Talks about how he feels to smart for the UI, but doesn't bother looking up the substantial body of research explaining why it's useful to any user (novice to expert).
It's 2011. I thought HCI had some respect. Stuff like this seriously makes my throat clench a little bit.
Half the complaints cover things that help your subconscious have a better idea of what's going on, from z-order to spatial changes in windows. The other half cover adding more useful context to a window. Without the dressing, the address book is a list pane and a few text boxes. If it and other windows (say, iTunes) were plain controls-in-windows, you'll have to spend extra time figuring out which one is which.
But, this story isn't about UIs. He's building himself as a curmudgeon character (have a look at the author page). It's a new sort of mid-level ludditery. BeOS? Haiku? Fucking really? There are at least a half-dozen changes you can make to a stock ubuntu config (mostly turning off unity) fit that mold today. But it's not about getting somewhere he prefers, it's about complaining.
I feel like I am completely opposite of this dude. He hates dropshadows around windows. He hates the minimize-to-dock effect in OSX, saying it "wastes time". I just hit the minimize button and it took all of one second - one second in which my hindbrain was given a strong visual cue that I am switching out of one context. I use it regularly and I've never stopped to think about it.
I mean, a lot of the stuff he's saying feels "condescending"? It's all stuff that has preferences. You can change the size of icons. I mostly navigate my Mac's filesystem in the 3-column view.
He's bemoaning the fact that the OSX menu fades out when you leave it versus the System 3ish menus that just popped in and out. And honestly I can't say I notice the fade consciously either - but subconsciously I like it. It's instantly responsive when I ask for it, and it's got a nice slow visual effect as I'm done with it.
But then again, for all that I'm an artist with a bent towards minimalism, the OSX address book really doesn't bug me either. I quit using the iPad's calendar - but that's because it had a design directly taken from the revised OSX one, with that unusable-on-tablets row of tiny buttons for changing weeks. I really don't see supposed horrid UI sins like Calendar's torn page, it's just chrome that's vanished into the background.
He basically seems to be saying that all modern polish is crap and we should be happy with the looks that were pretty much required back in the 90s due to limitations. He disses new experiments like Metro as well, but really doesn't manage to articulate what his dream UI would be. Besides "oh god I wish I could use BeOS". Which looks... god, I feel like I'm using my Amiga when I look at that screenshot. Which I loved at the time but I've moved on.
Where do you draw the line when it comes to distracting details in UI? Is the level of detail in current Apple products perfect? Should they move towards more skeuomorphic designs or more typographical designs?
Regarding the transitions - often times an animated transition is used to mask program latency. Unminimizing a program can use an animation to mask the time it needs to possibly read from an on-disk cache. The use of them is especially evident on phones, which make heavy use of transition effects. Swoop ins and other animations will often give the program around 500 milliseconds before it has to be responsive. It gives the illusion of things working faster than they actually are. With larger memory stores and SSD's becoming more common, many of these animations are no longer absolutely necessary, but on older systems they help tremendously for the user experience.
I can't believe The Verge, whose tech reviews have quickly become among the very best on the web, would post such an idiotic, pointless rant.
He doesn't like the genie effect in OS X. So change it! I did! It almost seems like he thinks that UIs should change themselves to suit him, rather than the other way around.
These interfaces have millions and millions of users, many of which are by no means experts with a computer, and may even only use it sparingly. The design has to be universal, and these cues make the interface that much easier to use across the general userbase.
Saying you don't like the interface because 'its condescending' is like saying you don't like your suit because it doesn't fit perfectly on you. The solution is to just go get it tailored, because that suit wasn't custom made to fit you. I also use win7 classic theme because I prefer it over the bells and whistles in Aero.
There's really no need to complain about what companies ship as the default. That's just the setting they feel will work best for the average user. Fine, you're not the average user. That's why they build settings to allow you to change shit. So fucking change it and you're fine.
> There's really no need to complain about what companies ship as the default. That's just the setting they feel will work best for the average user. Fine, you're not the average user. That's why they build settings to allow you to change shit. So fucking change it and you're fine.
I agree. This is what made the post really annoying for me. If you are really an expert user, in almost every case he mentioned; you can change the UI settings to suit your tastes.
That's why I hate OSX. I have plenty of real live humans to condescend to me in my life, I don't need inanimate machines to also treat my like I'm too stupid to live.
I've only just moved from XP to windows 7, so we'll see how that goes. So far not too many complaints, but you can definitely tell that they were pulling heavily from the OSX experience, much to my sadness.
