“unlike virtually every other website that is used for prostitution and sex trafficking, Backpage is remarkably responsive to law enforcement requests and often takes proactive steps to assist in investigations.” - DOJ
"In short, contrary to the public narrative you may have heard, Backpage worked closely with federal law enforcement to actually stop sex trafficking (and not just take it down, but to track down the perpetrators). But they refused to do the same for consensual sex work and that is why the feds eventually came down on them like a ton of bricks, all while telling the media and politicians that it was for sex trafficking. But that was all bullshit."
> The government indictment that triggered Lacey and Larkin’s arrests, United States v. Lacey, et al., includes 17 “victim summaries”—stories of women who say they were sexually exploited through Backpage. Victim 5 first appeared in an ad on the platform when she was 14; her “customers” made her “perform sexual acts at gunpoint, choked her to the point of having seizures, and gang-raped her.” Victim 6 was stabbed to death. Victim 8’s uncle and his friends advertised her as “fetish friendly.” The indictment accuses Backpage of catering to sexual predators, of essentially helping pimps better reach their target audiences.
Tough issue overall balancing free speech and legitimate consensual sex work against flagrant exploitation. My understanding is that even in jurisdictions with legalization and formalization of the work trafficking still occurs. No solutions to provide, Larkin’s suicide is still tragic and unfortunate.
I feel like discussions around sex trafficking are weird.
By legal definition they facilitated sex trafficking. Perhaps they could argue they are better than Average Joe Pimp, but Average Joe Pimp is also going to say he was kinder or more fair than Average Bob Pimp.
It seems like everyone accepts face value numbers of sex trafficking when trying to make a point about how widespread the issue is - but then except most forms of it from being "bad" or "actual sex trafficking".
I don't know what the best solution is. Legalizing is seems like it would solve most of the current issues, but ultimately I don't know how you get around issues of coercion with defenders (and backpage) would probably still consider "consensual". In places around the world where sex work is legal, its hard to point to many examples where there are no issues involving coercion.
> But they refused to do the same for consensual sex work and that is why the feds eventually came down on them like a ton of bricks, all while telling the media and politicians that it was for sex trafficking.
Sex trafficking is defined as sex work. There isn't a legal difference. That's why they're saying it.
But they refused to do the same for consensual sex work
Isn't that also a crime in almost the entire US?
It's also where sex trafficking comes into play. How would you know consent was given by a sex worker? People who are trafficked to work as prostitutes are often blackmailed and threatened.
Right now there's massive paranoia about this because it's being used as an election tactic but prostitution and sex trafficking are somewhat linked
However, where they drew the line was when law enforcement started demanding similar help in tracking down non-trafficking consensual sex work.
It sounds like someone who took an enlightened and ethical stance who got railroaded.
I haven't followed the Backpage drama but this looks to me like a win for uptight, backwards people who want to pretend their hang ups are some form of "righteousness."
I'm very sad to see this article and the news that he apparently died by suicide.
> But I do hope that some of the people who literally built up their own profiles by demonizing Backpage and Section 230 at least take a moment to reflect on whether or not they got so caught up in the narrative they wanted that they missed what was actually happening.
Just throwing out there that the "trafficking" topic in the media is largely a moral panic from the culture conservatives working with the police to call all sex work trafficking, as that juices their numbers for the scale of the problem, giving both group more supports/donors while doing nothing to help victims. This is a gross mischaracterization.
Here's an article by a former sex worker on this, and how decrim, Backpage, etc. are better for reducing the numbers of victims in sex work and the severity of what they deal with.
"This process is called civil asset forfeiture, and in practice it often works very similar to highway robbery. Authorities can take literally whatever they want from you — cash, vehicles, your home, your Playstation 5 — and they can keep it, without ever convicting or even charging you with a crime. All they have to do is say they suspect you committed a crime. And here’s the kicker: if you want your stuff back, you have to go to court and affirmatively prove your innocence. Basically, you must prove a negative: that you did not commit a crime. It’s a complete inversion of the “innocent until proven guilty” philosophy driving most of the criminal justice system."
"Here’s one way to think of the scale: in 2019, the most recent year for which complete federal data is available, federal authorities took more cash and property from people than burglars did."
A Red Shirt found out too late that authorities don’t care about stopping the actual problem because then they wouldn’t be employed. There is no value in helping a department with their work unless you have something very specific to gain. Just don’t talk to them.
