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New Sony Walkman music player

322 points| rcarmo | 3 years ago |arstechnica.com

398 comments

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[+] mg|3 years ago|reply
I am a huge fan of standalone mp3-players.

So much so, that at some point I made a comparison site for mp3-players. But nobody cared. I made comparison sites for smartphones, laptops and monitors which became quite popular. But for mp3-players, it seemed like I am the only person on planet earth who uses them.

Personally, I still use a Sony Walkman NWZ-E585. For me, that is the best mp3 player ever made. It has a nice form factor, feels very good haptically, the navigation interface is ok, the sound quality is great, the noise cancelling too, and you can access the storage without having to install propriatery software on your computer.

[+] dsr_|3 years ago|reply
The best MP3 (and FLAC) player ever made is the Sansa Clip+ with Rockbox firmware.

$50 when new. Size of a matchbox -- not the car, the small thing that restaurants and bars used to hand out as advertising. MicroSD slot for storage. 20+ hours of playtime, recharged via USB. Appears as a USB Mass Storage device, too. 3.5mm headphone jack. Small 2-part monochrome OLED display. Physical buttons: D-pad, OK, Menu, power, and volume up and down. After a day you don't need to look at it to pause/play, skip a track, change the volume or turn it on and off.

With Rockbox installed (ten minute process), you can play FLAC, use a parametric equalizer, customize the display, change playback speed for audiobooks, and generally do a few dozen things more than the factory firmware.

Rockbox lets you do the same on a large number of devices, but the Clip+ is the best.

[+] omnicognate|3 years ago|reply
You're not alone and neither is the Walkman. Enough people use these things to support a small market that, having not been killed by mobile phones by 2023, isn't going to be. I have an Astell & Kern one.

People may not have been interested in the comparison site because there just aren't that many devices to choose from and the choice comes down more to the sound than features that can be enumerated on a comparison list. Monitors are a mess, with each manufacturer making a zillion variants with cryptic model numbers differing in quantifiable ways. I've actively sought out monitor comparisons, but one for DAPs never occurred to me.

[+] sandreas|3 years ago|reply
THIS is really interesting. There are lots of high quality players nowadays (called Hi-res or DAP), but most of them with very custom / outdated android. Fiio has the ability to sideload android apps with M6 and M9 models, but no open app store.

Most of these high quality players work well for music, some of them can even be used as USB sound card, but none of them has a specific audio book app / handling - except of course Apple iPod.

With android 12 and a size pretty similar to old iPod classic or iPod touch, the NW-A300 Walkman device is very interesting to me. Slightly too large, but it could run Apps like substreamer (with Navidrome) and AudioBookShelf. I really hope the battery can be replaced and it is repairable without too much hazzle.

Similar high quality devices / brands - some of them > 1000$:

  - Sony (NW-A55)
  - Fiio (M6, M9, M11)
  - Hidizs (AP80)
  - Shanling (M2X, M3X)
  - iBasso
  - Astell & Kern
  - Ruizu
  - Hiby (R3)
  - Lootoo
  - Luxury & Precision / L&P
  - Cowon
[+] 28304283409234|3 years ago|reply
What is the software support cycle on this walkman look like? Android 12 is next year's outdated Android.
[+] alkonaut|3 years ago|reply
I'd pay for a thing that does streaming, is much smaller than my phone, and has good physical buttons. I don't want to run or sit in the gym with my huge iphone. But I also don't want to collect files, it has to support all the streaming services and I need to be confident it supports the ones tomorrow as well.
[+] ldng|3 years ago|reply
YES BUTTONS ! (sorry for low quality post but it's been getting tough to find good hardware with buttons ...)
[+] Tsiklon|3 years ago|reply
One thing to note about Sony android players is that the European models have ferocious volume limits; neither having high gain mode, nor the grunt to drive more inefficient headphones in low gain mode.

This appears to be set as a value in a read only database that would require root to remove. A method to acquire root is not known to be available on any of them.

[+] eiiot|3 years ago|reply
Can anyone really name a reason why you would need a standalone MP3 player in 2023? With services like Tidal or even just Spotify it seems like there are so many downsides, with little to no benefits. (Other than maybe owning your own physical music as opposed to relying on a streaming service?)
[+] gppk|3 years ago|reply
My wife has decades of music downloaded from CDs etc. It's just the music she likes, no ads/distractions/faffing about with networks etc. For her commute it works great to have just an MP3 player.

She doesn't want to listen to other music, she likes what she knows, so the benefit of recommendations etc aren't of interest either.

Just one data point for your question :)

[+] rtpg|3 years ago|reply
A standalone MP3 player will tend to have a better interface that is much more responsive. Will be much easier to queue up certain kinds of things with a San Disk Clip Sport than an iPhone. Even just unlocking the phone is a whole thing!

The general thing of futzing around with a home screen, switching apps, having notifications?? When sometimes you just want an mp3 player.

This is my main frustration with these Sony walkmans, is that I'll still have to pay the UI friction cost from it running Android. Would love a device that really sticks to playing music... but I get that that is very hard since you lose streaming optionality.

[+] dagw|3 years ago|reply
you would need a standalone MP3 player in 2023?

