[apersona]

I'm sorry, but I am really baffled by what I'm reading.

> Like I ranted recently here in HN, can we stop with the millionth LISP interpreter already?

Except, the millionth LISP interpreter is a hobby project, that people are making on their own time, not during work? I get it's annoying to see something you've seen before, but you know, you can ignore it.

Play is an important part in learning. The millionth LISP interpreter, game engine, whatever is fine. From my experience, the people building these things gain a lot more valuable experience than just doing college or even just having a prior job.

> We have people dying in hospitals because the software of the heart monitor glitched or misread a sensor. Can we get on those problems instead?

Do you have any idea how current problems actually get decided for in industry (not only software, but in general)? It's not "this problem gets tackled because it's cool", it's because of money. Do you think bright software engineers love working on Microsoft Word or better AdSense because they think it's fun?

Also, this sounds really stupid to say, but this seems to be what you're implying when you say "keep play out of work": do you really think the same people working on embedded systems for heart monitors are the ones writing LISP interpreters...somehow...at work?

There's also something that plagues HN and it's that they think the software industry is somehow uniform. Medical devices get regulated under the medical devices industry, commercial airplanes get regulated under the aviation industry. The pure software industry is not the only place that hires software engineers.

[pdimitar]

Let me answer your both comments.

> Except, the millionth LISP interpreter is a hobby project, that people are making on their own time, not during work?

You are likely correct though I still have my doubts, I've encountered pretty privileged individuals around here, commanding $250k - $400k a year with practically zero supervision. So I do wonder still.

> Play is an important part in learning. The millionth LISP interpreter, game engine, whatever is fine. From my experience, the people building these things gain a lot more valuable experience than just doing college or even just having a prior job.

True, I am simply jaded that everyone is always "learning" and I don't see much progress in almost any area in programming. We still tip-toe around outdated concepts and implementation that people are too afraid to touch and start revising. It has gotten infuriating as I get older and older.

> It's not "this problem gets tackled because it's cool", it's because of money.

Oh I know, believe me, and here I am not faulting the programmers, I am faulting the completely broken system that is so detached from the problems that this race needs solved that they might as well live in an adjacent solar system...

> Do you think bright software engineers love working on Microsoft Word or better AdSense because they think it's fun?

You haven't seen the long diatribes of people working there who build a mental labyrinth and go out of the other side triumphantly claiming that they are doing good for the world. I wish I could forget seeing these comments, that day my faith in humanity has plummeted, like a lot.

So yes some of them not only see it as fun but also as a good thing to do.

History will judge them but sadly they won't be alive at that time.

> Also, this sounds really stupid to say, but this seems to be what you're implying when you say "keep play out of work": do you really think the same people working on embedded systems for heart monitors are the ones writing LISP interpreters...somehow...at work?

See above. I am sure some do.

> There's also something that plagues HN and it's that they think the software industry is somehow uniform.

I hear you, it's a common defect in human thinking when we get frustrated and I am not an exception, sadly. I am mostly commenting on the usual state of affairs and the most visible parts. Otherwise you are right and I agree with you.

--

All in all, my comment upthread was borne out of long-bottled frustration. I can't see almost any progress in almost any software venue, people are too happy to keep tinkering in their own miniature corner and then emerge on some forum and claim superiority (reference: KDE vs. GNOME forum threads, one of the ugliest human discourse I've ever seen), and in the meantime the entire computing industry is sitting on ancient implementations that only get drivers added (like the Linux kernel; an amazing project that I feel is a shining light of the free software movement... but to this day security is not their priority).

I can go on and on. But the TL;DR is: I really hoped we as a collective area will have more balls. Seems like we're just tame nerds that only do what they're told.

Shame. That's breaking my heart. Hence the frustration.