Not familiar enough with the person's history to know if they did bad things, or if they were uncooperative, or simply ran a website and became a scapegoat. Anyone got insight into this?
myshpa|2 years ago
"In short, contrary to the public narrative you may have heard, Backpage worked closely with federal law enforcement to actually stop sex trafficking (and not just take it down, but to track down the perpetrators). But they refused to do the same for consensual sex work and that is why the feds eventually came down on them like a ton of bricks, all while telling the media and politicians that it was for sex trafficking. But that was all bullshit."
toomuchtodo|2 years ago
> The government indictment that triggered Lacey and Larkin’s arrests, United States v. Lacey, et al., includes 17 “victim summaries”—stories of women who say they were sexually exploited through Backpage. Victim 5 first appeared in an ad on the platform when she was 14; her “customers” made her “perform sexual acts at gunpoint, choked her to the point of having seizures, and gang-raped her.” Victim 6 was stabbed to death. Victim 8’s uncle and his friends advertised her as “fetish friendly.” The indictment accuses Backpage of catering to sexual predators, of essentially helping pimps better reach their target audiences.
Tough issue overall balancing free speech and legitimate consensual sex work against flagrant exploitation. My understanding is that even in jurisdictions with legalization and formalization of the work trafficking still occurs. No solutions to provide, Larkin’s suicide is still tragic and unfortunate.
fasthands9|2 years ago
By legal definition they facilitated sex trafficking. Perhaps they could argue they are better than Average Joe Pimp, but Average Joe Pimp is also going to say he was kinder or more fair than Average Bob Pimp.
It seems like everyone accepts face value numbers of sex trafficking when trying to make a point about how widespread the issue is - but then except most forms of it from being "bad" or "actual sex trafficking".
I don't know what the best solution is. Legalizing is seems like it would solve most of the current issues, but ultimately I don't know how you get around issues of coercion with defenders (and backpage) would probably still consider "consensual". In places around the world where sex work is legal, its hard to point to many examples where there are no issues involving coercion.
thaumasiotes|2 years ago
Sex trafficking is defined as sex work. There isn't a legal difference. That's why they're saying it.
themitigating|2 years ago
Isn't that also a crime in almost the entire US?
It's also where sex trafficking comes into play. How would you know consent was given by a sex worker? People who are trafficked to work as prostitutes are often blackmailed and threatened.
Right now there's massive paranoia about this because it's being used as an election tactic but prostitution and sex trafficking are somewhat linked
DoreenMichele|2 years ago
It sounds like someone who took an enlightened and ethical stance who got railroaded.
I haven't followed the Backpage drama but this looks to me like a win for uptight, backwards people who want to pretend their hang ups are some form of "righteousness."
I'm very sad to see this article and the news that he apparently died by suicide.
msie|2 years ago
sunk1st|2 years ago
boomboomsubban|2 years ago
It links to a story about it.
nullc|2 years ago
https://oag.ca.gov/news/press-releases/attorney-general-kama...
nickpinkston|2 years ago
Here's an article by a former sex worker on this, and how decrim, Backpage, etc. are better for reducing the numbers of victims in sex work and the severity of what they deal with.
https://medium.com/@cathyreisenwitz/how-to-actually-fight-tr...
worik|2 years ago
RIP
the-peter|2 years ago
[deleted]
optimalsolver|2 years ago
[deleted]
zoklet-enjoyer|2 years ago
[deleted]
myshpa|2 years ago
https://thewhyaxis.substack.com/p/cops-still-take-more-stuff...
"This process is called civil asset forfeiture, and in practice it often works very similar to highway robbery. Authorities can take literally whatever they want from you — cash, vehicles, your home, your Playstation 5 — and they can keep it, without ever convicting or even charging you with a crime. All they have to do is say they suspect you committed a crime. And here’s the kicker: if you want your stuff back, you have to go to court and affirmatively prove your innocence. Basically, you must prove a negative: that you did not commit a crime. It’s a complete inversion of the “innocent until proven guilty” philosophy driving most of the criminal justice system."
"Here’s one way to think of the scale: in 2019, the most recent year for which complete federal data is available, federal authorities took more cash and property from people than burglars did."
oaththrowaway|2 years ago
Etrnl_President|2 years ago
hyperhello|2 years ago
tetrisgm|2 years ago