[jpeterson]

"There’s a lot of collaboration and spontaneous connection that happens in hallways and kitchenettes."

I've seen this idea repeated many times, but in over 20 years in the tech industry, I've never once seen a meaningful collaboration spring up in a kitchenette or hallway. It's invariably "how was your weekend?" fare. Don't get me wrong, there's value in connecting that way, but it's never the sort of thing that directly leads to any of the productivity gain that the anti-remote crowd would like you to believe.

[atsuzaki]

I scored most (if not all) of my career-defining opportunities from hallway convos after a meeting, or chatting while waiting for coffee to brew, so YMMV.

[kelnos]

So we should require that everyone be in an office, so that people like you can get their career-defining opportunities? Maybe many of us would be fine making that trade-off: fewer opportunities for career-defining opportunities in exchange for the elimination of a commute, more-comfortable working arrangements, and a much more flexible work schedule.

Not everything in life is about career advancement.

[giantg2]

This seems wild to me. It seems like the company and managers are doing something wrong if all your advancement is coming from random unofficial chats.

[ljf]

How much of your working life was in person vs remote?

I agree most of my 'big breaks' were face to face, that was due to the point I was in my career at that time. I've still had some great progression during remote working times - sometimes you just need to make these things happen - contacting someone just for a chat if that is what you need, turning up to online meetings early to spend a little time chatting before the proper meeting, or asking specific people if they have time to stay on.

I really think half the problem is that we aren't yet used to the new rules of engagement, and are still figuring out what feels right. But opportunity is still there.

[Implicated]

Question for you to help satisfy my curiosity about this a bit... do you also enjoy socializing in bars or the like?

[User23]

That's called office politics.

[hdjjhhvvhga]

Moreover, personally I'd prefer it stays this way. When I take a break and go to the kitchen to get a coffee, it is also a part of mental hygiene - I need to clear my mind as it needs some rest, too. So the last thing I want is someone bothering me about a merge request or some planned feature. A weekend trip, on the other hand, is perfectly fine.

[sodapopcan]

Hear hear. I worked at a place that pair programmed all the time (I liked it that way—it's why I joined the company) but it meant that I always had to eat lunch at my desk. To me it's crazy to be talking all morning then talk all through lunch then talk all afternoon! But to each their own.

[MrScruff]

Completely disagree. I probably have 3 or 4 of these spontaneous conversations that wouldn’t otherwise happen a day when I’m in the office. It might start with ‘what are you working on’ and branch off from there, it’s not just small talk.

[juve1996]

Or it could be another negative coworker that wastes your time to complain, gossip, or talk about other employees, or criticize other people.

It will be impossible to quantify these "water cooler chats." For as much work gets done, just as much probably doesn't.

[mort96]

I have a ton of informal conversations with people I don't have formal meetings with, just because we happen to go to the coffee machine at the same time or happen to go eat lunch at the same time. Some of those conversations are non-job-related (which is valuable, since strong social connections with colleagues are valuable), but a lot end up being on job stuff. I end up just informally talking with sales people, customer service people, managers, etc, and hearing about stuff from their perspective or the stuff that's on their minds is incredibly useful.

[leros]

I would probably say that 95% of my creative problem solving type work happened in unstructured conversations like hallway conversations. A lot of value was definitely lost there.

[ftcHn]

+1

Some of my best ideas that ended up being company changing started as a conversation walking to lunch with colleagues.

Initially these ideas were just undeveloped thoughts and I would never dream about booking a meeting to present them. Having a chance to develop them in a casual conversation might have been the difference between successfully building the thing and not doing it at all.

I love working from home but miss the unstructured collaboration.

[DangerousPie]

I have had a lot of interesting conversations with colleagues from other teams while grabbing a coffee. Sometimes it's just meaningless small talk about the weekend but sometimes we talk about work and help each other find solutions to problems, or realize we should collaborate. And even if it's just small talk, making those kinds of connections can make it a lot easier to get in touch with them in the future.

[deafpolygon]

Same. I don't really collaborate in the hallways, I don't think IT people tend to.

[downrightmike]

Probably, because if you do, you get asked to fix something and you're already overloaded with work to do and people can't be bothered to google.

[nicpottier]

What? This is a crazy anecdote. I believe you but understand that's not the norm. I have had many and know if others having many as well.

Companies that are all remote will survive but they won't thrive and in a competitive market will lose to those that are in person.

I say that after running a company that was one or the other at various times. The periods when we were all in person (constantly, not as a special event) is when real innovative progress was made.

[sekai]

> I've seen this idea repeated many times, but in over 20 years in the tech industry

Exactly, and how many of those conversations are wasted on nothing? Sure, there's a social element to it, so how about we highlight that aspect and not some "lightbulb" moment that derives from small talk.

[mort96]

Conversations which let you get to know your colleagues better are "wasted on nothing" to you? Is there no point to knowing your colleagues?

[epistemer]

It is all bullshit.

The problem is that it is obvious how useless and misconfigured our entire corporate management structures are with remote work so the easiest solution is to go back to the office.

The pandemic was a fun exercise in forced, real efficiency but we need to get back to the Dilbert cartoon version of life because the Dilbert cartoon characters call the shots and put a ton of time into becoming those characters.

[RestlessMind]

The most meaningful collaborations I have seen in my 20+ years of work involved a small group of 3 to 5 people huddled around a whiteboard. I can make a list of top 10 collaborations I recollect and none of them were remote interactions. In-person somehow made the collaboration easier.

[joxel]

You must work in a boring ass place. We are always talking about ideas to each other. Though I do research so maybe that’s why.