It's possible to make animated GIFs that use more than 256 colors per frame (although they'll probably be bigger than a format designed for that sort of thing).
I love emacs, precisely because it doesn't use any space reminding me what it can do, but I also love having reminders of what all the other software I'm forced to use in my day-to-day life (but not as often) can do.
In the end, though, I'm much more irritated with OS X's crappy file manager than I am with anything quite so broad as OS X being "too condescending".
I'm wary of the recommendations in this article. If someone repeating a fact you've heard elsewhere makes you feel patronized, you're an outlier. The greater portion of your users, unless you're in a niche field, will need that repetition. Moreover, if we live long enough to need that help ourselves, we can count ourselves lucky.
No. I haven’t used Windows 7, but I always switched XP/Vista to the classic theme because it takes up less space (fits a lot more minimized windows in the task bar, etc.), is less distracting, and makes it easier to judge colors in images or graphics (the big areas of blue really messes with fine color judgement). I also reverted to the “classic” start menu, switched the control panel wizard off, cut out all the auto helper doodads in MS Office, etc.
Speaking as someone who has always hated everything Windows stands for, I assure you there was no nostalgia involved
I have to disagree very strongly with one of his suggestions: the differently sized buttons. The buttons have different sizes because they're used at different rates. You make things that are more often used bigger because it makes your interface faster: see Fitts's law.
Am I the only one who agrees? Obviously going back to something like BeOS is a little extreme, but fact is OS X Lion made things worse. I don't need LaunchPad or AirDrop or the AppStore, oh and thanks for hiding my Library folder and reversing my scroll direction, wtf. Now I'm looking at Windows 8 and the only thing that comes to my mind is: Why the hell would I want to install that on my PC? Tell me. My PC is not an iPhone! If this trend continues we all end up using Ubuntu without Unity sooner or later.
You know, that's the beauty of Linux: you can have your computer however you want it. Not only do you have more options--Unity, Gnome, KDE, LXDE, XMonad...etc--but they are also all more configurable. I really think most people would benefit from switching to Linux.
[my UI opinion] I find Ribbon to be extremely helpful both in having more functions available at a glance, and for teaching keyboard shortcuts (for example, hold alt in Word 2010).
Oh - a part of OSX that I find condescending is the inability to alt-tab between browser windows wie Windows(z.B. two Chrome windows, each with their own set of tabs). Is there a shortcut I'm missing?
I do miss the older NeXTSTEP interface, and am finding Lion to be a real pain at times (e.g. Duplicate instead of Save As). It seems like adding the Launcher has also been a pain (no real improvement over just putting the App folder in the Dock set to List, Folder, Sort by Name). Some stuff is nicer like the Mission Control.
I often think of what OS X would be like if Apple assumed only Pro users would use it and everyone else would be on iOS.
"I often think of what OS X would be like if Apple assumed only Pro users would use it and everyone else would be on iOS."
It's an interesting thought but quite feasible. Open up any Apple "Pro" app like Logic Studio, Aperture or (more recently) Final Cut Pro X. The look and feel is quite different than the rest of OS X. Things are smaller and far less intuitive (they are hidden away). Apple knows that amateurs will stick with Garageband, iPhoto and iMovie, all of which feature large, intuitive interfaces. I like that they are not afraid to make their "Pro" apps heavy-duty.
This is the foundation of my primary complaint with Apple's interfaces: by constantly assuming that you don't know how to use a computer, they make it impossible to learn. We here are all fine with our OSX boxes, because we already know how to use computers, but there are millions of people out there that started knowing nothing and have ended up knowing nothing.
Is it a bad thing if you don't need to know anything?
The article's comment about the Ribbon in Office/Windows 8 "assuming [you] don't know how to use a menu, a key command, or a honest-to-goodness toolbar" is silly. Menus and toolbars make things more hidden, more modal, less discoverable, and key commands are still there. What's the problem?
I've found the OSX alternates between being overly childish (the shiny dock) and hiding functionality behind overly complex "shortcuts". You want to copy a section of the screen to the clipboard? Why, that's ⌘^⇧4! Never mind that my keyboard lacks symbols on the keys, so I'm left guessing what rubbish like ⌥ means.
That command has been around since OS 9 and probably before. Have similar commands with the same level of utility (copying a selectable section of the screen) and the same keystroke been around in Windows/X11 for that length of time?
Would you also suggest that vi change it's commands so that they're easier to use?
Historical inertia matters, especially with muscle memory things like key combos.
