Before you trust a few thousand dollars of equipment to this desk...
The brackets there are mounted backwards; the long end should go against the wall. When they rate the brackets to hold 1000 pounds, it's based on a load at the center of the short side. But really the risk comes from the mounting. If you mount a 30-inch-deep hunk of desk on it there is a much higher stress on the mounting points since the long desk acts as a very effective lever. If you lean against the edge of the desk it may well pull the bracket out of the wall--especially if you use typical screws rather than lag bolts to mount it to the wall.
If you are mounting something like this in a corner, as being done here, the whole setup could be strengthened by mounting a ledger board against the right-hand wall to support the entire depth of the desk. Really you should have a support on the front-left corner as well, which can be done either with a dowel or furniture leg (you can get either at a hardware store).
I thought this at first, but if you look at a bracket like the one in the article on Amazon[1], it seems that they are mounted correctly, since amazon describes its depth as 19.5", and a height of 13".
Those brackets are different than what I would call standard shelving brackets[2], which should be mounted with the long side against the wall.
Quick tip : After drilling a wall you can clean the dust with vacuum cleaner and fill the hole ( not fully ) with quick drying plaster/cement and stick wall plug[1] in it. With this way you can be able to mount your stuff on almost every wall and the mounting will be stronger. It is useful if you live in a old apartment ( like most of the appartments in Germany... )
An idea that just occurred to me while reading this is that shelving racking, such as you see in most shops, would be ideal for this situation. I have some shelves just behind my desk mounted on this type of racking which have steel bars about 3/8" wide and are about 6ft tall screwed into the wall every foot or so. I believe the length of these would counter quite a lot of the bending stress (although thats not really my field) and as a fringe benefit they have mountings which the shelves hook into every 1 1/2" or so, this could even allow the desk to be lowered to a normal seating position with a little work. Also, I think that any failure of this type of racking would be fairly gradual.
There's a profession that's had standing desks for centuries. They're called draftsmen (architects, artists, and others). You'll find a great number of adjustable (height and angle) desks searching for "drafting table" with prices starting below $100 (new or used), and, well, as with much furniture, sky's the limit.
They can be used as standing desks or (with a stool) as a seated workstation. As noted in comments below, many drafting stools have some sort of footrest.
Add a monitor clamp/mount (either on the desk or on the wall behind it) and you've got a workstation solution. A hutch, shelving, or cabinet above, and an enclosed pedestal cabinet, and you've got a full desk.
It's not quickly adjustable, but with the removal and replacement of some bolts, you can adjust the main desk area from 30" height all the way up to 52". Built into the cost are four additional shelves of various sizes.
My idea was that if I was going to spend close to $200 on it, I wasn't terribly considered about quick adjustments (and I agree with nick_urban that a high stool/chair is perfect if necessary). However, I wanted to be sure that if I needed a non-standing desk in the future, this could be easily altered. I could also easily adjust it to accommodate visiting/alternative users - which is harder with many of the wall-mounted stand-up desks that are out there.
That looks pretty cool, I also built my own adjustable stand-up/sit-down desk, albeit a more minimalist version.
I'll have to draw out the plans like you did before I go touting the benefits of it, but I had quite a fun time designing and building it, as it seems you did.
The basic idea of mine:
The difference between a comfortable standing-desk height and sitting-desk height for me was 15 inches, so the desk surface is 15 inches deep, and can either fold up-and-out to be "Stand-up mode" or down-and-out to be "sit-down mode".
It's funny how we (typically) are just fine spending thousands of dollars for electronics but have a hard time doing it for furniture. (I'm doing it myself: I'm on the couch or the dining table when I work at home)
This guy has well over $2,000 on this $40 "desk", even though this equipment will lose a lot more value over time than a good desk. A MacBook Air will be worth barely anything in 5 years, while you can probably make a desk last half a career at least. Same for a good office chair.
I see the same responses in the comments thread of this blog. "$40 worth desk holding gadgets worth $4000? Seriously?" This line of reasoning makes no sense to me.
