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knok_off | 3 years ago

Could you elaborate or link something, I'm interested as I thought it was fairly good.

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Groxx|3 years ago

It has stuff like E2E encryption, but that essentially just works on the message contents. Who sends messages where is visible to any server owner that receives the data (basically: host of the user account or room, or any public room). (there may be wrinkles to this, but in a broad sense it matches Matrix's metadata exposure)

Which makes it pretty much exactly the same as, e.g., XMPP. Or nearly[1] any federated chat system, past, present, or future. It's not privacy-oriented, by design, because privacy oriented and able to connect N independent implementations which are able to protect themselves from abuse are almost completely at odds with each other.

In that sense: yes, it's a privacy disaster. It is not and never will be Signal. But in another sense, no, it's just what happens when you build a usable federated chat system - convenience costs privacy. There are "free" and "cheap" ways they could improve it, and some improvements have been trickling steadily, but the fundamental feature-set prevents it from ever being what most privacy people would call "good".

[1]: there are some exceptions, but generally speaking they are making extreme tradeoffs somewhere. E.g. inability to stop spammers because you can't see senders -> no large hosts will ever exist because it'll hemorrhage money, so it's practically just a P2P network. Some of which do have interesting privacy feature-sets, but often suffer with discoverability and connection reliability.

hammyhavoc|3 years ago

No large hosts is by design. Too many digital eggs in one digital basket is everything that's wrong with SaaS these days.

badrabbit|3 years ago

Just the stuff from your user agent that shows up under device details is not good.