It's interesting you went into quite a lot of detail about the various "foreign" terror cells, but skipped domestic terrorism, which has been far more impactful in the last what, decade+?
This is just authoritarian BS. You could have a federal agent posted in every single neighborhood in the country who does nothing but spy on all the neighbors and still not be sure you've identified every "terror cell" or whatever other boogeyman you want to use to justify the surveillance state.
"Let me say that what the US government is doing wouldn't even be controversial in 99% of the world, including probably 90% of democracies" Really? I'd say perhaps you need to back your estimates with some sort of hard data but these numbers are really plucked out of thin air...
Your whole post reeks of whataboutism and classic fallacies. To address:
1) US agencies can track 'dormant terror cells' from adversaries without hovering up everyone's data.
2) And let's not forget about Chinese drones. If your assumption that they were indeed launched from onshore agents, US agencies can triangulate data and get a few POIs under surveillance - not every single person, everywhere, all the time.
Might we ask how well this High-Surveillance/High-Paranoia/Low-Rights approach to state security worked out for the German Democratic Republic?
In the version of things that I've heard, the GDR state collapsed ~instantly after the de facto occupying power (USSR) lost interest - because the "ultimate surveillance state" strategy had left the GDR with ~zero good will and ~zero legitimacy in the minds of its own citizens. But doubtless that is just more malicious anti-American propaganda, created and spread by America's countless enemies.
You hit all the propaganda talking points in one comment. Usually such comments stick to one talking point. "China, china, china" or "russia, russia, russia" or ...
> Let me say that what the US government is doing wouldn't even be controversial in 99% of the world, including probably 90% of democracies.
That's a problem for most of the world. Not the US.
> People in other countries are much more clear eyed and pragmatic about these things.
Most of the people around the world don't have any problems with iran, russia, china and mexico. Maybe we should look into why we have conflicts with people all over the world.
You're not wrong about the propaganda talking points.
>Most of the people around the world don't have any problems with iran, russia, china and mexico. Maybe we should look into why we have conflicts with people all over the world.
In fact, most liberal democracies are at odds with Russia, Iran, China, and nearly everyone is concerned about Mexican Drug Cartels.
> That's a problem for most of the world. Not the US.
The popular notion of civil rights in America and the historical reality are at odds. Americans have always been spied on, it was just less publicized in the past.
Russia is an existential threat to our democracy. Surveillance is necessary so no election can interfered by the Russians. Millions of lives have been lost because of an illegal president. We don't want that to happen again.
Way to be ultimately dismissive and basically call PC a shill and with a smugness that is unnecessary. Different people have different interests and you can’t just ad hominem them as propaganda.
sofixa|2 years ago
erellsworth|2 years ago
laylower|2 years ago
Your whole post reeks of whataboutism and classic fallacies. To address:
1) US agencies can track 'dormant terror cells' from adversaries without hovering up everyone's data.
2) And let's not forget about Chinese drones. If your assumption that they were indeed launched from onshore agents, US agencies can triangulate data and get a few POIs under surveillance - not every single person, everywhere, all the time.
3) The drug carters points is laughable.
bell-cot|2 years ago
In the version of things that I've heard, the GDR state collapsed ~instantly after the de facto occupying power (USSR) lost interest - because the "ultimate surveillance state" strategy had left the GDR with ~zero good will and ~zero legitimacy in the minds of its own citizens. But doubtless that is just more malicious anti-American propaganda, created and spread by America's countless enemies.
oilchange|2 years ago
1. Iran. Check.
2. Russia. Check.
3. China. Check.
4. Mexican drug cartel. Check.
You hit all the propaganda talking points in one comment. Usually such comments stick to one talking point. "China, china, china" or "russia, russia, russia" or ...
> Let me say that what the US government is doing wouldn't even be controversial in 99% of the world, including probably 90% of democracies.
That's a problem for most of the world. Not the US.
> People in other countries are much more clear eyed and pragmatic about these things.
Most of the people around the world don't have any problems with iran, russia, china and mexico. Maybe we should look into why we have conflicts with people all over the world.
flerchin|2 years ago
>Most of the people around the world don't have any problems with iran, russia, china and mexico. Maybe we should look into why we have conflicts with people all over the world.
In fact, most liberal democracies are at odds with Russia, Iran, China, and nearly everyone is concerned about Mexican Drug Cartels.
janalsncm|2 years ago
The popular notion of civil rights in America and the historical reality are at odds. Americans have always been spied on, it was just less publicized in the past.
we_never_see_it|2 years ago
birdyrooster|2 years ago
shadowgovt|2 years ago
The US has several problems the rest of the world doesn't. Chronic school shootings, for instance.