[perceptronas]

This IDE doesn't seem to differ from CLion with Rust plugin. I guess, its only about making Rust plugin paid from their side – which makes sense from their side. I hope they can deliver quality.

On the other hand, they are notoriously slow to develop their IDEs. Features are super slow to be delivered, IDEs themselves are not really improved as well. They are focusing on things most don't care: Spaces, new UI project, etc. Barely any performance improvements, customisation is hard, Ruby, Scala and other plugins are lacking as well. Scala showing red squiggly lines where its not supposed to (on their compiler), Ruby lacking ergonomics in refactoring department (refactoring too large scope and etc.) or tooling support.

I still pay Jetbrains and while 2015 they were above everything else – its no longer the case. I grew up with them as developer, I hope they can up their game.

[cyberax]

> On the other hand, they are notoriously slow to develop their IDEs.

I found that IntelliJ IDEs for me are almost at the perfection level. I don't really need any new changes, except for simple incremental ones like supporting new languages.

I've been using IntelliJ since 2003, and it's amazing how little my main workflows have changed since then.

[raincole]

My worst nightmare is JetBrains gets IPO (or acquired by a public traded corp).

[boxed]

They do break stuff they used to have and then it doesn't get fixed for years.

For example this https://youtrack.jetbrains.com/issue/PY-39449/Deleting-param... has been broken for 4 years.

[lenkite]

Its looks like Jetbrains is migrating to an N IDE's for N languages approach - bloat up memory and disk so they can be paid more.

No point in buying Intellij Ultimate and installing language plugins. As is clear from this post, the language plugins will no longer see new features.

Now you need to purchase and start the IDE's for Rust, Go, C++, Python, etc. So if you are working in multiple language projects, you need $$$ purchase power. And then 64 GB RAM and several terabytes of hard disk space.

What a mess.

[wink]

Waiting 5-10 minutes for a moderately sized project to be indexed until you can do anything useful is perfection? Ouch :P

[TylerE]

That's how all their IDEs work. It's all the same software with different sets of allowed plugins.

I would also argue that their IDEs are largely mature, feature-complete software. I'm quite happy they haven't succumbed to the modern trend of reorganize all the menus every 6 months.

[kuhsaft]

Not all their IDEs. Jetbrains Rider has specific modifications that are integrated into the IDE for .NET software development that aren't available in even in IntelliJ Idea Ultimate. The same goes for CLion, the C/C++ features are not available in any other of their IDEs. Though, I think those are the only two IDEs where the the features provided are not available as plugins.

[gjvc]

That's how all their IDEs work. It's all the same software with different sets of allowed plugins.

From where did you get this idea -- basic use? It most certainly is not this to as great a degree as you might like to think. Source: JB employee.

[OtomotO]

> I'm quite happy they haven't succumbed to the modern trend of reorganize all the menus every 6 months.

Same, so they do it every 2 years instead.

But the upside is the Shift+Shift Menu of "Find anything in this Project or what the IDE can do for you"... I wish more software had this :)

[threeseed]

> largely mature, feature-complete software

Depends on the language.

I use mostly Scala and Rust and both have significant issues still with incorrect syntax highlighting, refactoring being limited and slowness with larger projects.

[delta_p_delta_x]

> I'm quite happy they haven't succumbed to the modern trend of reorganize all the menus every 6 months

https://www.jetbrains.com/help/idea/new-ui.html

[badrequest]

When Goland launched it wasn't that much different from IntelliJ IDEA with the Go plugin. In the intervening years it has come to feel like a significantly better product than that combination.

[anuraaga]

This is why I am happy to see RustRover - it's very likely the significantly better product is actually similar for the Go plugin. Once they release an IDE, it seems development picks up and things get a lot better quicker.

I have used clion with rust plugin and while it's better than nothing, it's generally been pretty spotty on all the features, completion, marking errors, refactoring. I'm looking forward to RustRover "pulling a GoLand" by bringing a proper IDE experience to rust.

[bsdnoob]

I'm curious to hear what really is the difference between GoLand and IDEA Ultimate with go plugin other than flashy startup banner.

[doctorpangloss]

> new UI project

It’s incredible to me how many people choose VS Code because of its aesthetics, so it is by all means the right thing to focus on.

[raincole]

> It’s incredible to me how many people choose VS Code because of its aesthetics

No. VS code is popular because it's

1. Free and open source

2. Come with a lot of official extension [1]

3. Backed by MS which has the incentive to commondize code editors

It's quite similar to Chrome.

[1]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/publishers/Microsoft

[pxc]

That's really interesting. What makes VSCode's aesthetic so distinctive and appealing? As an infrequent user of it, I don't really see how it stands out. (The main things that stand out about it to me as an Emacs user is that it has pop-ups/nags/splash tabs that I have to dismiss whenever I open it.)

[bowsamic]

Yep I only recently started to using CLion bc I find the new UI to be much more comfortable

[kuhsaft]

> They are focusing on things most don't care

Different product teams work on different plugins/IDEs. Though, it's apparent that the more popular languages (Python/Java/JS/.NET/Go) get more enhancements. Makes sense for Jetbrains though because those languages provide them more revenue with a larger user base.

> Spaces, new UI project

Jetbrains Spaces is Jetbrains branching out into SaaS. The new UI work has been going on since as long as I remember. They're always tweaking the UI, but that's the norm in the industry.

[dinckelman]

That's pretty much how it's always been. If you want a Jetbrains IDE, IDEA Ultimate is the best choice, because it offers all of the exact same features. The only issue is that, let's say, if you're developing in Python, it will still give you a Javascript-centered UI, and it's really frustrating

[jpgvm]

I think you mean Java-centered UI. The Javascript IDE is WebStorm not IDEA Ultimate.

[madeofpalk]

On the other other hand, I switched from Visual Studio to Rider and it's embarrasing just how much better Rider is as a .net/C# IDE than the first party IDE. They're already so far ahead of Microsoft that "super slow" still has them doing laps about them.

[isanjay]

As someone who uses Visual Studio in day job and Rider on Linux at night I agree

[phendrenad2]

JetBrains IDEs _usually_ do start off that way, CLion itself started off looking like the existing C++ plugin for IntelliJ.

[mdaniel]

You are misremembering, unless you happen to have a link to the marketplace for any such alleged C++ plugin

[dncornholio]

> Notoriously slow to develop their IDE

Slow means stable. I don't understand how people rate software on this. Lot's of updates to a product means to me that the product is faulty.

[gilcot]

People aren't seeking for stability but for constant eye catching buzz.

[pkulak]

Neovim plus the Rust treesitter thing is really good. Intellij has work to do before they are worth paying for. Which is great! I love competition. Kotlin is probably my favorite language to program in, but I hate how it locks you in to a single IDE.

[hobofan]

IMHO Clion with Rust plugin is already the best Rust IDE available and I gladly pay for it.

[p0w3n3d]

for me CLion was the revelation, and really I couldn't deliver my project if I didn't obtain it (sadly from my pocket, due to some strange software request process). It both sped up and improved my work, delivering thorough analysis of code through the lint.

However they already told in plain text that the Rust plugin will be stopped at this point of time, so this is another quite expensive (for me) tool to buy if you'd like to develop home projects or learn at home

[lostmsu]

Hopefully separate paid IDE will mean better quality integration. I for one just need trait calls, in particular Debug trait, in debugger expression evaluation and they can have my money.

[reaperman]

The only thing I think I’d even want changed with PyCharm is better Copilot integration and time-travel debugging. Other than that I’d actually prefer that it doesnt change.