Jack London helped me see how those in control (here the New Orleans owners of enslaved people, the merchants, and/or the politicians—author says many were all 3) would likely respond to an event (including disease) so as to preserve their own position and then claim that as moral and scientific:
In The Iron Heel, referring to owners of northern factories with child labor and other ghastly working conditions, Jack London wrote,
“When they want to do a thing, in business of course, they must wait till there arises in their brains, somehow, a religious, or ethical, or scientific, or philosophic, concept that the thing is right. And then they go ahead and do it, unwitting that one of the weaknesses of the human mind is that the wish is parent to the thought.“
I try to stay personally vigilant in remembering how my mind can trick me this way. The trick works in so very many contexts.
> But they counter the pushback by essentially denying disease, both as an epidemiological reality and as a social reality too. Increasingly by the 1850s, you see people saying, well, yellow fever is not that big of a problem. It’s not that serious of an illness, and anybody who’s temperate and well-mannered and courageous and manly will survive. It only kills the immoral, the drunk, the unfortunate. Your cousin in Philadelphia or your niece in Sligo who thinks of New Orleans as a “necropolis,” they don’t know what they’re talking about, these northern critiques of New Orleans’s health situation are a proxy for abolitionists attacking slavery
Yes, this is an incredible article. Historians must weep at our idiocy. We are exactly as those New Orleans rich slave owners were then, such a terrible synchrony between yellow fever and covid. We are just the same, even though we think we are different. So similar, even to the call to be manly and not let covid keep you down.
> It’s actually a miraculous demonstration of just how effective martial law can be in stopping diseases, I guess, and how effective quarantine could be when properly instituted and rigorously upheld.
In case of endemic disease the question is "Do I want to live under martial law till the rest of my life?"
It was never martial law in the US. It was make basic sensible choices like wearing masks and if possible not being in large groups to reduce the chance of covid. Then it later became all about macho people ignoring it. Imagine if covid had come during Bush 1 or Bush 2.
Regarding Trump and his immunocapitalist behavior: I understand the position of the "Great Barrington Declaration" would be to make a majority of the population "acclimated" as soon as possible. Only lock down the vulnerable population. This could be effective because covid is not as deadly as yellow fever and not dangerous to a significant portion of the population. Setting aside all the Fauci political piss matching, I do wonder what might have happened with that approach.
> Regarding Trump and his immunocapitalist behavior: I understand the position of the "Great Barrington Declaration" would be to make a majority of the population "acclimated" as soon as possible. Only lock down the vulnerable population. This could be effective because covid is not as deadly as yellow fever and not dangerous to a significant portion of the population.
Hindsight 2020 (pun intended)
> I do wonder what might have happened with that approach.
2022 would have happened in 2020: we would have saved 2 years.
Right now in 2022, as most people have stopped caring, don't wear mask etc, I'd say the majority of the population has acclimated, while a minority is trying to hold back and use FUD for favor their preferences.
>And I always think of that picture as an image of the 21st century’s first immunocapitalist.
I make the opposite argument - while huge numbers of ordinary citizens were kept under effective house arrest (or other restrictions), the wealthy and powerful became ever more wealthy and powerful while no-one was looking. We were turned into obedient, house-bound consumers of social media, low-grade TV, and mail-order rubbish.
That’s pretty dark. Immunocapitalism is a new word for me but we have a much longer history of using disease in North America… at least all the way back to the first Europeans coming across the ocean. Even with all of our technology and knowledge, our species is still easily recognized as the same thing that existed 1000s of years ago. True change is hard.
Those Europeans were themselves on the receiving end of foreign disease when the Black Death was brought to Europe from somewhere in Asia. Strange how for some plagues, their foreign origin is emphasized, while for others it is ignored, despite how neither were introduced deliberately.
A maturing society is hard, as those exploiting the immature really want to maintain their profits, while all the wannabe yes-people around them support their systematic abuse in the hopes they'll be in the driver seat 'soon'.