Why does the cost of a desk need to match that of the stuff on it? Are you suggesting this home-made desk is not stable, that it puts the contents of it at risk? Sure looks stable to me.
He might be able to justify $2000 on a Macbook Air because there may not be an alternative (depending on his work) or it may be justified with the perceived costs of the device.
There's no point spending $800 on a desk if $40 does the job adequately. Cost is only loosely correlated to quality and value. It's the same line of thinking that goes "well you spend a third of your life sleeping so why do you spend only $200 on a mattress?" Perhaps because a cheap bed and mattress is perfectly comfortable for most people.
I have been using this desk for the past year now and it is awesome.
What I dislike about the authors suggested setup is the fixed height. Often, the initial height that you set the desk to will become uncomfortable. As your body adjusts to using a standing desk, you will probably find that you would prefer something a few inches different from your initial setup. That would be a several hour project with something mount to the wall, but only takes about 15 minutes with these desks.
I've got an older (and larger) version of that desk and really like it. I've set it up in standing mode before, but didn't really stick with it.
It's worth checking Craigslist in your area too, there's usually people selling these desks pretty cheap. At least that's been my experience; got mine used for $70.
Interesting, thanks. Do you think one could use only one of the two narrow shelves and put a large screen on it? Can it support the weight? That way you could have keyboard and screen at different heights.
I went to Ikea and came home with the same desk for my home office.
While the assembled height can be changed, do be aware that the increments are relatively large, like maybe 3 inches. It worked out fine for me, but might not be very comfortable for someone slightly taller / shorter.
I found that without being able to easily switch between sitting and standing, standing work stations will probably not work for most people. I bought a geek desk and it solves the problem beautifully, but having two separate desks for sitting and standing is a cheaper solution if you have the room for it (or having a very tall stool).
After trying a non-adjustable standing desk that I built for a period of two weeks, I came to a similar conclusion. It initially felt pretty good, but after a few hours had passed I ended up taking a lot of breaks that I normally wouldn't have, simply because my legs couldn't keep up.
Also, my feet were in some serious pain for the first few days, even with a thick floor mat, and continued to lightly ache afterwards.
An inexpensive standing desk is nice, but I don't think I would be any happier standing continuously than sitting continuously. Unfortunately, rapidly adjustable sit/stand desks are insanely expensive.
How about a high desk that you can stand at, with a stool or drafting chair for when you want to sit? A tall chair seems a lot easier / cheaper than an adjustable desk.
I personally find that I rarely sit down at my desk, except for extremely long coding sessions. Having the ability to easily adjust my stance, wake a walk, flex my knees, and the like makes a huge difference. Your mileage may vary, obviously.
"An inexpensive standing desk is nice, but I don't think I would be any happier standing continuously than sitting continuously."
You don't need to. You could buy a stool and sit down when you need it or want to.
For me, it took 3 months to get the muscles necessary for standing up developed, and 6 to learn a correct posture good for my joints.
Today I use a wall as support for my back while standing while I use the computer attached to another wall with a mechanic arm(vesa tv mount with an imac adapter).
This is by far the best idea I could have, it feels totally different to work standing up.
...I don't think I would be any happier standing continuously than sitting continuously.
I came to the same conclusion after switching to a standing desk for a few months.
Now I'm using a yoga ball and it's amazing. It's immediately intuitive: just sit on it and shift to another comfortable position if you've been in one place too long. My core is even getting stronger from balancing (although it doesn't feel like a workout). I have a 65cm one for desk-height and a 75cm one for counter-height. I highly recommend it.
I find a stool not really a valuable fatigue reducer compared to a real chair. I couldn't handle standing all day, and the stool was better, but not great. I finally bit the bullet and went fully adjustable with a real chair, and it's so worth it.
replicatorblog is going to help me by suggesting some stability and aesthetics improvements, but if anyone else cares to join in, you're more than welcome.
The slots will be cut-out so you can adjust according to your height. My goal is something that can by cut with a CNC/laser cutter and then sold for ~$20.