That functionality is by no means hidden behind the keyboard shortcut. You can just as easily use /Applications/Utilities/Grab.app (whose app icon is a window behind scissors) and choose the "Selection" option from the "Capture" menu.
This whole article just comes off as tech hipsterism to me. It's like being nostalgic for cassette tapes and conveniently forgetting how bad they sounded, how quickly they wore out, or how often a tape deck would ruin them for you. Put BeOS, NeXT or Windows Clasisc side-by-side with Windows 7 or OSX and let people choose which one they prefer. My guess is the vast majority will opt for the more modern, condescending, GUIs because they look nicer and are easier to use. The author should probably check out GNUStep or blackbox if he wants something less mainstream. Is CDE still available?
I have to disagree with your assessment of cassette tape technology. Having overlapped the usage of tapes, CDs, and MP3 players for about 5 years, I can say that yes, tapes sound worse than CDs, but it takes a lot of effort to wear them out, and it was rare that a tape deck would eat your tape.
PS - Skeuomorphism definition: "Strictly speaking it means retaining design features from earlier designs when those features previously had a specific reason for being that way, but do not any longer." - http://madebymany.com/blog/apples-aesthetic-dichotomy
I like the brochure thing. I think it takes into account the human nature of the users and their feelings. It's design that lets us feel connection with the program.
I much rather prefer comfortable textured armchairs than soulless straight chairs of Bauhaus' spirit. I think what Metro and other "minimalists" forget to remember is that computer screen is a canvas, a medium. You shouldn't force user to think like a machine, but rather force the machine to think like a human.
I just wonder when there will be someone who creates usable interfaces for everyday products like microwaves, dvrs, and thermostats. Well I guess Nest (www.nest.com) actually designed a pretty decent thermostat, is this the next revolution?
[+] [-] lallysingh|14 years ago|reply
Talks about how he feels to smart for the UI, but doesn't bother looking up the substantial body of research explaining why it's useful to any user (novice to expert).
It's 2011. I thought HCI had some respect. Stuff like this seriously makes my throat clench a little bit.
Half the complaints cover things that help your subconscious have a better idea of what's going on, from z-order to spatial changes in windows. The other half cover adding more useful context to a window. Without the dressing, the address book is a list pane and a few text boxes. If it and other windows (say, iTunes) were plain controls-in-windows, you'll have to spend extra time figuring out which one is which.
But, this story isn't about UIs. He's building himself as a curmudgeon character (have a look at the author page). It's a new sort of mid-level ludditery. BeOS? Haiku? Fucking really? There are at least a half-dozen changes you can make to a stock ubuntu config (mostly turning off unity) fit that mold today. But it's not about getting somewhere he prefers, it's about complaining.
[+] [-] rhizome|14 years ago|reply
http://img.timeinc.net/time/daily/2009/0903/harvey_0301.jpg
[+] [-] egypturnash|14 years ago|reply
I mean, a lot of the stuff he's saying feels "condescending"? It's all stuff that has preferences. You can change the size of icons. I mostly navigate my Mac's filesystem in the 3-column view.
He's bemoaning the fact that the OSX menu fades out when you leave it versus the System 3ish menus that just popped in and out. And honestly I can't say I notice the fade consciously either - but subconsciously I like it. It's instantly responsive when I ask for it, and it's got a nice slow visual effect as I'm done with it.
But then again, for all that I'm an artist with a bent towards minimalism, the OSX address book really doesn't bug me either. I quit using the iPad's calendar - but that's because it had a design directly taken from the revised OSX one, with that unusable-on-tablets row of tiny buttons for changing weeks. I really don't see supposed horrid UI sins like Calendar's torn page, it's just chrome that's vanished into the background.
He basically seems to be saying that all modern polish is crap and we should be happy with the looks that were pretty much required back in the 90s due to limitations. He disses new experiments like Metro as well, but really doesn't manage to articulate what his dream UI would be. Besides "oh god I wish I could use BeOS". Which looks... god, I feel like I'm using my Amiga when I look at that screenshot. Which I loved at the time but I've moved on.
[+] [-] richcollins|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mietek|14 years ago|reply
Note that the menu does not fade in, since this would actually slow the user down.
Contrast this with certain other implementations.
[+] [-] jcampbell1|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jjcm|14 years ago|reply
Regarding the transitions - often times an animated transition is used to mask program latency. Unminimizing a program can use an animation to mask the time it needs to possibly read from an on-disk cache. The use of them is especially evident on phones, which make heavy use of transition effects. Swoop ins and other animations will often give the program around 500 milliseconds before it has to be responsive. It gives the illusion of things working faster than they actually are. With larger memory stores and SSD's becoming more common, many of these animations are no longer absolutely necessary, but on older systems they help tremendously for the user experience.