‘We gave public health measures a half-assed try, and they only seemed moderately effective’ is not data that shows ‘just how ineffectual masks and the vaccines are.’
Remember that the goals of most pandemic measures were to keep case levels low enough to keep hospitals functional. During periods with high regional covid caseloads, hospital capacity continues to be severely impacted. The ‘let it rip’ approach would have had far worse consequences.
"vaccine effectiveness (VE) was 61% for two doses against COVID-19-associated hospitalizations; VE increased to between 85%–92% after receipt of a third/booster dose."
"COVID-19 vaccines remain our single most important tool to protect people against serious illness, hospitalization, and death."
[+] [-] reader_x|3 years ago|reply
Jack London helped me see how those in control (here the New Orleans owners of enslaved people, the merchants, and/or the politicians—author says many were all 3) would likely respond to an event (including disease) so as to preserve their own position and then claim that as moral and scientific:
In The Iron Heel, referring to owners of northern factories with child labor and other ghastly working conditions, Jack London wrote,
“When they want to do a thing, in business of course, they must wait till there arises in their brains, somehow, a religious, or ethical, or scientific, or philosophic, concept that the thing is right. And then they go ahead and do it, unwitting that one of the weaknesses of the human mind is that the wish is parent to the thought.“
I try to stay personally vigilant in remembering how my mind can trick me this way. The trick works in so very many contexts.
[+] [-] swayvil|3 years ago|reply
And yes, the victim will happily accomodate any inconsistencies between the solution and reality/morality/etc.
The takeaway is : reason serves desire.
[+] [-] ZeroGravitas|3 years ago|reply
> But they counter the pushback by essentially denying disease, both as an epidemiological reality and as a social reality too. Increasingly by the 1850s, you see people saying, well, yellow fever is not that big of a problem. It’s not that serious of an illness, and anybody who’s temperate and well-mannered and courageous and manly will survive. It only kills the immoral, the drunk, the unfortunate. Your cousin in Philadelphia or your niece in Sligo who thinks of New Orleans as a “necropolis,” they don’t know what they’re talking about, these northern critiques of New Orleans’s health situation are a proxy for abolitionists attacking slavery
[+] [-] rnk|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] helge9210|3 years ago|reply
In case of endemic disease the question is "Do I want to live under martial law till the rest of my life?"
[+] [-] rnk|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] heedspin|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|3 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] csdvrx|3 years ago|reply
Hindsight 2020 (pun intended)
> I do wonder what might have happened with that approach.
2022 would have happened in 2020: we would have saved 2 years.
Right now in 2022, as most people have stopped caring, don't wear mask etc, I'd say the majority of the population has acclimated, while a minority is trying to hold back and use FUD for favor their preferences.
[+] [-] fdewrewrewf|3 years ago|reply
I make the opposite argument - while huge numbers of ordinary citizens were kept under effective house arrest (or other restrictions), the wealthy and powerful became ever more wealthy and powerful while no-one was looking. We were turned into obedient, house-bound consumers of social media, low-grade TV, and mail-order rubbish.
[+] [-] mbrodersen|3 years ago|reply
Nothing forces you to be a consumer of social media, low-grade TV or mail-order rubbish. Take responsibility for your own actions.
[+] [-] imoverclocked|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tarakat|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bsenftner|3 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|3 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] steve76|3 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] unnamed76ri|3 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] jameshart|3 years ago|reply
Remember that the goals of most pandemic measures were to keep case levels low enough to keep hospitals functional. During periods with high regional covid caseloads, hospital capacity continues to be severely impacted. The ‘let it rip’ approach would have had far worse consequences.
[+] [-] jodrellblank|3 years ago|reply
https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2022/s0715-COVID-VE.html
"vaccine effectiveness (VE) was 61% for two doses against COVID-19-associated hospitalizations; VE increased to between 85%–92% after receipt of a third/booster dose."
"COVID-19 vaccines remain our single most important tool to protect people against serious illness, hospitalization, and death."
[+] [-] swayvil|3 years ago|reply
[deleted]