AWS Works Council Germany

[jwildeboer]

As a member of the Red Hat Germany works council I congratulate our friends at AWS for doing the right thing and hope we can soon have a discussion!

[woodruffw]

For those who (like me) didn't know what a Works Council is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_council#Germany

TL;DR: It's a non-union form of worker representation with separate legal status in countries like France and Germany. While not unions, their existence isn't incompatible with unionization.

[grunder_advice]

Do these work councils actually work? What incentive do they have to side with an employee over the company? Wouldn't it be the first aim of the HR department to get as cosy with them as possible?

[rawfan]

Works councils represent the interests of the employees and work very well in my experience. AFAIK companies with strong workers representation do a lot better than those without. Council members are elected on a yearly basis. By law they cannot be dismissed and they get a say in topics concerning workers rights. Want to introduce a software benchmarking workers performance? Good luck getting it approved by the council. They are also present during job interviews to ensure applicants are treated fairly and equally. They make sure your job stays family friendly and healthy. There are actually often council members in HR questioning managers why their employees work overtime.

[flohofwoe]

IME a (good) works council can smoothen out a lot of misunderstandings between management and employees before they blow up into real problems, especially when it comes to the legal side of things. You can think of the works council as the counter-weight to HR (e.g. HR keeps employees in check while a works council keeps management in check).

[jwildeboer]

Yes. They work. They decide on new hires. On many other things. By law they have a lot of rights. Disclaimer: I am an elected member of the Red Hat Germany works council.

[pxeger1]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_council

[QuinnyPig]

The fact that this uses the AWS branding must send the marketing folks at Amazon into absolute fits of rage.

[Argorak]

Footer: © Amazon Web Services EMEA SARL (Niederlassung Deutschland)

This is probably the AWS lead initiative to place their preferred people into a council they see being formed anyways.

[formerly_proven]

Works councils are legally recognized parts of their companies and generally use company branding, besides of course using the company offices, work hours and infrastructure to conduct their legally-protected business.

[scrum-treats]

Pretty sure employees would benefit from a union. It's too little too late for whatever this is trying to be, IMO.

[Argorak]

This is a German works council, which is the most common outcome of a unionization effort: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Works_council#Germany

Its creation can be forced by a vote of the employees and the council has a legal special status. This probably comes as a reaction to multiple distribution centers around Germany doing exactly that and forcing the creation of local work councils with the help of unions.

[flohofwoe]

It's a common thing in German companies of all sizes and usually a good thing for the company too because problems between management and workforce are usually solved in a much less "confrontational" way compared to full-blown unionization (especially in smaller family-owned "Mittelstand" businesses).

[jonp888]

Unions and Works Councils are not mutually exclusive. All companies that have a recognized Union will have a Works Council too.

A Works Council is entirely company specific. A Union is usually concerned with an entire sector and deals with company-specific issues only a limited way. In practice the Union organisations often provide assistance and advice to a Works Council, even to companies in which they are not active as a Union.

[QuinnyPig]

You might want to research German employment law a bit more...

[k__]

Often union members are elected into works councils.

It's basically like a government of the company and a union is just another party that can get elected.