Children. I wanted my daughter to be able to listen to music and audio books, I didn't want to buy her a smart phone. Plus you can buy a good enough one for $30-40, so it's not as big a deal if they lose or break it.

I've also considered getting a cheap one with bluetooth for kayaking, so that I can listen to music without having to worry about my phone getting water damaged.

[+] SomeoneOnTheWeb|3 years ago|reply
The very main reason is to have a higher quality audio output. Instead of having a shitty jack a device like this will have a very good DAC & amp, sometimes even a bi-DAC and bi-amp, and also a lot more power to handle bigger headphones.

Globally if you just have a basic pair of headphones / earphones you're better off having a USB-C <=> Jack adapter or a simple bluetooth receiver, but for cases where you want to have a really higher quality source then these will do incredibly well.

[+] LAC-Tech|3 years ago|reply
Sure.

- I can control it completely without looking at a screen.

- It's easier to put my mp3s on there than it is to do that on a phone.

- The battery lasts a lot longer than a phone

- It has a headphone jack

- No crappy software needed, it's just a USB drive as far as my computer is concerned.

[+] jbay808|3 years ago|reply
- Listening to music without needing a web connection

- Very light and easy to keep in a pocket or backpack so I have it with me when I'm out, or to listen to while I cook / do hardware repairs

- No distractions

- Physical buttons means I can replay or skip tracks without looking at it

- Doesn't drain the battery of my smartphone; doesn't need recharging each week

- Has a real working FM radio in it

- Music on my SD card doesn't disappear

- Doesn't need security updates

- Bought it in 2013 and it still works

[+] Xelbair|3 years ago|reply
You already answered your own question, but it's mostly related to higher audio quality and owning your own music, while not being bothered by availability of internet.
[+] Tams80|3 years ago|reply
I don't want to be connected to the Internet all the time, yet still listen to music? Is that not a good enough reason?

And contrary to what many seem to think, cellular data is not always available and data caps are still a thing.

If I sound pissed off, that's because I am. I've seen an ever increasing number of comments like yours that just dismiss things because they don't see the value to them. They then phrase their dismissal as an innocent question (which, honestly, comes across as very condescending).

[+] urbandw311er|3 years ago|reply
Control. Spotify uses dark UX patterns to prevent me curating and exploring a library of Music that I love, instead trying to push artists on me that line their own pockets.
[+] chongli|3 years ago|reply
Working out. Who wants to exercise while carrying a giant phone around with them? A tiny mp3 player is so much better for this!
[+] autoexec|3 years ago|reply
I got one specifically because I love the offline nature of the device. I don't use streaming, and I don't want ads or my device going out to the internet and giving 3rd parties a list of what I listen to and when either.

I also like the idea of a device that does one thing but does it well, unlike a cell phone that tries to be everything for everyone. With a dedicated music player there's no distraction. No notifications, no texts, no calls, no games, no internet. A good music player does everything you need but stays out of your way. A cell phone is designed to demand your attention as often as possible and hold onto it for as long as possible.

[+] TurboHaskal|3 years ago|reply
Mostly power. Phones just don't offer enough to drive demanding headphones or earphones.

There are dongles to address this issue, but they can drain the battery pretty fast. I don't want to drain my phone battery just because I'm listening to music.

If you have an iOS device, having offline music has plenty of limitations. It takes a ton of space that I'd rather save for pictures, videos and apps. And you have to sync your phone with a MacBook which is a hassle if you have more than one.

[+] didntreadarticl|3 years ago|reply
I have an Oakcastle MP200, it cost £20, is tiny and weights nothing. I can use the controls without looking at the screen. Battery lasts seemingly forever. I can take it to the gym, clip it onto my clothes and listen to music without being interrupted by phone notifications and without having to take my phone with me.

Makes me nostalgic for the pre-smartphone era

[+] kleiba|3 years ago|reply
I don't use smart phones because I don't like my every step to be tracked and recorded for an extended period of time by some company.
[+] 112233|3 years ago|reply
I need a standalone music player so that an old person with severe arthritis and poor vision can listen to music and audiobooks.

These devices are not it.

[+] michalstanko|3 years ago|reply
Features like auto-playing next song that Spotify/YouTube/whoever "thinks" I "might" like after a playlist finished playing is driving me mad. (Yes, I know it can be turned off, but it's on by default. Which reminds me, despite being a subscriber, I don't really like Spotify's UI on mobile, nor on the desktop.)
[+] Johnny555|3 years ago|reply
It might be nice for the office. I don’t want to run personal streaming software or load my personal mp3s on my work laptop, and I don’t want to forget my phone on my desk (again) because I was using it as a media player.

But $400 is more than I’d want to pay for it.