Seems a good number people like the idea of a motorised adjustable desk, but the price is a deterrent.
I have a GeekDesk, or what near-as-dammit is one, via a UK importer who gets them from Europe and, personally, it's been the best £400-500 [edit: $600-800 USD, give or take] I've spent on hardware, ever, given that I spent most of my waking hours sat/standing/leaning at it. But I appreciate that it's not an easy price point for everyone.
So, question, with a view to a market opportunity for someone: how much would you be willing to pay for a strong, motorised, adjustable-height desk? Reply with a dollar figure, and if someone's already replied with a similar sum, upvote that instead. (Starting a whole poll seems OTT)
The major issue for me is that the GeekDesk succeeds ONLY in the adjustable requirement. I want to be able to have my monitor and keyboards at different heights, and a secondary shelf was important (though not strictly necessary). When I consider paying nearly $1000 USD for a starter kit (GeekDesk large frame), then spec'ing out nearly $400 USD for additional monitor stands and a keyboard tray, it hardly seems worth it.
I agree that it's a market where a motivated individual should be able to make a killing with a well-thought-out kickstarter proj.
It has a manual hand crank, so it's a little cheaper, I get a little exercise cranking it up and down (though not much; it's surprisingly easy to do), and I get to feel that I'm not polluting the world with more electronics (I know, ridiculous we you consider what's actually sitting on it...).
It is still pretty expensive, but it's really well (and precisely) made, so I can see that it could be expensive to produce.
A motorized desk is a ridiculous waste of money. Get a draughtsman's chair; architectural offices hace always had standup desks so people can draw and build models.
A little more expensive, but I made mine by taking an L-shaped IKEA Galant desk with extension and putting cinder blocks underneath the A-style legs. Felt pads are important to keep it from sliding off the blocks, but works great and gives you a TON of desk room :)
It's strange to read this, because I was recently in almost the same position. I almost ordered a Geekdesk, but ended up getting a used IKEA Fredrik (sp?) desk and setting it up in a standing position.
$50 instead of $1000, and pretty much the same result since I never sit down anymore anyways...
I certainly recommend going the frugal route first; if it doesn't work out, you can always re-sell the desk on the used market and get the expensive model later.
For those who still sit 8+ hours a day: Work on the boss or setup a budget for an adjustable stand up desk. Having a fixed height requires that you adjust if you want to add a floor mat, wear different shoes, or want to throw a treadmill down. And sometimes, after standing for hours, you just want to sit down. Spending $800 dollars is justified for anything that is used 8 hours a day.
Cool idea. I've done the standup desk thing before at work with a tall chair as a sitting option. I actually ended up using the chair most of the time so I switched back to avoid constantly vaulting up and down, but it was an interesting experiment for about 2 years.
One concern I would have about this particular configuration is the lack of a keyboard tray. Ergonomically, you would want your eyes about level with the top of the monitor or maybe a few inches below the top. At the same time, you want your keyboard to comfortably sit below so that you can keep your elbows at about 105 degrees or so. With the addition of a keyboard tray, and possibly a monitor stand, this can be a really nice long term ergonomic setup.
Found some tips on ergonomics at the link below, and these are inline (no pun intended) with what I have heard from the mandatory ergonomics training at my employer.
I figured this would be good because I could have the surface area of 5 desks take the square footage of one. The only thing is that with this desk doing any sort of paperwork is impractical. I had a keyboard tray that pushed me out too far from the desk to lean over my paper/books, and the ergonomically ideal height for the monitor base was too high for me to comfortably reference papers. I switched to a simple IKEA corner desk and chair, and re-purposed my shelves to be regular storage (although I kept the space open for monitors, should I want to work standing on another computer.
I've been a huge proponent of the standup desk for probably two years now.[1] One thing I see people get wrong ALL the time is the simple ergonomics - the top of the monitor should be at about eye level, and the keyboard should be just a little beneath the height of your elbows.
