[willbudd]

I feel like you and all the people replying to you are completely missing the obvious. To someone who has been depressed for many years, for someone who literally (according the article) contemplated jumping of the roof of a 10 story building, "probably dying at some point" is not a deal-breaker or even all that much of a downside per se.

We're all going to die at some point, and while most/many of us might want to delay that inevitability as much as possible, I don't think it's warranted at all to assume that the same premise applies to every single one of us. This guy realized that the only thing in life he could truly enjoy was climbing rocks. Do we really need to fault him for deciding to then just do that thing until fate eventually catches up as it always does?

Sure, it may be rough on the people whose lives they intersect with, but provided they're not a parent raising a child/children/etc, acceptance of one another for who we are is all that remains. Personally, I'd take short-lived good company over long-lived mediocre company any day.

[ke88y]

> is not a deal-breaker or even all that much of a downside per se.

Close, but I don't think you quite get it yet.

It's not about "no downside"! That completely misunderstands. It's about a HUGE upside. It dials in your mental space and all the negative thoughts flood away. You're present in the moment. It's like being on a hard drug, but you feel clean and clear-headed instead of hung over afterward. You feel a lot better about life for days or even weeks at a time. You do it because NOT doing it might just kill you. Free solo today, or shoot yourself in the back of your car at the firepit tonight. And it's not about the risk, and it's not adernaline. It's the focus and calm. Does that make sense? I think it's really hard to understand if you haven't experienced suicidal thoughts for most of your life.

I haven't talked to very many free soloists who haven't made the point that they're horrendously depressed/suicidal and that they do it to live, not to die. Sometimes. Normally the ones who do "quite safe soloing" -- way below their grade, on well-known routes, etc. etc.

The article isn't just about Austin. It's about a lot of people. And not just climbers. Similar dark shit in skiing, mountaineering, dirt biking, and so on.

> Personally, I'd take short-lived good company over long-lived mediocre company any day.

I've never met an irresponsible soloist who wasn't a beautiful soul.

[Dah00n]

It sounds both quite beautiful but also quite sad at the same time. I feel like it describes my experience when riding a motorcycle. Not as high as climbing, I guess, but much easier to add to any day of the week for short or long runs.

I owned a motorcycle for some years, but then sold it. Years later, when I got diagnosed with cancer*, I broke up with my then girlfriend (not a healthy relationship) and bought a new 1000ccm sports bike. That was a big tipping point in my life. I went from depressive moments with thoughts of "I want to die" to depressive moments of "I hate this, I want out, but I want to live". The motorcycle gives me freedom I don't feel in a car, makes my head clear up, and I feel happier after. I guess most of the change in thought patterns was because of the Cancer looking-over-the-edge-at-death experience, but the motorcycle adds life quality in daily life that is worth the risk. So, a bit like climbing? *shrug*

*- I'm fine now. :)

[tomxor]

> It dials in your mental space and all the negative thoughts flood away. You're present in the moment [...] You feel a lot better about life for days or even weeks at a time [...] the focus and calm. Does that make sense?

I think you nailed it here. A lot of our mental issues are made so much worse by twisting them in this abstract world in our minds. Doing something that is so pure and requires you to be 100% in the moment kind of destroys all of that and pulls you back to reality, it can really put things into perspective.

[willbudd]

> It's not about "no downside"! That completely misunderstands. It's about a HUGE upside.

Let's compromise and say it's both? You're right that the upper bound experienced may be a lot higher than most may realize, but it's also true that the lower bound may no longer seem that deep of an abyss as it appears to most. Hence the mental equilibrium in-between being at a point that can seem somewhat alien to those who live more slow-burning lives.

[amelius]

Sounds like an addiction, which is never good.

[canadianfella]

> I've never met an irresponsible soloist who wasn't a beautiful soul.

Romanticizing suicide is gross.

[brutusborn]

This rings true to me. I improved my surfing most at a point in my life where drowning didn’t really worry me. Not because it was less likely, but because I was at a point where I didn’t care much if I died.

It meant I dropped in on waves well beyond my skill level. I had lots of near misses but learnt heaps from the ones I caught.

I’m thankful I no longer feel that way, I want to stick around for those around me. Now I’m content on smaller waves and take a lot less risks in all aspects of life.

[applied_heat]

Curious what wave you are riding where drowning was a potential outcome in your mind? I’ve been stuck on the outside too scared to catch a monster in, but drowning never crossed my mind just getting the beat down and getting washed in or sucked back out and Potentially having to paddle some miles to a place that would be easier to get in. Dark with no moon would be unwelcome in that situation.

[iJohnDoe]

Based on my limited knowledge, many of the greats went through the same thing you did.

Thanks for putting things in perspective.

[zarzavat]

Unless you are Japanese, that’s probably not the prevailing culture. For the vast majority of people suicide is seen as a mental illness that should be treated, potentially by force, not as an individual choice. Because a person suffering from mental illness by definition does not have full agency over their decisions. Even the idea of allowing suicide for terminally ill people is controversial (although it’s something I personally support).

In the past, suicide was viewed as immoral and criminal. We have moved past that, not because suicide is more socially acceptable, but because of a desire to more easily help people suffering from mental illness.

[willbudd]

Regardless of what cultural category may or may not apply, I find that line of thought rather unconstructive. This isn't about being anyone's opinion on suicide like some black and white binary stance whether you're "for" or "against". This is about coming to terms with your own mortality.

It's about the grey area in-between the extremes of committing suicide (the "black"), and forever running away from risk so that you can die of cancer while undergoing chemotherapy and getting your diapers changed in an elderly home (the "white"(?)).

And if even discussing the topic in those terms touches on some kind of taboo, then yes; perhaps you're right to emphasize the cultural component involved.