[+] ThinkingGuy|3 years ago|reply
I don't own a smartphone, but I'd like to be able to put on headphones and listen to music (from the vast collection on my computer) when I'm traveling, driving, or doing chores.
[+] xd1936|3 years ago|reply
Why have an outdoor grill when you have a stove? Sometimes some things are better at specialized tasks than other things are.
[+] bebna|3 years ago|reply
The way you can't understand that, is the same way I can't understand why people would listen to Spotify.
[+] jccalhoun|3 years ago|reply
I'm cheap and don't pay for an unlimited data plan/
[+] nathias|3 years ago|reply
not everyone uses those services
[+] okasaki|3 years ago|reply
I quite like the look of this device. It's blocky, 16:9 screen, lots of buttons. I would definitely buy a phone or PDA in this format. Actually I wonder if this could function as a decent PDA? I guess it doesn't have any cameras or GPS, which would be nice to have.
[+] yawniek|3 years ago|reply
One of the reasons i liked and bought the xperia pro-i was this design style. Unfortunately it has really bad battery life.
[+] kube-system|3 years ago|reply
The older Sony Xperia phones look at lot like this, but unfortunately the new ones don’t.
[+] francasso|3 years ago|reply
I say it's time to bring back cassette tapes and a new edition of the TPS-L2. If Leica can release a new M6, Sony should release a new TPS-L2
[+] brundolf|3 years ago|reply
It's bizarre to only have 32GB/64GB storage. I remember getting a dedicated music player with 80GB in 2008. Bulk storage seems like it would be one of the few good ways to differentiate these from a smartphone

Maybe I'm just not the target market. They must be doing something right because Hideo Kojima uses one (and frequently tweets pictures of it): https://twitter.com/hideo_kojima_en/status/16147460932707409...

[+] pasdechance|3 years ago|reply
If anyone is wondering, there are a number of choices out there for DAPs and portable music devices.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/hi-res-portable-daps-compari...

I have a Shanling Q1. But, next time around I will probably go with something from Sony. Not out of brand loyalty, but because some of these companies tend to forget to provide updates. I really didn't want an Android device for music. I just wanted something around €100 that could play hi-res music.

To echo what so many others say: all hail the Sansa Clip+ and Rockbox.

[+] pavlov|3 years ago|reply
If it doesn’t play DAT and MiniDisc, is it even a real Sony?
[+] mongol|3 years ago|reply
It is going to be interesting to see if someone figures out other uses for it. Such as voice recording? I would like a recorder with tactile buttons. This could be it, except it looks like it is lacking a microphone?
[+] racl101|3 years ago|reply
Thank you Sony.

I would so buy a standalone music player with buttons and OMG .... a motherfucking 3.5mm headphone jack.

So simple.

I don't get how removing essential things became "progress" and demanded "courage" from the consumer to accept.

[+] donatj|3 years ago|reply
So why buy one of these over an Android phone and an external DAC/Amp?

Also 32gb? That's only a handful of highres audio.

I'm assuming the people buying this kind of thing are the same people buying higher than CD quality audio?

[+] sleepydog|3 years ago|reply
I came across these recently at an electronics store in Japan. These feel really good in my hand; it's not too wide or long, the buttons feel really solid, and its a bit thicker than a phone which makes it easier to hold and makes the buttons bigger. And they are light.

I have no use for an mp3 player, but I would love to have a phone in the same body. It runs android but doing anything other than playing music felt sluggish.

I used the smaller xperia phones for 2 generations and really liked them, but this mp3 player feels even better in my hand.

[+] misterprime|3 years ago|reply
I wonder why these don't also include audio recording features. It seems like a standalone device to play music well would also be perfect for recording audio well.
[+] andremedeiros|3 years ago|reply
I’m not knowledgeable at all, but I suspect there would be a DAC I could buy that’d make my iPhone sound just as good. Am I way off base?
[+] am_lu|3 years ago|reply
I miss good mp3 player days. I started on iriver cd player that could read MP3s... once i had some spare money upgraded to iriver H10 wit 20GB spinning rust drive (still have it, still working, sitting in the drawer). Once tried an old ipod, to see what the hassle, learned the pain of loading my own music to it, and the lack of file browser on it, no i dont want that artist/album BS, got my own categorized collection. Sold that one quickly. Sandisk sansa with rockbox was spot on, both both units failed like a year from time i bought them. Currently using an old old heavy duty samsung xcover2, with cyanogen mod, it does not have a simcard just 128gb microsd with lots of music on it. DAC is reasonably good on it and it plays FLAC no problem. Doubles as offline GPS with osmAnd maps loaded in.
[+] dotancohen|3 years ago|reply
This device has all the specs that I want _for a phone_. Seriously, I would love a music player with a phone, not a phone with a music player. They do need to increase the storage, then add a SIM card and this thing would fly off the shelves.
[+] lofaszvanitt|3 years ago|reply
The ideal mp3 player is

- small, fits in your palm,

- plays flac, wav, mp3, midi, and other obscure formats,

- easy to upload/download files, pops up as an usb drive when plugged into a pc,

- good sound output (I can sacrifice size for sound quality),

- jack/bluetooth output,

- sd/microsd card support,

- cheap,

- +1 optional fm/dap+? receiver.

I once bought a Sony Xperia mobile phone. It had all kinds of issues. Microphones were trash, the noise suppression was terrible, sometimes you couldn't hear the other party, the back glass shattered multiple times while sitting on the desk etc. That was such a bad experience I never touched any kind of handheld from Sony, and not gonna touch this one, for sure.