social indicators that are consistent across time and nations, and this isn't one of those. Whatever is causing this relationship in Britain is cultural - I doubt it's a feature of high intelligence, rather than just Brits who have high IQ.
[+] [-] buff-a|14 years ago|reply
The articles shy away from the elephant in the room which is that the UK and US gvts have a massive legal and propaganda effort to prevent drug use. Indeed the idea that only stupid people do drugs is part of this propaganda.
So maybe its because a higher IQ allows one to realize that the War on Drugs is fucking irrational bullshit and magical thinking and act accordingly (i.e. to choose for oneself).
In a world where broccoli is illegal because its "evil", the headline could have been "High IQ linked to broccoli eating".
Here's a question: is a high IQ linked to smoking? How about alcohol?
Update: So alcohol is also correlated with iq too.
[+] [-] bambax|14 years ago|reply
From the article:
> The lead researcher says he isn't surprised by the findings. "Previous research found for the most part people with high IQs lead a healthy life, but that they are more likely to drink to excess as adults," says James White a psychologist at Cardiff University in the United Kingdom.
What the article doesn't explore is the fact that drugs are expensive; isn't it possible that drug use is correlated with revenue?
The study apparently didn't make a difference between addicts and occasional users.
IQ is also correlated with revenue (probably because that's what it actually measures: socio-economic class), and so that may be a part of the explanation, at least for "recreational" drugs.
[+] [-] brador|14 years ago|reply
I'd be interested in an addition of an "average alcohol consumption" variable to this dataset.
[+] [-] rick888|14 years ago|reply
I think it has more to do with the fact that people with higher IQs don't feel like they are a part of regular society and it's a way to cope with it.
Many people that are depressed use illegal and legal drugs to make themselves feel better. I have a feeling there is also a higher level of depression in people with high IQs as well.
I would be interested to see if the same holds true with people that have lower than average IQs.
"The articles shy away from the elephant in the room which is that the UK and US gvts have a massive legal and propaganda effort to prevent drug use"
Illegal drugs aren't good or healthy for you. I feel like you will most likely spread propaganda in the opposite direction and it's just as bad.
[+] [-] roel_v|14 years ago|reply
Not sure what you are getting at with this question, but according to TFA, yes it is.
(maybe I'm just dense and your point went over my head)
[+] [-] maximusprime|14 years ago|reply
That's not propaganda. It's numbers. Doing drugs = high risk. And it's stupid to take high risks with your body, unless you don't mind dying young.
I've never understood why many 'tech' people are so pro drugs. Why do you need it?
[+] [-] guard-of-terra|14 years ago|reply
Also http://blog.wilshipley.com/2007/03/crazy-talk.html
[+] [-] tomlin|14 years ago|reply
I feel like drugs helped me realize a lot about myself. While I am not so sure IQ is a reliable measurement, I can definitely say I can handle a lot more information and make good use of that information much better than I had ever before.
I've done some research on brain wave activity and dopamine receptors/activity. It seems that people with ADHD tend to have misaligned brain wave activity and stimulants manage to align this activity up to a point. My theory, from my own experiences, is that there is an optimal brain wave frequency and people with ADHD are suffering from dopamine deficiency that skews below optimal frequency, and too much dopamine activity skews above optimal frequency. Further, I've noted that those who experience drugs as a depressant tend to have normal dopamine activity whereas those who experience drugs as a stimulant appear to have low dopamine activity. It's just a wild theory with no medical evidence - I'm just trying to understand the pattern. I would love to hear others chime in here and adjust my theory as necessary.
I've been told that alcohol or marijuana makes one drowsy or lazy. For me, it stimulates - until a point - then I also become drowsy and lazy. This is where I believe I've gone past optimal dopamine activity. For the average person with normal dopamine activity, passing this threshold seems to happen much sooner.
[+] [-] ihnorton|14 years ago|reply
For some background see here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P200
[+] [-] sliverstorm|14 years ago|reply
I think in general you are going to find depressants will act like depressants, and stimulants will act as stimulants. In your theory, focus on the inflection point where (e.g. alcohol) a depressant acts as a stimulant. It is a stimulant for all people when consumed in the right amount, though it also depends on other factors. Some days alcohol will make me stay up all night, some days it will put me to sleep in 15 minutes.
[+] [-] pingu|14 years ago|reply
My experiences very closely match yours, fwiw. I tried Ritalin but wasn't satisfied at all, and am 'back on' weed.
[+] [-] pnathan|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zafka|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hayeah|14 years ago|reply
Are the socioeconomic levels of these higher IQ individuals controlled? How exactly did they select their sample for the study? And they mentioned marijuana, cocaine, heroine in one breath, as though those are the same drug. Surely different population groups use those drugs to different extents.
[+] [-] waterlesscloud|14 years ago|reply
Is that standard? Isn't that about 1/2 to 4 standard deviations on IQ charts? Seems like a wide range.
[+] [-] fourk|14 years ago|reply
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/11/111114221018.ht...
EDIT: The abstract is available from the publishing journal in the following link. The full text was unfortunately not available without a subscription of some form.
http://jech.bmj.com/content/early/2011/10/28/jech-2011-20025...
[+] [-] robinhouston|14 years ago|reply
http://jech.bmj.com/content/early/2011/10/28/jech-2011-20025...
In particular the abstract makes it clear that the measured associated is independent of life-course socioeconomic position.
Actually a quick search of Google Scholar throws up a number of papers on this topic, most of which seem to confirm the association reported here.
This one http://personal.lse.ac.uk/KANAZAWA/pdfs/RGP2010.pdf looks quite interesting: “The Savanna-IQ Interaction Hypothesis suggests that more intelligent individuals may be more likely to acquire and espouse evolutionarily novel values than less intelligent individuals. Consumption of alcohol, tobacco, and drugs is evolutionarily novel, so the Savanna-IQ Interaction Hypothesis would predict that more intelligent individuals are more likely to consume these substances.”
[+] [-] tryitnow|14 years ago|reply
Does anyone know what this type of thinking is called?
Anyways, that's how I think when I'm trying to solve a puzzle. I notice that the hard part is not in testing my imagined hypotheses, but in hypothesis generation. Where am I going with this? Imagination. I've noticed that my ability to rapidly imagine different scenarios is a key part of my ability to solve difficult problems. There are other components, like working memory, logic, etc, but imagination plays a big role. At least for me.
If what is true for me is true in general it could mean that people who are more inclined to imagine complex alternative worlds in their heads are also more likely to enjoy the "out of the ordinary" mental states provided by drugs and alcohol.
[+] [-] sev|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] schrijver|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] itmag|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gcanyon|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] daemin|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Darmani|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] csomar|14 years ago|reply
I stopped here. The title should be "Drug use linked to High IQ". That's completely different.
[+] [-] super_mario|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dubya|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] signalsignal|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shin_lao|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Jach|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Daniel_Newby|14 years ago|reply
Actually, that needs to be studied! Mutations in the melanocortin-1 receptor (the "red head" gene) affect eye color and also affect sensitivity to opioids (painkillers).
[+] [-] adamtmca|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] davidcuddeback|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] keys1234|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] steve-howard|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] porfirio|14 years ago|reply
In America, the relationship between drug use and high IQ is small or non-existent: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundament...
(Someone else linked this earlier)
Despite the UK being very similar to the US, on a global scale, the relationship between IQ and drug use is not the same across the herring pond. There are relationships between IQ and social indicators that are consistent across time and nations, and this isn't one of those. Whatever is causing this relationship in Britain is cultural - I doubt it's a feature of high intelligence, rather than just Brits who have high IQ.