I made a simple folding standup desk I could put on top of a regular desk[2] and it's been fantastic. Very simple, easily folds flat, and sits nicely on top of just about any desk or table. If anyone wants details (and the sketchup file I planned with) just let me know!
[+] [-] dmethvin|14 years ago|reply
The brackets there are mounted backwards; the long end should go against the wall. When they rate the brackets to hold 1000 pounds, it's based on a load at the center of the short side. But really the risk comes from the mounting. If you mount a 30-inch-deep hunk of desk on it there is a much higher stress on the mounting points since the long desk acts as a very effective lever. If you lean against the edge of the desk it may well pull the bracket out of the wall--especially if you use typical screws rather than lag bolts to mount it to the wall.
If you are mounting something like this in a corner, as being done here, the whole setup could be strengthened by mounting a ledger board against the right-hand wall to support the entire depth of the desk. Really you should have a support on the front-left corner as well, which can be done either with a dowel or furniture leg (you can get either at a hardware store).
[+] [-] Judson|14 years ago|reply
Those brackets are different than what I would call standard shelving brackets[2], which should be mounted with the long side against the wall.
[1]:http://www.amazon.com/Black-Steel-Shelf-Bracket-19-1/dp/B001...
[2]:http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/BATTALION-Utility-Shelf-Bra...
[+] [-] devmach|14 years ago|reply
[1] : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_plug
[+] [-] VBprogrammer|14 years ago|reply
Similar to what is shown here http://www.richardsonsuk.co.uk/product.aspx?p=46 (no affiliation, just the first similar looking thing I came across on google).
[+] [-] dredmorbius|14 years ago|reply
They can be used as standing desks or (with a stool) as a seated workstation. As noted in comments below, many drafting stools have some sort of footrest.
A few models (the less expensive ones look a bit unstable): http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=drafting+table&... http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=drafting+table&... http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=drafting+table&... http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=drafting+table&...
... or search Craigslist.
Add a monitor clamp/mount (either on the desk or on the wall behind it) and you've got a workstation solution. A hutch, shelving, or cabinet above, and an enclosed pedestal cabinet, and you've got a full desk.
[+] [-] imperialWicket|14 years ago|reply
It's not quickly adjustable, but with the removal and replacement of some bolts, you can adjust the main desk area from 30" height all the way up to 52". Built into the cost are four additional shelves of various sizes.
My idea was that if I was going to spend close to $200 on it, I wasn't terribly considered about quick adjustments (and I agree with nick_urban that a high stool/chair is perfect if necessary). However, I wanted to be sure that if I needed a non-standing desk in the future, this could be easily altered. I could also easily adjust it to accommodate visiting/alternative users - which is harder with many of the wall-mounted stand-up desks that are out there.
[+] [-] andrenotgiant|14 years ago|reply
I'll have to draw out the plans like you did before I go touting the benefits of it, but I had quite a fun time designing and building it, as it seems you did.
The basic idea of mine:
The difference between a comfortable standing-desk height and sitting-desk height for me was 15 inches, so the desk surface is 15 inches deep, and can either fold up-and-out to be "Stand-up mode" or down-and-out to be "sit-down mode".
[+] [-] Timothee|14 years ago|reply
This guy has well over $2,000 on this $40 "desk", even though this equipment will lose a lot more value over time than a good desk. A MacBook Air will be worth barely anything in 5 years, while you can probably make a desk last half a career at least. Same for a good office chair.
[+] [-] heyitsnick|14 years ago|reply
Why does the cost of a desk need to match that of the stuff on it? Are you suggesting this home-made desk is not stable, that it puts the contents of it at risk? Sure looks stable to me.
He might be able to justify $2000 on a Macbook Air because there may not be an alternative (depending on his work) or it may be justified with the perceived costs of the device.
There's no point spending $800 on a desk if $40 does the job adequately. Cost is only loosely correlated to quality and value. It's the same line of thinking that goes "well you spend a third of your life sleeping so why do you spend only $200 on a mattress?" Perhaps because a cheap bed and mattress is perfectly comfortable for most people.
