[Noe2097]

Why oh why is that a backslash!?

Over the 9 languages mentioned: 5 languages (inc. JVM ones like groovy and kotlin) are using `$`, 1 language (swift) is using `\`.

`\` is a pain to type on many keyboard layouts -- actually most but the US one. It seemed to me that `$` would have been a much more "conventional" choice.

This really makes me sad. It looks like the choice was made on purpose to be different.

[kothar]

I assume because `\{` was not a valid escape sequence, which means any use of this character pair can be identified as a template without changing the semantics of existing string literals.

[layer8]

More specifically: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35016204

[kevincox]

But you need the `FOO.` prefix anyways. So there was never any ambiguity. It seems that it would be good to either make the prefix optional (presumably something equivalent to the `STR.` processor would be default) or keep the interpolation syntax clean. (IMHO just `STR."Hello {name}!"` would have been ideal). But instead they require both the prefix and the ugly interpretation syntax.

[aardvark179]

Bingo!

[dmitriid]

This reminds me how PHP ended up with weird characters for various things (like namespace separators) because it was just easier to parse.

[Too]

I don’t mind the typing ergonomy. More that it is visually ugly and counter-intuitive. Because in every other language a backslash would mean you want to keep the braces instead of interpolating the variable inside. They even have a comparison table at the top of the document, where they didn’t dare to put the Java option next to the others because it would stand out as being too different. Why not just follow the established conventions?

[qw]

I agree. On my keyboard I need to press ⌥ + ⌘ + 7

It's actually made worse because { and } also need special combinations.

To type \{X} I need to press

  (⌥ + ⌘ + 7) (SHIFT + ⌥ + 8) X (SHIFT + ⌥ + 9)

I know this is something we need to live with due to historical reasons, but I would prefer that new syntax is made simpler.

[v-erne]

You just made me to get my MacBook out of closet :) (I stopped using it two months ago and moved to X1 carbon right before pandemic)

The ergonomic of \{X} is exactly the same on it as on my carbon x1, my keychron tls and four other keyboards I happen to have in my drawer.

Are You using modified Apple II like Rebecca Heineman or some kind of super small keyboard that looks like someone forgot to put all the keys in :) ?

Either way its on you not Java.

(Dont take this wrong way - this is an honest question - here in Poland almost all keyboard are backslash friendly and I would live to knowe where this is not the case)

[lenkite]

What about parenthesis () and square brackets [] ? (writing a lisp DSL that might have users from non-US layouts)

[bberrry]

Agreed, the economics for this syntax is terrible.

[spankalee]

I don't understand this rationale either:

> For the syntax of embedded expressions we considered using ${...}, but that would require a tag on string templates (either a prefix or a delimiter other than ") to avoid conflicts with legacy code.

Can't the template processor expression itself function as the tag? Is STR."..." already legal now?

[layer8]

They want

  String info = "My name is \{name}.";

to be a compile-time error because it is missing the template processor (e.g. the `STR.` prefix). Since existing code like

  String info = "My name is ${name}.";

is valid, they can’t use that syntax, or any other syntax that is currently allowed, as otherwise they would lose the ability to make it an error.

———

However, what they could have done instead is to use a syntax like

  String info = "My name is "(name)".";

i.e. place the interpolated expressions outside of string literals. Slightly longer, but maybe more readable and typable, and currently invalid syntax. (The parentheses would be mandatory.)

[cs02rm0]

I'm not a fan either. Java seems to be declining in prevalence in my corner of industry, I'm sure these changes are made by wiser minds than mine, but I'm sceptical about whether such a choice is really right for users.

[nunobrito]

I remain to be convinced and program daily in Java for a long time.

It seems just as difficult to remember/useless as lambda expressions that look fine as vanity one-line expressions and then get difficult to write for most programmers.

We don't really need vanity innovation in the Java world. I would have asked for priority on the FX replacement to Swing, or support for running on ESP32 IoT devices as replacement to the Arduino platform.

Instead we get some weird looking syntax for what is basically a non-problem.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[pdevr]

Seriously, yes. Great thought process behind the design, marred by the good-for-nothing (subjective opinion) backslash.

If any of you design a language or a DSL, please, please - avoid the backslash - for the reasons stated above. Hard to type, introduces unseen problems, most will hate it. It (backslash) is unbecoming, of anything elegant.

[SyrupThinker]

But if you do follow that advice consider if it is worth just using a different escape character for all interpolations. That way could still make use of this very sensible syntax of reusing the escape for interpolation whilst avoiding the backslash issues.

[jacobn]

I'd also really have preferred $, but apparently there's some backwards compatibility issue with using that character?

[kaba0]

“${val}” is a legal string literal that is certainly used in plenty of existing programs.

In current Java you would have to escape \, so only “\\{val}” could have existed before.

[kaba0]

Slightly unrelated, but I only buy ISO keyboards and have my native tongue layout (Hungarian) and English easily switched. The former absolutely sucked for any programming work, so I think we just sort of have to accept that programming is done with an en-us layout, the same way that (hopefully) all identifiers/comments are also in English.

[agumonkey]

It's horrible but I can't get over it. The value of string template is also aesthetic.. and these are like staples. Java once again.

[saagarjha]

It’s the “escape” character.