[+] [-] grinich|14 years ago|reply
I've always thought that watching a bar fill up is much more satisfying than just a displayed X%.
[+] [-] atacrawl|14 years ago|reply
I can't believe The Verge, whose tech reviews have quickly become among the very best on the web, would post such an idiotic, pointless rant.
He doesn't like the genie effect in OS X. So change it! I did! It almost seems like he thinks that UIs should change themselves to suit him, rather than the other way around.
[+] [-] rohitarondekar|14 years ago|reply
Now here is a novel idea! :)
[+] [-] ricefield|14 years ago|reply
Saying you don't like the interface because 'its condescending' is like saying you don't like your suit because it doesn't fit perfectly on you. The solution is to just go get it tailored, because that suit wasn't custom made to fit you. I also use win7 classic theme because I prefer it over the bells and whistles in Aero.
There's really no need to complain about what companies ship as the default. That's just the setting they feel will work best for the average user. Fine, you're not the average user. That's why they build settings to allow you to change shit. So fucking change it and you're fine.
[+] [-] chaostheory|14 years ago|reply
I agree. This is what made the post really annoying for me. If you are really an expert user, in almost every case he mentioned; you can change the UI settings to suit your tastes.
[+] [-] shallowwater|14 years ago|reply
I've only just moved from XP to windows 7, so we'll see how that goes. So far not too many complaints, but you can definitely tell that they were pulling heavily from the OSX experience, much to my sadness.
[+] [-] ender7|14 years ago|reply
God, I wish there was a widely-supported standard for animated PNGs. Those GIFs look like they're straight out of the 90s.
Yesyesyes, animated GIFs are the devil, but they're shockingly useful for certain tasks such as loading spinners.
[+] [-] antimatter15|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shachaf|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] neutronicus|14 years ago|reply
I love emacs, precisely because it doesn't use any space reminding me what it can do, but I also love having reminders of what all the other software I'm forced to use in my day-to-day life (but not as often) can do.
In the end, though, I'm much more irritated with OS X's crappy file manager than I am with anything quite so broad as OS X being "too condescending".
[+] [-] rhizome|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dennyabraham|14 years ago|reply
We are not necessarily our users.
[+] [-] ugh|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jacobolus|14 years ago|reply
Speaking as someone who has always hated everything Windows stands for, I assure you there was no nostalgia involved
[+] [-] william42|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zyb09|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tikhonj|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] epikur|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] epikur|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] protomyth|14 years ago|reply
I often think of what OS X would be like if Apple assumed only Pro users would use it and everyone else would be on iOS.
[+] [-] Dejital|14 years ago|reply
It's an interesting thought but quite feasible. Open up any Apple "Pro" app like Logic Studio, Aperture or (more recently) Final Cut Pro X. The look and feel is quite different than the rest of OS X. Things are smaller and far less intuitive (they are hidden away). Apple knows that amateurs will stick with Garageband, iPhoto and iMovie, all of which feature large, intuitive interfaces. I like that they are not afraid to make their "Pro" apps heavy-duty.
[+] [-] jbellis|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] js2|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] saulrh|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Rusky|14 years ago|reply
The article's comment about the Ribbon in Office/Windows 8 "assuming [you] don't know how to use a menu, a key command, or a honest-to-goodness toolbar" is silly. Menus and toolbars make things more hidden, more modal, less discoverable, and key commands are still there. What's the problem?
[+] [-] gyardley|14 years ago|reply
If the normals can do everything they want with their computers while still 'knowing nothing', that's a success, not something to grouse about.
[+] [-] underwater|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zdw|14 years ago|reply
Would you also suggest that vi change it's commands so that they're easier to use?
Historical inertia matters, especially with muscle memory things like key combos.
[+] [-] william42|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wtallis|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jsz0|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shard|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tipjoy|14 years ago|reply
PS - Skeuomorphism definition: "Strictly speaking it means retaining design features from earlier designs when those features previously had a specific reason for being that way, but do not any longer." - http://madebymany.com/blog/apples-aesthetic-dichotomy
[+] [-] mannicken|14 years ago|reply
I much rather prefer comfortable textured armchairs than soulless straight chairs of Bauhaus' spirit. I think what Metro and other "minimalists" forget to remember is that computer screen is a canvas, a medium. You shouldn't force user to think like a machine, but rather force the machine to think like a human.
[+] [-] akashkgarg|14 years ago|reply