[+] [-] chaostheory|14 years ago|reply
http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/00115992/
http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/60111123/
It's easy to build. It's sturdy, and it looks good.
[+] [-] techscruggs|14 years ago|reply
What I dislike about the authors suggested setup is the fixed height. Often, the initial height that you set the desk to will become uncomfortable. As your body adjusts to using a standing desk, you will probably find that you would prefer something a few inches different from your initial setup. That would be a several hour project with something mount to the wall, but only takes about 15 minutes with these desks.
[+] [-] w33ble|14 years ago|reply
It's worth checking Craigslist in your area too, there's usually people selling these desks pretty cheap. At least that's been my experience; got mine used for $70.
EDIT: The Jerker (http://i.imgur.com/TyieC.jpg) is what I actually have (thanks chaostheory).
[+] [-] jarcoal|14 years ago|reply
They consider it a bar table, but it works perfectly as a standing desk.
[+] [-] thomas11|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ansible|14 years ago|reply
While the assembled height can be changed, do be aware that the increments are relatively large, like maybe 3 inches. It worked out fine for me, but might not be very comfortable for someone slightly taller / shorter.
[+] [-] marknutter|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jay_l|14 years ago|reply
Also, my feet were in some serious pain for the first few days, even with a thick floor mat, and continued to lightly ache afterwards.
Anyone thinking about doing something similar may want to read this brief article about some of the potential risks in standing up all the time: http://healthland.time.com/2011/04/13/the-dangers-of-sitting...
[+] [-] dredmorbius|14 years ago|reply
Co-worker who had a stand-up desk frequently migrated to his in-office couch by afternoon.
[+] [-] mnisjk|14 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] hapless|14 years ago|reply
I think this person has found a heck of an in-between position. It's not $40, but it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a geekdesk. http://blog.melchua.com/2011/07/09/fitting-yourself-a-sit-to...
[+] [-] nick_urban|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gecko|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tbrownaw|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] forgottenpaswrd|14 years ago|reply
You don't need to. You could buy a stool and sit down when you need it or want to.
For me, it took 3 months to get the muscles necessary for standing up developed, and 6 to learn a correct posture good for my joints.
Today I use a wall as support for my back while standing while I use the computer attached to another wall with a mechanic arm(vesa tv mount with an imac adapter).
This is by far the best idea I could have, it feels totally different to work standing up.
[+] [-] jackalope|14 years ago|reply
I came to the same conclusion after switching to a standing desk for a few months.
Now I'm using a yoga ball and it's amazing. It's immediately intuitive: just sit on it and shift to another comfortable position if you've been in one place too long. My core is even getting stronger from balancing (although it doesn't feel like a workout). I have a 65cm one for desk-height and a 75cm one for counter-height. I highly recommend it.
[+] [-] gte910h|14 years ago|reply
I find a stool not really a valuable fatigue reducer compared to a real chair. I couldn't handle standing all day, and the stool was better, but not great. I finally bit the bullet and went fully adjustable with a real chair, and it's so worth it.
[+] [-] unknown|14 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] jfoldi|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jashmenn|14 years ago|reply
http://i.imgur.com/QCEfp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LV5oC.jpg
replicatorblog is going to help me by suggesting some stability and aesthetics improvements, but if anyone else cares to join in, you're more than welcome.
The slots will be cut-out so you can adjust according to your height. My goal is something that can by cut with a CNC/laser cutter and then sold for ~$20.
[+] [-] stevejalim|14 years ago|reply
I have a GeekDesk, or what near-as-dammit is one, via a UK importer who gets them from Europe and, personally, it's been the best £400-500 [edit: $600-800 USD, give or take] I've spent on hardware, ever, given that I spent most of my waking hours sat/standing/leaning at it. But I appreciate that it's not an easy price point for everyone.
So, question, with a view to a market opportunity for someone: how much would you be willing to pay for a strong, motorised, adjustable-height desk? Reply with a dollar figure, and if someone's already replied with a similar sum, upvote that instead. (Starting a whole poll seems OTT)
[+] [-] imperialWicket|14 years ago|reply
The major issue for me is that the GeekDesk succeeds ONLY in the adjustable requirement. I want to be able to have my monitor and keyboards at different heights, and a secondary shelf was important (though not strictly necessary). When I consider paying nearly $1000 USD for a starter kit (GeekDesk large frame), then spec'ing out nearly $400 USD for additional monitor stands and a keyboard tray, it hardly seems worth it.
I agree that it's a market where a motivated individual should be able to make a killing with a well-thought-out kickstarter proj.
[+] [-] rhizome|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jrmg|14 years ago|reply
http://www.ergo2work.co.uk/product/en/ergodesk-basic-manual-...
It has a manual hand crank, so it's a little cheaper, I get a little exercise cranking it up and down (though not much; it's surprisingly easy to do), and I get to feel that I'm not polluting the world with more electronics (I know, ridiculous we you consider what's actually sitting on it...).
It is still pretty expensive, but it's really well (and precisely) made, so I can see that it could be expensive to produce.
[+] [-] anigbrowl|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Jun8|14 years ago|reply
I think I must have been sick the week they taught that. I still have great difficulty doing it (or building anything, working "with my hands").
[+] [-] revorad|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jarin|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gte910h|14 years ago|reply
Shelf mounts aren't made for lots of shearing force cause by constant up and down pressure like that.
While the desk looks cool, I give it about a 1:10 chance of coming off suddenly within 5 years of daily use.
[+] [-] wr1472|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] MikeCapone|14 years ago|reply
$50 instead of $1000, and pretty much the same result since I never sit down anymore anyways...
I certainly recommend going the frugal route first; if it doesn't work out, you can always re-sell the desk on the used market and get the expensive model later.
[+] [-] simpsond|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mpercy|14 years ago|reply
One concern I would have about this particular configuration is the lack of a keyboard tray. Ergonomically, you would want your eyes about level with the top of the monitor or maybe a few inches below the top. At the same time, you want your keyboard to comfortably sit below so that you can keep your elbows at about 105 degrees or so. With the addition of a keyboard tray, and possibly a monitor stand, this can be a really nice long term ergonomic setup.
Found some tips on ergonomics at the link below, and these are inline (no pun intended) with what I have heard from the mandatory ergonomics training at my employer.
http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art21940.asp
[+] [-] dkokelley|14 years ago|reply
I figured this would be good because I could have the surface area of 5 desks take the square footage of one. The only thing is that with this desk doing any sort of paperwork is impractical. I had a keyboard tray that pushed me out too far from the desk to lean over my paper/books, and the ergonomically ideal height for the monitor base was too high for me to comfortably reference papers. I switched to a simple IKEA corner desk and chair, and re-purposed my shelves to be regular storage (although I kept the space open for monitors, should I want to work standing on another computer.
[+] [-] wahnfrieden|14 years ago|reply
[+] [-] aedocw|14 years ago|reply
I made a simple folding standup desk I could put on top of a regular desk[2] and it's been fantastic. Very simple, easily folds flat, and sits nicely on top of just about any desk or table. If anyone wants details (and the sketchup file I planned with) just let me know!
[1]http://www.localconspiracy.com/2010/08/get-up-stand-up.html [2]https://picasaweb.google.com/christopheraedo/Simplestandup
[+] [-] fuzzythinker|14 years ago|reply
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/36698/standingdesk.JPG
Parts:
* $20 - 4 legs + desk board: http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/S79831622
* $20 or less: boards from a hardware store, dimensions:
- top monitor stand backing + side boards: 3 of ~12"ht x 10"depth
- bottom backing + side boards: 3 of ~12"ht x 15"+ depth (can be narrower in depth if lean against wall)
- monitor stand board: width desired x depth of monitor side boards
- desk board: free with the ikea legs. If want different dimensions, depth should be at least 18" so monitor can further away from you.
- bottom legs attachment board: width desired x depth of corresponding sides
* optional: $20 plastic sliding keyboard drawer to keep papers/notes. Got mine from Frys.